Bible Study Thread: Luke

[Redbaron]

*Warning* The following may not be suitable for all readers. Graphic content involved.

I remember hearing the anecdote where one fine Sunday morning, the pastor, reading this passage from the KJV, misread it as the Pharisee "Played thus with himself." Some of the congregation tittered in amusement; most gasped in horror. But if one can overlook a crudity or two, it's an interesting idea.
The tax collector somehow in his humble prayer found a connection, a communion with God, that changed his day, and changed his life. What he did that day created, or enhanced a relationship with God.
In a sense, the Pharisee was just getting off his spiritual rocks.

Maybe it's a bit graphic, but it seems like a vivid image of what was going on there.

*The squeamish may open their eyes now* Sorry for any offence that may have been committed.

 

[paradox3]

Reflection: Luke 18: 9 - 14

Here is a call to repentance if ever there was one.

How do you view repentance?

What place do you see for prayers of confession in a life of faith? My current congregation does not have a regular one in its worship service. Years ago I attended a church which included one every week. It always began, "Oh God you have called us to make confession of our sins that we might receive your forgiveness."

Now we have a prayer of confession on Good Friday which seems apt.

The text also serves as a caution against trusting in our own righteousness and holding others in contempt.

 

[paradox3]

@Redbaron This is a true story.

I once heard a preacher stumble over the word "resurrection". It came out ______________ (use your imagination for a word which rhymes).

It kind of makes me wonder if this has ever happened to anyone else.

Back to Luke's gospel now . . .

 

[paradox3]

The Pharisees thought they were first and the Gentiles were last but the first refused to believe in who Jesus was so they rejected Him and became last ---and the last accepted Him so they took over the first -----

You seem to interpret many of the parables as stories about Jews and gentiles. Please keep in mind there have been concerns expressed about antisemitism in some of your remarks.

 

[Waterfall]

BetteTheRed ------your quote ----My question is, where does the bad judge as unbeliever fit into this story?

unsafe says ----BetteTheRed all scripture points to the Spiritual -----not the physical ------there is a spiritual message in all scripture ----that is why Jesus spoke in parables to see who's heart was open to receive the Spiritual message He was conveying in the parable -----

And the parable tells you that this judge was unjust ---Verse 4 tells us that he is an unbeliever -------For a while the judge refused to do anything. But then he thought, ‘This widow really annoys me. Although I don’t fear God or respect people

It was the Widow's Persistence that got him annoyed to answer her call ---this judge is far from God -----actually the judge was ruled by Satan the god of this world ------as all unbelievers are ------

Why would the widow seek answers and solutions from a judge that is ruled by Satan .....according to your reasoning?

 

[unsafe]

Todays Scripture ----

Luke 18:9-14 GW

A Pharisee and a Tax Collector
9 Jesus also used this illustration with some who were sure that God approved of them while they looked down on everyone else. 10 He said, “Two men went into the temple courtyard to pray. One was a Pharisee, and the other was a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood up and prayed, ‘God, I thank you that I’m not like other people! I’m not a robber or a dishonest person. I haven’t committed adultery. I’m not even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week, and I give you a tenth of my entire income.’

13 “But the tax collector was standing at a distance. He wouldn’t even look up to heaven. Instead, he became very upset, and he said, ‘God, be merciful to me, a sinner!’

14 “I can guarantee that this tax collector went home with God’s approval, but the Pharisee didn’t. Everyone who honors himself will be humbled, but the person who humbles himself will be honored.”


unsafe says ---This parable is all about self righteousness and humility


The Pharisee we see is quick to says he has done all the right things and that he is not like others who are robbers or are dishonest ----then he brags about what he has not done and what he has done ------- he says this ----I haven’t committed adultery. I’m not even like this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week, and I give you a tenth of my entire income.’

unsafe says WOW -----here is the thing -----will this get him points with God ---will this save his sorry BUTt when he dies and goes to bow down in front of God ---- a big fat NO -----good works never saved anyone from Genesis to Revelations -----Right Faith in God by His Grace saves ----Grace comes through Faith in Jesus Christ -----The Pharisee got it all wrong as he thought because God picked the Jewish nation to be His chosen in the beginning that he was very safe and was first to be in God's Graces -----boy was he wrong ------he was arrogant and had twisted thinking about the Spiritual end of things ------he was to proud to know about humility ----but when he dies he will certainly be humbled his pride will be the end of his eternal life -----So this Pharisee thought he was first but in the end became the last ------the Pharisee was climbing up the latter in his pride ------


unsafe says ----
The Tax collector on the other hand recognized he was a Sinner and prayed to God as he knew what he was doing was no righteous ------He understood what humility was all about ------He felt ashamed at what he was doing and couldn't even look up to heaven --He prayed to God to have Mercy on him ------this fellow recognized he needed a Saviour to save his Butt in the end -----So the tax collector who was last on the list became the first to be in God's Graces -----The tax collector climbed down the latter and showed God respect and humbled himself to speak his truth on the fact that he was a sinner and needed God in the end to have eternal life ------


Big lesson here in this parable -----Many should take Heed to it ------Many today are calling themselves Christians but God is far from their hearts ---their lips tell the real story -----

We can fool other Human beings by using this Tile Christian but no one can fool God -----so all can call themselves God fearing but in their end God will set them straight -----so they are only fooling themselves ----the real truth will get them in their end ------and Jesus makes this clear in His last line of this parable -------

Jesus speaking here ----
14 “I can guarantee that this tax collector went home with God’s approval, but the Pharisee didn’t. Everyone who honors himself will be humbled, but the person who humbles himself will be honored.”

unsafe says ------ Great saying here -----

 

[unsafe]

paradox3 -----your quote -----You seem to interpret many of the parables as stories about Jews and gentiles. Please keep in mind there have been concerns expressed about antisemitism in some of your remarks.

an·ti-Sem·i·tism
/ˌan(t)ēˈseməˌtizəm,ˌanˌtīˈseməˌtizəm/
noun
noun: antisemitism

1. hostility to or prejudice against Jews.
   

paradox3 ------I personally have nothing against the Jews I respect the Jews they were the branches of the vine until God decided they were not recognizing His Son as their Messiah ---if it wasn't for the Jews the Gentiles would not have been invited to come to God's table and be saved ----- and stop saying I do-have something against the Jews that is just ridiculous --------- the whole Bible is about the Jewish nation as God's first chosen people ---if you or others have a Problem with that then that is your problem ----and like I said If I am ever band from a thread --it will be for telling the TRUTH -----AND that will just show how much people hate the truth being shared ------

The Jews are to be respected for the Gentiles being Grafted into God's fold -----and that is the truth -----so Stop threating me and bulling me into what you want me to post ----If you want to band me for speaking Scripture then that is your choice ------but I will keep speaking Scripture which has everything to do the Jews and Gentiles right from Genesis to Revelations ------

 

[unsafe]

Jesus is saying this not me ------this is the end of todays scripture ------

Jesus speaking here ----not me there oparadox3

14 “I can guarantee that this tax collector went home with God’s approval, but the Pharisee didn’t. Everyone who honors himself will be humbled, but the person who humbles himself will be honored.”

 

[paradox3]

so Stop threating me and bulling me into what you want me to post ----If you want to band me for speaking Scripture then that is your choice ------but I will keep speaking Scripture which has everything to do the Jews and Gentiles right from Genesis to Revelations ------

I am neither threatening you nor bullying you. Nor am I seeking a thread ban which I have stated more than once already.

I am cautioning you that concerns have been raised about antisemitism in some of your posts. If action is taken of any kind, it will be a decision made by the moderators, not by me.

You can speak Scripture all you like. You have complied with my request to identify any text you bring into the conversation which I appreciate. I think you would contribute more constructively by sticking to the texts from Luke as we study them, but that's just my opinion.

 

[unsafe]

and if any one is interested in the real truth about why the Pharisees would not except Jesus as their Messiah it is because God Himself actually hardened the hearts of the Pharisees so they wouldn't except Jesus ---God had a Plan to include all people into His Salvation package and If the Pharisees had of accepted Jesus as their Lord and Saviour Jesus never would have been crucified -----it was all in God's plan from the foundation of the earth ---- read Romans 11 it is all there -----

 

[unsafe]

Go ahead ----and seek your band -----I leave it with God ------

 

[Waterfall]

I wonder why scripture "labels" some by their religious beliefs such as the Pharisee in this story and the other is a tax collector with no name or unrecognized as being a part of any particular religious practices? He is just a tax collector who humbles himself before God.

 

[paradox3]

Go ahead ----and seek your band -----I leave it with God ------

Your mind is made up, it seems. As you see it, someone wants you banned from this thread . . . I am not sure who this might be because it is not the topic starter/ host of the thread.

 

[paradox3]

I wonder why scripture "labels" some by their religious beliefs such as the Pharisee in this story and the other is a tax collector with no name or unrecognized as being a part of any particular religious practices? He is just a tax collector who humbles himself before God.

Part of turning expectations upside down, I think. The Pharisees were respected religious leaders and the tax collectors were both lowly in society and dishonest practitioners.

As I think about the parable, it seems not to be about the righteousness of the Pharisee. I think his contempt for others might have been more the issue. He was arrogant, yes, but the parable does not speak about any other sins.

 

[paradox3]

and if any one is interested in the real truth about why the Pharisees would not except Jesus as their Messiah it is because God Himself actually hardened the hearts of the Pharisees so they wouldn't except Jesus ---God had a Plan to include all people into His Salvation package and If the Pharisees had of accepted Jesus as their Lord and Saviour Jesus never would have been crucified -----it was all in God's plan from the foundation of the earth ---- read Romans 11 it is all there -----

Not seeing how this helps our understanding of today's gospel lesson.

The whole question of Paul's ministry and how he influenced the development of the early church is something we could talk about in another thread some time. It's pretty interesting.

I would like to look at the gospels without using the lens of the epistles, if possible.

I understand how you see the bible as one narrative, however. I think it is a major difference in how liberal Christians and more conservative ones view scripture.

 

[unsafe]

paradox3 ----your quote ------Your mind is made up, it seems. As you see it, someone wants you banned from this thread

unsafe says
Sorry I misread your statement ---I apologize for the miss read on my part ------Did not see the----- Nor in your statement -----

This is your quote -------I am neither threatening you nor bullying you. Nor am I seeking a thread ban which I have stated more than once already.

Your Quote -----I am cautioning you that concerns have been raised about I am cautioning you that concerns have been raised about antisemitism in some of your posts. If action is taken of any kind, it will be a decision made by the moderators, not by me. in some of your posts. If action is taken of any kind, it will be a decision made by the moderators, not by me.

unsafe says
There is no anti-Semitism in my posts ---I have respect for the Jews ----but the Scripture is God's words not mine ----in order to explain the spiritual side of what the scripture is conveying which is all about the hardened hearts of the Pharisees to get who Jesus was ----I have to mention them -----but I have nothing against the Jews at all in todays world or in the Bible -I want to make that very clear ---------


Now back to Luke ------

 

[Carolla]

I wonder if use of "Pharisee" is an expression of religiousity - or more a sense that they are people displaying themselves as being so much better than others - applying 'the law' of the day in ways that exceeded the actual law, and anticipating that might gain them admiration - perhaps of others and of God - self-aggrandizing and in doing so exhibiting contempt for those who differ from them in their practices. Could have been a bricklayer or shepherd doing the same? But Pharisee was perhaps a quick reference due to well-recognized public behaviours of these folks?

 

[unsafe]

This is the Greek word for Pharisees -----

Strong's Concordance
Pharisaios: a Pharisee, member of a Jewish religious sect
Original Word: Φαρισαῖος, ου, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: Pharisaios
Phonetic Spelling: (far-is-ah'-yos)
Definition: a Pharisee, member of a Jewish religious sect
Usage: a Pharisee, one of the Jewish sect so called.

 

[blackbelt1961]

and if any one is interested in the real truth about why the Pharisees would not except Jesus as their Messiah it is because God Himself actually hardened the hearts of the Pharisees so they wouldn't except Jesus ---God had a Plan to include all people into His Salvation package and If the Pharisees had of accepted Jesus as their Lord and Saviour Jesus never would have been crucified -----it was all in God's plan from the foundation of the earth ---- read Romans 11 it is all there -----

Jesus was a Jew , pretty soon their Going to accuse Jesus of an·ti-Sem·i·tism in how He treated and called out the Pharasies

 

[blackbelt1961]

Phariseeism

1. Pharisaism also Phariseeism The doctrines and practices of the Pharisees.
2. Hypocritical observance of the letter of religious or moral law without regard for thespirit; sanctimoniousness.