Should Unbelievers Say the Apostle's Creed And The Nicene Creed In Their Worship Services ?

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When one gets right into studying religion ... does some other items pop up that we were never told about in regard to the great unknown?

Thus a lot of room in the spatial soul (mind) for mulling and chewing ...
 
GordW said:
However the use of creeds as a dividing tool (or faith statements, thinking of an experience with local ministerials) has been to enforce a level of doctrinal uniformity/purity that does not allow for variation in interpretation and understanding. In other words "if you don't agree with all of this you are obviously a heretic and hopelessly lost". For example, the faith statement on IVCF when I was in university that called for adherence to the so called fundamentals of faith (from which Christian fundamentalism took its name) even though those were not (and never have been) tenets held by the entire church. Only the right kind of Christians were supposed to be there (or really in leadership since that was who had to sign the statement) apparently.

The positive use of Creeds or creed-like statement said in community is that they build the community together. The negative side is that they are a way to cast people out.

Or at least if they did we don't have a record of it. AFter all the church has never been a united body, there have always been differences of opinion on pretty much everything from how to understand/interpret/use SCripture to the nature of Christ and what we now call the Trinity.
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That's a fair observation, Gord.

That said, On the central point, the question, WHO'S JESUS?, there was remarkable continuity.

For me, Paul's explaining the significance of Jesus' life, death, and RESURRECTION under the Holy Spirit's guidance.

Yes, diversity of opinion's always been with us. That shows how important it is to keep measuring our interpretations against the apostolic witness preserved in Scripture
 
Read all for yourselves if interested just posting this part

Pope Issues Apostolic Letter on Creed​


“The Nicene Creed does not depict a distant, inaccessible and immovable God who rests in himself, but a God who is close to us and accompanies us on our journey in the world, even in the darkest places on earth,” Pope Leo wrote.

Reciting the Creed, he said, should prompt Christians to “examine our conscience.”

The questions they should ask, he wrote, include:

“What does God mean to me and how do I bear witness to my faith in him?

Is the one and only God truly the Lord of my life, or do I have idols that I place before God and his commandments?

Is God for me the living God, close to me in every situation, the Father to whom I turn with filial trust?”

And, he continued with more questions:

“Is he the Creator to whom I owe everything I am and have, whose mark I can find in every creature?

Am I willing to share the goods of the earth, which belong to everyone, in a just and equitable manner?

How do I treat creation, the work of his hands?

Do I exploit and destroy it, or do I use it with reverence and gratitude, caring for and cultivating it as the common home of humanity?”

Believing that God became human in Jesus means “that we now encounter the Lord in our brothers and sisters in need,” the pope said. That is why Jesus said, “As you did it to one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did it to me.”

The Creed “does not formulate a philosophical theory,” Pope Leo wrote.

“It professes faith in the God who redeemed us through Jesus Christ. It is about the living God who wants us to have life and to have it in abundance.”

I say --so if your not Redeemed through Jesus Christ then all your doing is saying empty words by saying these Creeds ---
 
Jaebius said:
That's a fair observation, Gord.

That said, On the central point, the question, WHO'S JESUS?, there was remarkable continuity.

For me, Paul's explaining the significance of Jesus' life, death, and RESURRECTION under the Holy Spirit's guidance.

Yes, diversity of opinion's always been with us. That shows how important it is to keep measuring our interpretations against the apostolic witness preserved in Scripture
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A Pal Lingue ...
 
The POPE ... Reciting the Creed, he said, should prompt Christians to “examine our conscience.”

Imagine a Christian with a conscience and some conspicuousness when essentially they are directed on blind faith ... seems a counterintuitive loss of awareness ... once meaning "with vision" or "up against that vision" ... when told to be blind! Attached to the Ide (identification) is ego that in an older age meant cognizant ... but something changed it over time to mean to vacate the mind, or "you don't want to know."

History of linguistic is like that ... and thus we lose understanding in the long run in a place of emotions ... down to earth?

If with sight would that challenge what they were previously told?

Imagine if you were told something and vision indicated something different that the Gods revealed by command!

Isn't that diabolical as a dervish in the airs ... and down comes what went up ... entertaining as waves in the desert? Arid vibrations over burj ... Arabic! Dicey right ...

Recall that these are "just words" OK they alter as time deforms them ...
 
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Luce NDs said:
A Pal Lingue ...
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Interesting phrase, Luce. It makes me think how limited our words are. Our deepest need's God's grace reaching us despite our confusion and shortcomings.

God's truth remains steady even when our words fall short
 
unsafe said:
Read all for yourselves if interested just posting this part

Pope Issues Apostolic Letter on Creed​


“The Nicene Creed does not depict a distant, inaccessible and immovable God who rests in himself, but a God who is close to us and accompanies us on our journey in the world, even in the darkest places on earth,” Pope Leo wrote.

Reciting the Creed, he said, should prompt Christians to “examine our conscience.”

The questions they should ask, he wrote, include:

“What does God mean to me and how do I bear witness to my faith in him?

Is the one and only God truly the Lord of my life, or do I have idols that I place before God and his commandments?

Is God for me the living God, close to me in every situation, the Father to whom I turn with filial trust?”

And, he continued with more questions:

“Is he the Creator to whom I owe everything I am and have, whose mark I can find in every creature?

Am I willing to share the goods of the earth, which belong to everyone, in a just and equitable manner?

How do I treat creation, the work of his hands?

Do I exploit and destroy it, or do I use it with reverence and gratitude, caring for and cultivating it as the common home of humanity?”

Believing that God became human in Jesus means “that we now encounter the Lord in our brothers and sisters in need,” the pope said. That is why Jesus said, “As you did it to one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did it to me.”

The Creed “does not formulate a philosophical theory,” Pope Leo wrote.

“It professes faith in the God who redeemed us through Jesus Christ. It is about the living God who wants us to have life and to have it in abundance.”

I say --so if your not Redeemed through Jesus Christ then all your doing is saying empty words by saying these Creeds ---
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Unsafe, are you Catholic now?
 
Jaebius said:
Interesting phrase, Luce. It makes me think how limited our words are. Our deepest need's God's grace reaching us despite our confusion and shortcomings.

God's truth remains steady even when our words fall short
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I do believe you are skimming ... the older archaic texts! They are poorly understood because of what Roman, French, German, Scandinavian and English spin have done to the standing wave ... imagine popes and fathers there counter to ma mere ... source of auld salts? Godsoul likes to mess with his children to get them working ... a type of thought when you consider how its out there ...

Then some institutions cannot be taught to learn anything fresh and green ... in a hidden garden ...

The Latin word nihil literally means "nothing" or "not anything". Like a garden in the abstract that can't be touched as protected by psyche that difficult to approach ... existentially! Gwa ... get out wit yah ...

How deep do The-O logans get into the word pool? It is not literal but literary as a rare skill ... that can baffle the fixated on the other side of the absolute/abstract divide ... bridge of troubled waters ...
 
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Here is the Apostle's Creed with Scripture attached


www.biblegateway.com

Where Is the Apostles’ Creed Found in the Bible? - Bible Gateway Blog

Here is a list of Bible passages where each element of the Apostles’ Creed, the brief summary of the teachings of Jesus' followers, is found.
www.biblegateway.com www.biblegateway.com

August 8, 2022

Where Is the Apostles’ Creed Found in the Bible?​

Jonathan Petersen
 
unsafe said:
Here is the Apostle's Creed with Scripture attached


www.biblegateway.com

Where Is the Apostles’ Creed Found in the Bible? - Bible Gateway Blog

Here is a list of Bible passages where each element of the Apostles’ Creed, the brief summary of the teachings of Jesus' followers, is found.
www.biblegateway.com www.biblegateway.com
August 8, 2022

Where Is the Apostles’ Creed Found in the Bible?​

Jonathan Petersen
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Or one version of it, anyway. The one we said at my last church was slightly different
 
The one book rule declared by a corrupt English Royal screw up regarding his responsibility to his people ... kind 've spoiled as a trump card ...

Then passions without intelligence tend to do that ... and so no one thought ... like there's nothing to it! Learning material is more difficult ...
 
Jaebius said:
Unsafe, are you Catholic now?
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Why do you ask ??????---Do I have to be Catholic to post an Article by the Pope ----

I do agree with this statement they make in the Article ====

Reciting the Creed, he said, should prompt Christians to “examine our conscience.”


And I agree with the Questions Posted in the Article ----I think people should examine their True Character before saying words they don't believe in -----


So if you have a Problem with that -----well that is your problem ----not mine ------ :angel:



it is the Same with taking Communion -----

1 Corinthians 11 ---read the whole Chapter on your own -----

For whenever you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord's death until he comes.

27 Therefore, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord.

28 A man ought to examine himself before he eats of the bread and drinks of the cup.

29For anyone who eats and drinks without recognizing the body of the Lord eats and drinks judgment on himself.

30That is why many among you are weak and sick, and a number of you have fallen asleep.

31But if we judged ourselves, we would not come under judgment.
 
unsafe said:
Why do you ask ??????---Do I have to be Catholic to post an Article by the Pope ----

I do agree with this statement they make in the Article ====

Reciting the Creed, he said, should prompt Christians to “examine our conscience.”


And I agree with the Questions Posted in the Article ----I think people should examine their True Character before saying words they don't believe in -----


So if you have a Problem with that -----well that is your problem ----not mine ------ :angel:



it is the Same with taking Communion -----

1 Corinthians 11 ---read the whole Chapter on your own -----

For whenever you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord's death until he comes.

27 Therefore, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord.

28 A man ought to examine himself before he eats of the bread and drinks of the cup.

29For anyone who eats and drinks without recognizing the body of the Lord eats and drinks judgment on himself.

30That is why many among you are weak and sick, and a number of you have fallen asleep.

31But if we judged ourselves, we would not come under judgment.
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You, unsafe, have always seemed to me to be some kind of an evangelical. Your posting of Bob's words seems to me like you just grabbed and posted one of the first things you saw that supported your opinion on the Creeds
 
Jaebius said:
You, unsafe, have always seemed to me to be some kind of an evangelical. Your posting of Bob's words seems to me like you just grabbed and posted one of the first things you saw that supported your opinion on the Creeds
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What my post seemes to you matters not to me there Jaebius ----- :angel:

You only think you may seem to know what I might be ---but you really don't ------

I post what I want to post ----same as you do ------and that is that ------:D
 
GordW said:
WEll apart from the vast amount of support for Arianism. OR the NEstorian debate. or the filioque clause.
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Don't, Gord, minimize Arianism. Nestorianism! THE FILIOQUE DEBATE!

The reason those disputes mattered so much's because they touched Christ's identity and work and God's nature.

For believers, these shape how we worship. Pray! GRASP SALVATION!

What encourages me's that thru all the noise, political struggles and HUMAN WEAKNESSES, the church kept coming back to Christ. That's not surprising
 
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unsafe said:
What my post seemes to you matters not to me there Jaebius ----- :angel:

You only think you may seem to know what I might be ---but you really don't ------

I post what I want to post ----same as you do ------and that is that ------:D
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Fair enough, unsafe.

We all choose what we want to post, and people will take it how they take it. Let's focus on grasping each other. Better that than telling each other who we are
 
Jaebius said:
Fair enough, unsafe.

We all choose what we want to post, and people will take it how they take it. Let's focus on grasping each other. Better that than telling each other who we are
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Unless one mulls it over for what makes sense to God's populace and not just our individual desire ... then we start taking some responsibility for what else is God's ... logos and logic about all that is God ... not just a little spot within ...
 
Jaebius said:
That's a fair observation, Gord.

That said, On the central point, the question, WHO'S JESUS?, there was remarkable continuity.

For me, Paul's explaining the significance of Jesus' life, death, and RESURRECTION under the Holy Spirit's guidance.

Yes, diversity of opinion's always been with us. That shows how important it is to keep measuring our interpretations against the apostolic witness preserved in Scripture
Click to expand...
Paul was a Pharisee right? All Pharisees always believed in resurrection.... But not the Sadducees.
 
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