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Ritafee said:
IYO ... should there be a fine for non-compliance?

GATINEAU, QC. -- People in Quebec who are not following public health guidelines—specifically, people who are not wearing a mask indoors—will now face harsh penalties.

New provincial measures came into effect Saturday that allow authorities to impose fines of up to $6,000 for non-compliance.

Quebec was the first province to mandate masks indoors and now it is the first to impose stiff penalties.

“We cannot accept that the few irresponsible people put all Quebec people at risk, it’s time to penalize them,” said Quebec Premier François Legault on Thursday, while announcing the new measures.

“I don’t have a problem with it at all, if it helps encourage people following the rules, just the way it is,” said one Gatineau resident who spoke to CTV News on Saturday.

The measure is in place across the province and applies to all indoor public places.

“It’s our responsibility right, for us, and of course in the social community, so I think it’s a good idea,” said Marie-France Roy, owner of Le Local, a clothing boutique in Gatineau.

Roy said getting patrons to wear a mask has not been an issue so far, but she said she’s happy the business isn't the only one responsible if rules aren’t being followed.

“They have it in their pocket, and they would come in, oh yeah, or my husband has it in the car, or I forgot it at home, but not anymore, definitely not anymore,” she said.

With the new measures in place, the Quebec government has asked police to increase their presence in certain indoor areas and is asking citizens to be vigilant about each other’s behaviour.

“There’s a lot of people who still don’t seem to get the implications of not wearing a mask, whether or not it affects them directly, it’s sort of up in the air at this point, but I think it’s certainly warranted,” a Gatineau resident told CTV News.

However, some remain sceptical about whether fines will have an impact.

“No, I don’t think it’ll work...I really don’t,” another Gatineau resident told CTV News
Click to expand...
No I don't agree with the harsh fines......a hand out on why they are important might help?
At the same time a think businesses have the right to refuse a person entrance if they have a sign on the door to wear one.
 
PilgrimsProgress said:
I note this has not been answered to date...........

As my dear old Nana used to say, "Some people just have an opposition complex - their sole purpose in life is to oppose".......
Click to expand...

I think we r all stressed...and we dont need or like unknowns...we prefer a known even if it is wrong or false...i think we here should stop wasting energy on attacking or being spiteful or going "you are advocating death for said group"

This is a test. The virus is a being. We can learn from it. Our mettle and humanity is being tested

Let us not devolve into divisive USA born identity politics. Let us use loving and compassionate and unitive identity politics rather. We are all human beings living for such a short time on this planet.

Do not give in to fear.
Learn aboot it. Be better.

And for those who have said "you are responsible for death", please. Those of us who were for the lockdown also are complicit for the suffering and deaths associated with that. There is no way right now that results in 0 suffering.

This virus is a test. We are all being tested. The old ways are up in the air. This is the time to go through and evaluate what is important. I mean really important. Besides complaining on forums lol

Which wont necessarily b what everyone else thinks.

It is difficult 2 b an authentic human being.

But worth it.

Kimmio Laughterlove said:
Back on topic, here is a report about cats and humans and covid/ cute cat video.

edmonton.ctvnews.ca

Edmonton: Local News, Weather & Traffic Updates

Watch the latest local news shaping the city of Edmonton, Alberta. Get top stories, exclusive interviews, and trusted in-depth analysis.
edmonton.ctvnews.ca edmonton.ctvnews.ca

(Aaaaw! Look at those cute little kitties!)
Click to expand...

NO NO NO!!! No innocents.

Not good.
(Again a data point that shews how truly bizarre this disease is...I wonder if someone has tested cat to person transmissi
Ritafee said:
No one mentions that the Chinese wear masks routinely – to protect themselves from pollution – but the masks made no difference to the spread of the coronavirus causing covid-19 in China. How much evidence do the mask wearers want before they will see the truth?
Click to expand...

Interesting...
Folks, can anyone here think up reasons why despite uber mask use people got infected in China?

#MutualAid
#BeNotAfraid
#SystemicWhimsey
#JoyPrivilege
 
Kimmio Laughterlove said:

On Canada’s slow response. However...I do get that they didn’t want people to panic. We’ve never been through anything like this in our lifetimes. I think Bonnie Henry has been handling it well - health authorities should follow her lead (though the numbers are going up, I think they will go down again when it gets cooler out. People stay home more anyway, when it’s cold and raining cats and dogs, and they travel less (Bette who drove across Canada a few years ago, and camped in the rain for days in the fall is a rare and brave exception. Summer travel this year helped the covid numbers go up. Though... cold and flu season... and indoor transmission...I don’t know. That might make matters worse actually.) Bonnie Henry got people to take it seriously without panicking. I don’t think she’s lied - she’s been honest yet calm, kind, and realistic.

But was Canada - including our officials - given the whole picture of what was known?
Click to expand...

"Panicing" right away wouldve been the right response. So countries who didnt "panic" and get things done r responsible for so much suffering.

(And that is contrary 2 my normal mode of existence... But I have learned when dealing with a pandemic...)

(I larned that from a Lebanese statician who summed it up "react as if it is the worst scenario possible")

Im so glad that we human beings decided 2 protect ourselves BEFORE our govts told us what 2 do

It didnt help that we had contradictory messages from CDC and WHO and VIP (like Dr Fauci and Surgeon General of USA) who were telling "dont use masks public"

#MutualAid
#BeNotAfraid
#SystemicWhimsey
#JoyPrivilege
 
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Inannawhimsey said:
Interesting...
Folks, can anyone here think up reasons why despite uber mask use people got infected in China?
Click to expand...
When masks were being used by a large majority, how much transmission was there really?
And where did that transmission occur?

Mask wearing also isn't going to eliminate transmission on it's on, it helps to reduce it.

With COVID-19 there are still many things were are learning.
I hope people will be open and honest about situations where we do see transmission, and in cases where it could be expected, but it doesn't happen. In isolation, information such as this doesn't give strong evidence - Starbucks cafe's COVID outbreak spared employees who wore masks - BNN Bloomberg
Collectively, it can.
 
Inannawhimsey said:
"Panicing" right away wouldve been the right response. So countries who didnt "panic" and get things done r responsible for so much suffering.

(And that is contrary 2 my normal mode of existence... But I have learned when dealing with a pandemic...)

(I larned that from a Lebanese statician who summed it up "react as if it is the worst scenario possible")

Im so glad that we human beings decided 2 protect ourselves BEFORE our govts told us what 2 do

It didnt help that we had contradictory messages from CDC and WHO and VIP (like Dr Fauci and Surgeon General of USA) who were telling "dont use masks public"

#MutualAid
#BeNotAfraid
#SystemicWhimsey
#JoyPrivilege
Click to expand...
It wasn’t the right response for BC. Especially not on Vancouver Island. We didn’t panic overall, people just got on the social distancing right away - and Island Health currently reports 12 active cases out of 195 total cases, and 5 deaths. Nobody is in the hospital with covid today. Out of 350K population. And we’re a tourist region on the Pacific Rim, across the pond from Vancouver and the Fraser Valley. With a large older senior population.

I think the crafters here embraced the mask opportunity.

If the cases of younger adults goes up and up, though - they’re going to tighten up the rules.
 
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PAN-IHC is a good route to bifurcation ... the separation of emotions from intellect ... so they can observe one another's faults and frontal flaws!

One the surface it may not be how the manna incarnates ... mysterious Eris? Could be sheer dissonance ... the dot Eire ... lion connections!
 
I don’t like the daily reporting of new cases. I find that to be fear mongering and more or less useless

Ie. Ontario with about 14 million people has 300 new cases. What does that mean! It would be better to give a daily total of cases and hospitalizations

then you could see that perhaps there are 2000 people with active Covid. 200 are in hospital and 5 are in icu And they all live in Toronto. As an example

i think that gives you a much better feel for how widespread the disease is and how dangerous it is for a particular person

in my area there is one new case. Ok. How many are isolating at home. How many in total are in the areas three of four hospitals.......

it is fall. We are back being more or less indoors. Cases will climb. The issue for me isn’t cases. It is are we handling them. Are the hospitals equipped. Do we have enough staff, beds...... are people still dying or are these younger people doing better. Do we now understand better how to treat this disease so it is less dangerous? Or are the people getting it now just healthier.
Canada sees approximate 4000 flu deaths annually, depending in the year. So we are well passed that with our poor handling of Covid. Primarily because no one seemed to decide to protect the elderly in nursing homes.

so we did poorly with Covid. And now we are seeing more cases daily. But what is the illness level, hospitalization level, mortality, ....... and the total number ill. That is what will tell us if we can keep on going.
 
BC started reporting the number of people in quarantine after coming in contact with a presumed case. I find that helpful for perspective. It also helps me when I see the numbers climb. If a couple thousand people are in quarantine, it stands to reason there could be over a hundred new cases in a day. Most of these are traceable and not random. Perspective helps. Still, I am taking precautions, within reason.
 
Inannawhimsey said:
It is difficult 2 b an authentic human being.

But worth it.
Click to expand...

It’s Alright, Ma (I’m Only Bleeding)
Bob Dylan


But though the masters make the rules
For the wise men and the fools
I got nothing, Ma, to live up to

[Verse 10]
For them that must obey authority
That they do not respect in any degree
Who despise their jobs, their destiny
Speak jealously of them that are free
Do what they do just to be
Nothing more than something they invest in

[Verse 11]
While some on principles baptized
To strict party platform ties
Social clubs in drag disguise
Outsiders they can freely criticize
Tell nothing except who to idolize
And say "God bless him"

[Verse 12]
While one who sings with his tongue on fire
Gargles in the rat race choir
Bent out of shape from society's pliers
Cares not to come up any higher
But rather get you down in the hole
That he's in

[Chorus]
But I mean no harm, nor put fault
On anyone that lives in a vault
But it's alright, Ma, if I can't please him

[Verse 13]
Old lady judges watch people in pairs
Limited in sex, they dare
To push fake morals, insult and stare
While money doesn't talk, it swears
Obscenity, who really cares
Propaganda, all is phony

[Verse 14]
While them that defend what they cannot see
With a killer's pride, security
It blows the minds most bitterly
For them that think death's honesty
Won't fall upon 'em naturally
Life sometimes must get lonely

[Verse 15]
My eyes collide head-on with stuffed
Graveyards, false goals, I scuff
At pettiness which plays so rough
Walk upside down inside handcuffs
Kick my legs to crash it off
Say, okay, I've had enough
What else can you show me?

[Chorus]
And if my thought-dreams could be seen
They'd probably put my head in a guillotine
But it's alright, Ma, it's life, and life only
 
Lastpointe said:
I don’t like the daily reporting of new cases. I find that to be fear mongering and more or less useless

Ie. Ontario with about 14 million people has 300 new cases. What does that mean! It would be better to give a daily total of cases and hospitalizations

then you could see that perhaps there are 2000 people with active Covid. 200 are in hospital and 5 are in icu And they all live in Toronto. As an example

i think that gives you a much better feel for how widespread the disease is and how dangerous it is for a particular person

in my area there is one new case. Ok. How many are isolating at home. How many in total are in the areas three of four hospitals.......

it is fall. We are back being more or less indoors. Cases will climb. The issue for me isn’t cases. It is are we handling them. Are the hospitals equipped. Do we have enough staff, beds...... are people still dying or are these younger people doing better. Do we now understand better how to treat this disease so it is less dangerous? Or are the people getting it now just healthier.
Canada sees approximate 4000 flu deaths annually, depending in the year. So we are well passed that with our poor handling of Covid. Primarily because no one seemed to decide to protect the elderly in nursing homes.

so we did poorly with Covid. And now we are seeing more cases daily. But what is the illness level, hospitalization level, mortality, ....... and the total number ill. That is what will tell us if we can keep on going.
Click to expand...
And those are all reported, all useful. People aren't hospitalized without having new cases.
 
Waterfall said:
Well its bad for business....unless they dont care about losing money.
Click to expand...
There are a lot of people that would prefer to shop where there is no mask mandate. What is bad for business is not being able to keep up with all the draconian measures so having to close down.
 
Ritafee said:
There are a lot of people that would prefer to shop where there is no mask mandate. What is bad for business is not being able to keep up with all the draconian measures so having to close down.
Click to expand...
Maybe some would but not most...Im sure hand sanitizer and cleaning wouldnt put a dent in their earnings as much as limiting their clientelle.
 
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