Bible Study Thread: Luke

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It's interesting that nowhere in the passage does Jesus condemn Martha. He simply says that Mary has made a better choice... on THIS occasion, in THESE circumstances, for THIS purpose. There will be other times when both sisters should appropriately be working; or times when both should listen, etc. To take this small snippet of Luke's gospel, and try to universalize what Jesus says here on THIS occasion, would be a mistake.

This lesson is, choose wisely, in the circumstances in which you find yourself. If Mary invited him, and knew he was coming, the coffee should have been ready, the roast ready to come out of the oven, table set, etc etc. so she could enjoy the visit.
 
Summary: Luke 11: 1 - 4

Jesus is praying in a certain place, and one of his disciples requests he teach them how to pray, as John taught his disciples.

Say this, he responds, and offers the well-known Lord's Prayer. Luke's version is shorter than Matthew's.
 
Just answering Redbaron's quote here ----- It's interesting that nowhere in the passage does Jesus condemn Martha

unsafe says ---this is Important to understand ----Jesus condemns no one ----we condemn ourselves by our own choices ---- Martha chose her position to make the Meal more important than Jesus ---- Mary made Jesus more Important than preparing food ----So it is with us ----God is to be first choice in our Lives not preparing food ---or doing housework ---Just saying

Now on to Luke 11 for me -----
 
unsafe said:
Just answering Redbaron's quote here ----- It's interesting that nowhere in the passage does Jesus condemn Martha

unsafe says ---this is Important to understand ----Jesus condemns no one ----we condemn ourselves by our own choices ---- Martha chose her position to make the Meal more important than Jesus ---- Mary made Jesus more Important than preparing food ----So it is with us ----God is to be first choice in our Lives not preparing food ---or doing housework ---Just saying

Now on to Luke 11 for me -----
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Amen
 
Reflection: Luke 11: 1 - 4

We usually refer to this as "the prayer that Jesus taught" in church. Sometimes we use one of the sung versions. VU 959 or 960.

Sometimes we use the Jim Cotter (New Zealand) version. VU 916

Until quite recently we recited it by rote every week in the service. Although I have had the prayer committed to memory for several decades, there is one section I find awkward to recite and I always stumble over the words. It usually feels like I can't get it out quickly enough.

Something I have just noticed now is that the prayer is written in the first person plural, i.e. give us each day our daily bread, etc.

Does this mean Jesus expected the disciples to pray together rather than in isolation?

I wonder how Jesus himself prayed. We are often told in scripture that Jesus has gone off to pray.

And why did Jesus even need to pray if He is God Incarnate? This has always puzzled me but I am inclined to think it was the human nature of Jesus that needed prayer.
 
paradox3 said:
Summary: Luke 11: 1 - 4

Jesus is praying in a certain place, and one of his disciples requests he teach them how to pray, as John taught his disciples.

Say this, he responds, and offers the well-known Lord's Prayer. Luke's version is shorter than Matthew's.
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Just for comparison:

Luke said:
Father,[a] hallowed be your name.
Your kingdom come.[b]
3 Give us each day our daily bread.[c]
4 And forgive us our sins,
for we ourselves forgive everyone indebted to us.
And do not bring us to the time of trial.”[d]
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Matthew said:
Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name.
10 Your kingdom come.
Your will be done,
on earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our daily bread.[a]
12 And forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors.
13 And do not bring us to the time of trial,[b]
but rescue us from the evil one.[c]
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Interesting how concise Luke's is. Matthew's account also gives more detail on how to pray while Luke just has Jesus respond to the request to teach them how to pray with the Lord's Prayer. One wonders which one Jesus actually taught. Or do these actually represent two different occasions?
 
Question: is there a reason churches tend to use Matthew's vs. Luke's? Is it just familiarity at this point? I'd be tempted to use Luke's just to shake things up a bit.
 
Mendalla said:
Question: is there a reason churches tend to use Matthew's vs. Luke's? Is it just familiarity at this point? I'd be tempted to use Luke's just to shake things up a bit.
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Tradition, probably.

Interesting to note that the Matthew version does not have the ending we use in church . . . For thine is the kingdom, the power and the glory. For ever and ever. Amen

I am not sure when the ending was added. The Roman Catholic "Pater Noster" (Our Father) does not have it AFAIK.
 
the disciples asked Jesus, teach us how to pray because even in our prayers, we pray our will not Gods will. Jesus always prayed Gods Will, "yet not my will but thy will be done ". The disciples were fortunate to have the physical presence of Jesus to be taught by, we don't have that today, but we do have the Holy Spirit to come along us and Help us pray Gods will,


Romans 8:26-27 In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us through wordless groans. 27 And he who searches our hearts knows the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for God’s people in accordance with the will of God


there are many verses about praying in the Spirit
 
paradox3 said:
Tradition, probably.

Interesting to note that the Matthew version does not have the ending we use in church . . . For thine is the kingdom, the power and the glory. For ever and ever. Amen

I am not sure when the ending was added. The Roman Catholic "Pater Noster" (Our Father) does not have it AFAIK.
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Reading the wiki on The Lord's Prayer and they say that modern scholarship treats it as an interpolation since it's only found in later manuscripts, which is why most modern Bible translations (e.g. the NRSV that I quoted above) don't have it, even in Protestant churches.
 
According to Wiki, there are six instances where the words of Jesus in prayer are recorded:

"Six times the gospels record words that Jesus spoke in prayer:

  • "You have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children" (Matt 11:25-26, Luke 10:21)
  • Before the raising of Lazarus (John 11:41-42)
  • "Father, glorify your name" (John 12:28)
  • His prayer in John 17
  • Three prayers in the Garden of Gethsemane
  • Three prayers on the cross:
    • "Father forgive them; for they know not what they do" (Luke 23:34)
    • "My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?" (Matt 27:46, Mark 15:34)
    • "Father, into thy hands I commit my spirit" (Luke 23:46)"
There are other times we are told about Jesus praying but the words are not recorded.
 
Again from Wiki:

"Other references to Jesus praying include:

In addition to this, Jesus said grace before the feeding miracles, at the Last Supper, and at the supper at Emmaus.

R. A. Torrey notes that Jesus prayed early in the morning as well as all night, that he prayed both before and after the great events of his life, and that he prayed "when life was unusually busy".
 
Interesting that in Luke's account of Jesus teaching the disciples His prayer, He has been praying himself and gives them no further instruction on how to pray.

In Matthew's version of the story, Jesus has not necessarily been praying himself but He offers several pieces of advice . . . Do not pray on the street corners, pray to God in secret & do not heap up empty phrases. He also states that God knows what we need before we ask.
 
paradox3 said:
He prayed this in the garden of Gethsemane, I seem to recall.

Some of the last words from the cross recorded in the various gospels are also prayers said by Jesus.
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My God My God why have you forsaken me, a cry out from Psalms 22: 1, wasn't a prayer but Christ reality of separation from God the Father
 
paradox3 said:
Yes, it is a quote from Psalm 22 cried out in anguish. Why would it not be a prayer?
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more of a fulfillment of prophecy, but if you read and study Jesus prayers, they are always in line With Gods will for humanity.

many times when we pray, we pray self will, which would be ok, if our prayers are in humility for problems (mountains) in our lives, or of healings, but ultimately all prayer is in Gods will, not ours .


then there are those who are selfish in prayer like money, or a mansion, just for example,,, I experienced this from a client this past yr, I sold her townhome of 600k then she wanted me to find her a 2 million dollar home, all she could afford was about 700k, when I asked her how is she going to afford the home, she accused me of having no faith that Jesus will provide .

She's a new Christian so I didn't say anything and hurt her walk with God, she'll figure it out as she matures
 
unsafe said:
There is no balance between Martha and Mary in God's Eyes People ---your either with Christ or your Not -----When we try to balance between a Martha and a Mary we are infact lukewarm Christians trying to live in both worlds ----and God warns us about this ----we can be lukewarm if we choose to but we will get nothing from God -----and that is scriptural ----
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You assume that Martha is not being present just because she is doing other things as well. Based on my lived experiece of how different people operate I am not sure that is a safe assumption. Some can only be present while doing something, they simply can NOT sit and listen. IF all of this is happening in the house I have no doubt the space would allow Martha to be preparing food AND listening to the teaching.
 
Mendalla said:
Reading the wiki on The Lord's Prayer and they say that modern scholarship treats it as an interpolation since it's only found in later manuscripts, which is why most modern Bible translations (e.g. the NRSV that I quoted above) don't have it, even in Protestant churches.
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HOwever it is almost always used when the prayer is said in Protestant churches. It is interesting to say the prayer in wan ecumenical setting. Some will stop before the closing benediction. Some wil say debts, some will say sins, some will say trespasses in the forgiveness line.
 
GordW said:
You assume that Martha is not being present just because she is doing other things as well. Based on my lived experiece of how different people operate I am not sure that is a safe assumption. Some can only be present while doing something, they simply can NOT sit and listen. IF all of this is happening in the house I have no doubt the space would allow Martha to be preparing food AND listening to the teaching.
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But that's not what the text says, the text says Martha was distracted, and Jesus confirmed that she was distracted, your assumption suggests she could have been listening which would mean she was doing the house chores but not distracted.
 
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