Should Unbelievers Say the Apostle's Creed And The Nicene Creed In Their Worship Services ?

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When one gets right into studying religion ... does some other items pop up that we were never told about in regard to the great unknown?

Thus a lot of room in the spatial soul (mind) for mulling and chewing ...
 
GordW said:
However the use of creeds as a dividing tool (or faith statements, thinking of an experience with local ministerials) has been to enforce a level of doctrinal uniformity/purity that does not allow for variation in interpretation and understanding. In other words "if you don't agree with all of this you are obviously a heretic and hopelessly lost". For example, the faith statement on IVCF when I was in university that called for adherence to the so called fundamentals of faith (from which Christian fundamentalism took its name) even though those were not (and never have been) tenets held by the entire church. Only the right kind of Christians were supposed to be there (or really in leadership since that was who had to sign the statement) apparently.

The positive use of Creeds or creed-like statement said in community is that they build the community together. The negative side is that they are a way to cast people out.

Or at least if they did we don't have a record of it. AFter all the church has never been a united body, there have always been differences of opinion on pretty much everything from how to understand/interpret/use SCripture to the nature of Christ and what we now call the Trinity.
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That's a fair observation, Gord.

That said, On the central point, the question, WHO'S JESUS?, there was remarkable continuity.

For me, Paul's explaining the significance of Jesus' life, death, and RESURRECTION under the Holy Spirit's guidance.

Yes, diversity of opinion's always been with us. That shows how important it is to keep measuring our interpretations against the apostolic witness preserved in Scripture
 
Read all for yourselves if interested just posting this part

Pope Issues Apostolic Letter on Creed​


“The Nicene Creed does not depict a distant, inaccessible and immovable God who rests in himself, but a God who is close to us and accompanies us on our journey in the world, even in the darkest places on earth,” Pope Leo wrote.

Reciting the Creed, he said, should prompt Christians to “examine our conscience.”

The questions they should ask, he wrote, include:

“What does God mean to me and how do I bear witness to my faith in him?

Is the one and only God truly the Lord of my life, or do I have idols that I place before God and his commandments?

Is God for me the living God, close to me in every situation, the Father to whom I turn with filial trust?”

And, he continued with more questions:

“Is he the Creator to whom I owe everything I am and have, whose mark I can find in every creature?

Am I willing to share the goods of the earth, which belong to everyone, in a just and equitable manner?

How do I treat creation, the work of his hands?

Do I exploit and destroy it, or do I use it with reverence and gratitude, caring for and cultivating it as the common home of humanity?”

Believing that God became human in Jesus means “that we now encounter the Lord in our brothers and sisters in need,” the pope said. That is why Jesus said, “As you did it to one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did it to me.”

The Creed “does not formulate a philosophical theory,” Pope Leo wrote.

“It professes faith in the God who redeemed us through Jesus Christ. It is about the living God who wants us to have life and to have it in abundance.”

I say --so if your not Redeemed through Jesus Christ then all your doing is saying empty words by saying these Creeds ---
 
Jaebius said:
That's a fair observation, Gord.

That said, On the central point, the question, WHO'S JESUS?, there was remarkable continuity.

For me, Paul's explaining the significance of Jesus' life, death, and RESURRECTION under the Holy Spirit's guidance.

Yes, diversity of opinion's always been with us. That shows how important it is to keep measuring our interpretations against the apostolic witness preserved in Scripture
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A Pal Lingue ...
 
The POPE ... Reciting the Creed, he said, should prompt Christians to “examine our conscience.”

Imagine a Christian with a conscience and some conspicuousness when essentially they are directed on blind faith ... seems a counterintuitive loss of awareness ... once meaning "with vision" or "up against that vision" ... when told to be blind! Attached to the Ide (identification) is ego that in an older age meant cognizant ... but something changed it over time to mean to vacate the mind, or "you don't want to know."

History of linguistic is like that ... and thus we lose understanding in the long run in a place of emotions ... down to earth?

If with sight would that challenge what they were previously told?

Imagine if you were told something and vision indicated something different that the Gods revealed by command!

Isn't that diabolical as a dervish in the airs ... and down comes what went up ... entertaining as waves in the desert? Arid vibrations over burj ... Arabic! Dicey right ...

Recall that these are "just words" OK they alter as time deforms them ...
 
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Luce NDs said:
A Pal Lingue ...
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Interesting phrase, Luce. It makes me think how limited our words are. Our deepest need's God's grace reaching us despite our confusion and shortcomings.

God's truth remains steady even when our words fall short
 
unsafe said:
Read all for yourselves if interested just posting this part

Pope Issues Apostolic Letter on Creed​


“The Nicene Creed does not depict a distant, inaccessible and immovable God who rests in himself, but a God who is close to us and accompanies us on our journey in the world, even in the darkest places on earth,” Pope Leo wrote.

Reciting the Creed, he said, should prompt Christians to “examine our conscience.”

The questions they should ask, he wrote, include:

“What does God mean to me and how do I bear witness to my faith in him?

Is the one and only God truly the Lord of my life, or do I have idols that I place before God and his commandments?

Is God for me the living God, close to me in every situation, the Father to whom I turn with filial trust?”

And, he continued with more questions:

“Is he the Creator to whom I owe everything I am and have, whose mark I can find in every creature?

Am I willing to share the goods of the earth, which belong to everyone, in a just and equitable manner?

How do I treat creation, the work of his hands?

Do I exploit and destroy it, or do I use it with reverence and gratitude, caring for and cultivating it as the common home of humanity?”

Believing that God became human in Jesus means “that we now encounter the Lord in our brothers and sisters in need,” the pope said. That is why Jesus said, “As you did it to one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did it to me.”

The Creed “does not formulate a philosophical theory,” Pope Leo wrote.

“It professes faith in the God who redeemed us through Jesus Christ. It is about the living God who wants us to have life and to have it in abundance.”

I say --so if your not Redeemed through Jesus Christ then all your doing is saying empty words by saying these Creeds ---
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Unsafe, are you Catholic now?
 
Jaebius said:
Interesting phrase, Luce. It makes me think how limited our words are. Our deepest need's God's grace reaching us despite our confusion and shortcomings.

God's truth remains steady even when our words fall short
Click to expand...

I do believe you are skimming ... the older archaic texts! They are poorly understood because of what Roman, French, German, Scandinavian and English spin have done to the standing wave ... imagine popes and fathers there counter to ma mere ... source of auld salts? Godsoul likes to mess with his children to get them working ... a type of thought when you consider how its out there ...

Then some institutions cannot be taught to learn anything fresh and green ... in a hidden garden ...

The Latin word nihil literally means "nothing" or "not anything". Like a garden in the abstract that can't be touched as protected by psyche that difficult to approach ... existentially! Gwa ... get out wit yah ...

How deep do The-O logans get into the word pool? It is not literal but literary as a rare skill ... that can baffle the fixated on the other side of the absolute/abstract divide ... bridge of troubled waters ...
 
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