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Mendalla said:
Revera is owned by the federal public service pension plan, so lets not pretend its just fat-cat rich bastards here. That plan covers most of the federal public service, IIRC, so its basically owned by civil servants.

And if they are publicly traded, there's no one owner to call out, either.

And they are not immune from a court order, but no such order exists as far as I know. There are some lawsuits underway but it is generally the corporation that is being sued, not the owner.
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Do they not have a CEO then?
 
Waterfall said:
Do they not have a CEO then?
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Yes, they do. Who is likely not a fat cat rich guy but an honest, serious hard-working business school grad. Maybe even a nurse or doc who jumped to administration. I don't envy CEOs. I admire them, save for the few bad eggs.

If he/she can be shown to be responsible, they should be held responsible, but that is first and foremost their board's job. If the board fails in their oversight role, then the law can come into play. And the board should be held accountable legally, of course.
 
Efficiency should cut things to the bare bones to avoid common waste! The skeleton lady rules ... thus people are removed from the system ...
 
Mendalla said:
Yes, they do. Who is likely not a fat cat rich guy but an honest, serious hard-working business school grad. Maybe even a nurse or doc who jumped to administration. I don't envy CEOs. I admire them, save for the few bad eggs.

If he/she can be shown to be responsible, they should be held responsible, but that is first and foremost their board's job. If the board fails in their oversight role, then the law can come into play. And the board should be held accountable legally, of course.
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It just seems this is a bad formula for running nursing homes when it's a for profit situation......otherwise you get an attitude from the the top down like, how much air can you put in a potato chip bag before someone will notice? or how vibrant do you have to make the cereal box look before anyone notices it's become smaller?
Needs have to be met, period.
 
I think if we look at all health care though it is always about saving money. Hospitals operate on a shoe string. And still take up so much of our provincial dollars. But long gone are the days of patients getting extras in hospitals. Corners have to be cut

I think in long term care an issue is the staff. Which is often part time, working several jobs, usually only trained to the level of a PSW. The home my mom was in had no RNs Now it was a seniors residence as opposed to a nursing home and rules vary

but her home had a locked wing for patients who wandered and definitely had patients in bed baths etc.

a PSW is a good concept but it is a minimal training role and it shows up in a crisis like this.
 
Waterfall said:
It just seems this is a bad formula for running nursing homes when it's a for profit situation......otherwise you get an attitude from the the top down like, how much air can you put in a potato chip bag before someone will notice? or how vibrant do you have to make the cereal box look before anyone notices it's become smaller?
Needs have to be met, period.
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I don't think "for profit" versus "non-profit" is the whole issue, though. It's who is at the top and how they seek to make their profit. My experience in home oxygen might illustrate a bit. There are three large O2 companies in Ontario, including the one I work for. Only one pursues client-centred care with the goal of being profitable by growing market share through delivering quality care. That's the one I work for. The other two focus on delivering oxygen, not on care. The difference? We are a family-owned corporation, part of a larger group that's been operating in London for something like 90 years. And that family has made it clear that while profit matters, sacrificing care for profit isn't going to happen. The competitors are owned by large, multinational industrial gas companies who clearly have their eye on shareholder value, not patient care.

I am a longtime advocate for public medicare but after 21 years in this position, I am also of the mindset that any well-run, properly focussed organization can deliver that care, profit or non. I would trust my family to my company's care. I can't say that for some non-profits I've crossed paths with over the years. (BTW, if I was looking for longterm care right now, there's one for profit in particular I would probably look at closely. They are partners of ours and have a similar outlook. And they have weathered the Covid storm very well, with only one of their homes currently in a declared outbreak.)

Now, if a for profit healthcare company puts profit ahead of care and that results in the kind of crap we are seeing, by all means take them down. But don't blame all for profit companies for the sins of the bad operators.
 
Mendalla said:
I don't think "for profit" versus "non-profit" is the whole issue, though. It's who is at the top and how they seek to make their profit. My experience in home oxygen might illustrate a bit. There are three large O2 companies in Ontario, including the one I work for. Only one pursues client-centred care with the goal of being profitable by growing market share through delivering quality care. That's the one I work for. The other two focus on delivering oxygen, not on care. The difference? We are a family-owned corporation, part of a larger group that's been operating in London for something like 90 years. And that family has made it clear that while profit matters, sacrificing care for profit isn't going to happen. The competitors are owned by large, multinational industrial gas companies who clearly have their eye on shareholder value, not patient care.

I am a longtime advocate for public medicare but after 21 years in this position, I am also of the mindset that any well-run, properly focussed organization can deliver that care, profit or non. I would trust my family to my company's care. I can't say that for some non-profits I've crossed paths with over the years. (BTW, if I was looking for longterm care right now, there's one for profit in particular I would probably look at closely. They are partners of ours and have a similar outlook. And they have weathered the Covid storm very well, with only one of their homes currently in a declared outbreak.)

Now, if a for profit healthcare company puts profit ahead of care and that results in the kind of crap we are seeing, by all means take them down. But don't blame all for profit companies for the sins of the bad operators.
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Okay, some good examples....point taken. Just remember what I see and what a "walk in" sees are two different things.
 
Waterfall said:
Okay, some good examples....point taken. Just remember what I see and what a "walk in" sees are two different things.
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And it is part of our job to make sure that every "walk in" sees us walking the walk, not just talking the talk. Even in IT, which is invisible to the public, we work to maintain quality and, most important from a patient standpoint, security of our systems.
 
Lastpointe said:
Yes. I can only imagine that perhaos he is frightened. His wife is a nurse. I find the whole thing puzzling. It we cancelled golf this weekend. I mean he could be an asymptomatic speader. Hubby’s doc wants to wait too but I am tired of the waiting game
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Lastpointe - thinking it must be so stressful for you & your family to be waiting. I'm guessing some of the 'wait time' might be because of incubation period - if tested "too soon" perhaps a neg result would provide reassurance but ultimately be inaccurate in some cases where the virus has not yet fully taken hold. Hoping that the lower risk of transfer of virus outdoors & with social distancing will work in your family's favour.
 
This is beyond disappointing. People are extremely angry... we were on our way to further openings, now this.....sigh.
Hopefully other provinces will take it as a warning.

www.theglobeandmail.com

New Brunswick delays reopening amid cluster of new coronavirus cases linked to doctor

Eight people have tested positive for COVID-19 so far and services are being forced to close their doors, halting the planned reopening of the province
www.theglobeandmail.com www.theglobeandmail.com
 
ninjafaery said:
This is beyond disappointing. People are extremely angry... we were on our way to further openings, now this.....sigh.
Hopefully other provinces will take it as a warning.
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All because of a doctor not behaving responsibly. I hope others are taking notes.
 
It seems an incredibly odd story though. Now that we know this was a doctor. He went to Quebec for not yet dis loser reasons. Returns and despite being on the forefront of the pandemic response ignores the rules. Puzzling. Would love to know what he was doing in Quebec
 
Mendalla said:
Kind of weird to think of using statins and ACE inhibitors for a virus, eh.
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I read the same thing a while ago. It's throwing me as ACE inhibitors increase bradykinin. Firazyr is also being studied on this virus, a bradykinin inhibitor. I'm not really sure what this means for those of us with HAE and how to handle acute illnesses. Last update I got on the HAE side of things was that firazyr might be better than berinert if we have COVID-19 and have attacks.
 
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