Transgenderism ..... ask your questions!

[Northwind]

Depending on where they are in the process, a transgendered couple would have already had counselling. Even if they are not in a change process, to have come out as transgendered, they likely would have had plenty of counselling already. Why would they need counselling to attend your church @Pr. Jae? That seems pretty disrespectful to me.

 

[RitaTG]

If someone feels that their life would be better lived with no legs (BIID), would you support amputating their legs?

Pontifex ..... that sort of comment doesn't even warrant a polite reply.....
But that brings up a very good point about the insane comparisons that are used against trans persons.....
Always the most absurd, demeaning, hurtful, willfully false comparisons...
Why is that???? Why is there such a compulsion to hurt???? Why is there not such a compulsion to love ????
A statistical case could much easier be made linking being a minister to sexual deviancy and that would be just as wrong and hurtful .... needlessly so..... mean spirited.....
Before making such comments I would respectfully ask this. Do some basic honest fair minded research.
I have tried citing sources before and have almost always have had them labelled as biased and then ignored.
So .... if I and others like me are worth anything in God's eyes ...... please do your due diligence.
I invite you to read the entire contents of this thread.
If you have any questions you would like to ask .... if asked with respect and sincerity I shall do my best to answer.
The ball is in your court now ...... up to you what you do with it.
Regards
Rita

 

[RitaTG]

Rita, I feel you already know the answers to those questions.

I am not so willing to let you off the hook so easily Jae .....
I have been very open, complete, and candid.... I ask the same of you.....
Now .... what sort of counselling would your church propose/require?
And what is your position regarding that counselling? ... do you endorse it???
In plain definite language please ..... I do hope you can stand up for what you believe ...... I have.....

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

Nice deflect. I will take that to mean that people with BIID are somehow below transgendered?

 

[RitaTG]

then I will be plain Ponifex ,,,,,, you are below all of us......
Your mean spirited post and attitude shows what you are.......
Deflect that.....

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

If you want to convince me that you hold the truth, you should be able to address my concerns, I know you are confident that you are going to be able to legislate what I am allowed to believe. Confident you are going to do away with churches who don't comply. It is not them who are hating.

 

[RitaTG]

If you want to convince me that you hold the truth, you should be able to address my concerns, I know you are confident that you are going to be able to legislate what I am allowed to believe. Confident you are going to do away with churches who don't comply. It is not them who are hating.

What???????? ... are you serious?????????
Is this the sort of dementia that you are struggling with??????
I will let your words stand ...... let your own words illuminate your heart......

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

Your church needs to get ready Jae ...... all churches do...
It will come your way .... mark my words...

 

[RitaTG]

That is exactly what I said Pontifex ...... now how about going back and quoting the entire conversation for context?
Lets see if you can honestly follow a conversation and quote with context and fairness....
It would seem you have a problem with paranoia and are driven to take things to extremes......
I make this sincere offer ...... I would gladly do a presentation for your church.
In person if at all possible ... via the internet with conference software (free for your church as a client) if travel is too much.
Your church will indeed eventually have to face transgenderism ... yes indeed .....
The sincere offer is there .... up to you what you would do with it.

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

I noticed you used insane and dimentia as some kind of slanderous words against me. I have experience with insanity, dementia, Alzheimer's , suicide and attempted suicide,depression, etc. The difference between sane and not is less than the width of a hair.

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

You wouldn't be able to speak in my church.

 

[RitaTG]

Doesn't feel good to be talked about like that does it????
Keep that in mind when you speak with persons like me....
I have quite a breadth of experience too ..... so how about being respectful...
Lets start there ...... waiting.....

 

[RitaTG]

You wouldn't be able to speak in my church.

How open and loving .....
Please ... what church do you attend? ..... I will ask them directly..... thank you...

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

Sorry, I guess I have not made plain my thoughts on mental illness an don't have time to go over again now.

We are open and loving. I can only think of maybe two UCC preachers who could speak at our church. Your talk would have to be theologically sound. I have been here since beginning of the first WC and I haven't heard that yet. It would have to stand up to the scrutiny of scripture - not a couple of out of context verses, but the whole of scripture.

You would have to speak 5 times. Approaching 3000 people who take the bible seriously three years on Genesis. Over two on Matthew.

 

[RitaTG]

The name and address of the church please Pontifex .... I will ask them......

 

[crazyheart]

Well, this hasn't been a nice conversation, RitaTG and Pontifex.

 

[Northwind]

I fail to see the relevance of the BIID example, but I will play this game just in case there is relevance. So, if someone wanted to get their legs amputated, would they still be accepted into your congregation @Pontifex Geronimo 13? Would they still need counselling @Pr. Jae? Maybe there is a time someone would want this.....maybe they have pain that can only be relieved through this radical surgery. If Jesus were to want to speak at your church would he be allowed? He hung around with some "low-lifes" after all, and his theology was suspect in those days.....

 

[Jaebius]

I fail to see the relevance of the BIID example, but I will play this game just in case there is relevance. So, if someone wanted to get their legs amputated, would they still be accepted into your congregation @Pontifex Geronimo 13? Would they still need counselling @Pr. Jae? Maybe there is a time someone would want this.....maybe they have pain that can only be relieved through this radical surgery. If Jesus were to want to speak at your church would he be allowed? He hung around with some "low-lifes" after all, and his theology was suspect in those days.....

If someone just on a whim sincerely wanted to amputate their legs - I would advise that person to seek counseling, yes.

Jesus would be welcome to come and preach in our church. Where he might not be welcome to preach are in churches of denominations like the UCCanada, since he neither carries academic degrees nor is a certified lay leader.

 

[Mendalla]

If you want to convince me that you hold the truth, you should be able to address my concerns, I know you are confident that you are going to be able to legislate what I am allowed to believe. Confident you are going to do away with churches who don't comply. It is not them who are hating.

She never said anything about legislating beliefs. It can't be done. Even gay marriage had to have protection for freedom of religion. What she is saying, Pontifex, is that the presence of transgender folks in society is a reality that every organization, even ones that don't like them, will have to come to terms with because they are not going away. She can't legislate acceptance in your church or any other, but you can't legislate trans people back into the closet either. You won't encounter them (openly) in your church but you will in your life. The doctor who treats you in the ER, the clerk who rings up your grocery bill, hopefully someday your Member of Parliament. Trans people could be in any role you can imagine save being a member of your church. She does not have to legislate your acceptance because the day will come when your church will be isolated by its lack of acceptance.

 

[Northwind]

If someone just on a whim sincerely wanted to amputate their legs - I would advise that person to seek counseling, yes.

You haven't answered my question, or replied to my last post addressed to you. Would this person be welcome in your congregation? In my last post to you I commented on the amount of counselling the transgendered couple would have already had, and wondered what type of counselling you felt they would need.

Jesus would be welcome to come and preach in our church. Where he might not be welcome to preach are in churches of denominations like the UCCanada, since he neither carries academic degrees nor is a certified lay leader.

Really Jae?