What made Jesus so compelling?

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What made Jesus so compelling?​

I know there are theological answers to this question.

But what about the man Jesus? Was it his message about repentance and end times that was so impressive? His speaking ability? His powerful presence and personality perhaps?

This Quote here -----
But what about the man Jesus?


I don't think -it was the man Jesus that was compelling ------it was in my view ---His Divine Qualities and Attributes that were compelling to others to make them take note of Him ---

His Unconditional Love --Agape
His Peace in the Mist of a Storm
His Forgiving Nature
His Humility and Humbleness
His Compassion for the sick -- poor and oppressed
His Gentleness
His Self Control
His Patients
His Faithfulness and Obedience to do His Father's Will
His Willingness to Serve

 

[JayneWonders]

He had great media relations. Exceptional spin masters. Understood how to manipulate crowds and feed the people who were hungry for a messiah

 

[Waterfall]

I think that he had charisma. I've met a few such people in my life. That, and the other things mentioned...it all went together.

Interesting that the definition of the word " charisma" comes from a Greek word meaning "favour freely given" or "gift of grace".
In Christian theology the term is "charism" which is an "endowment" or "extraordinary power" given by the Holy Spirit.
Paul refers to charisma 17 times that includes 1st Corinthians, 2nd Corinthians, Romans, 1st and 2nd Timothy and 1st Peter.
"Early Christians designated certain individuals "as possessing spiritual gifts" these gifts included the ability " to penetrate his neighbour to the bottom of his heart and spirit and to recognize if he is dominated by an evil or a good spirit and the gift to help him receive freedom from his demon". (Wikipedia)
I would say the way we think of charisma today is different than in Jesus time.

 

[paradox3]

His Unconditional Love --Agape
His Peace in the Mist of a Storm
His Forgiving Nature
His Humility and Humbleness
His Compassion for the sick -- poor and oppressed
His Gentleness
His Self Control
His Patients
His Faithfulness and Obedience to do His Father's Will
His Willingness to Serve

Everything on this list is a human quality in my view. But I will agree with you that Jesus had these attributes to a remarkable degree.

 

[paradox3]

He had great media relations. Exceptional spin masters. Understood how to manipulate crowds and feed the people who were hungry for a messiah

Was recently reading about the point of view that the Jesus movement within Judaism was an apocalyptic cult.

Characteristics of cults were said to include:
1. Charismatic leadership
2. Group dynamics
3. Manipulation

I can certainly see #1 in Jesus during His lifetime. And #2 in His followers in the early church.

Manipulation I am not sure about.

Where do you see manipulation @JayneWonders?

By the way, I am not arguing that early Christianity was an apocalyptic cult although I believe Jesus was an apocalyptic preacher.

 

[JayneWonders]

Manipulation could be as simple planting followers in the crowd "I've been healed"

 

[paradox3]

Manipulation could be as simple planting followers in the crowd "I've been healed"

This seems unlikely to me but who knows?
With healing, there is also the psychological power of suggestion and the placebo effect. Groupthink, too, if the healings take place in a crowd.

 

[JayneWonders]

I'm not saying that is what happened, just indicating how a clever psychopath ahead of his time could cause such an affect

 

[paradox3]

I'm not saying that is what happened, just indicating how a clever psychopath ahead of his time could cause such an affect

Or maybe one of the disciples was taking matters into his own hands and planted someone in the crowd.

Can't say I buy this theory either but it's always good to consider all angles

 

[Waterfall]

Manipulation could be as simple planting followers in the crowd "I've been healed"

I don't personally see Jesus this way, most charlatans want money for these "services" and as far as I can see Jesus didn't charge, in fact he fed the crowd, (in more ways than one). He also didn't put a lot of stock in miracles.
I tend to see Jesus more as being very insightful towards sin. I think he knew that sin could destroy us from the inside and realized that forgiveness was key to " free" us from our self destruction and that sinning no more and looking towards a higher power than ourselves was the way out. He offered Grace and he loved others despite their sins.
Unfortunately a long comes the Roman Catholic Church that invents purgatory and tells people that the only way out is to pay for an indulgence to get out of your sins. And today how many churches focus on our sins and sinful nature?
I think Jesus knew every person had potential if we stopped defining ourselves by our sins and love God, ourselves and one another.

 

[paradox3]

The Gospels tell us that Jesus conducted healings, exorcisms and other miracles. I don't see how anyone can say He didn't put much stock in miracles.

 

[JayneWonders]

Hmm, don't think he was still working, so at minimum he was getting food. Odds are he was having sex.

 

[Waterfall]

I don't see how anyone can say He didn't put much stock in miracles.

John 4:48

 

[paradox3]

Hmm, don't think he was still working, so at minimum he was getting food. Odds are he was having sex.

Jesus was pretty willing to rely on the hospitality of others to provide him with food and shelter.

 

[paradox3]

John 4:48

This story seems to suggest Jesus was critical of those who needed to see signs and wonders. Yet this gospel writer carefully outlines the series of signs Jesus provided.

 

[Waterfall]

This story seems to suggest Jesus was critical of those who needed to see signs and wonders. Yet this gospel writer carefully outlines the series of signs Jesus provided.

Jesus was being critical of those needing to see signs and wonders in order to believe.
He rather wants us to listen and concentrate on what he's teaching rather than requiring miracles to suggest he's worth following. IMO.
Would we follow Jesus if there were no miracles?
How did that play out in his own hometown?

 

[Pavlos Maros]

Ahh I see. I knew you were an atheist but I wasn't aware you reject the idea of an historical Jesus.

I don't reject anything provide there is evidence to back it up. There is no contemporaneous evidence for a jesus person there may have been someone like that, I and you could not possibly know. Due to that lack of evidence.
All that can be said is it is possible he did exist and it's possible he didn't and it is also possible that he is a completely made up character, put together from all the preachers wandering around at the time.

In that case, what would you say is the appeal of the fictional character?

Or am I misunderstanding the point you are making?

The very same appeal you get from reading other books of fiction, and hero worshiping the main character. That is how fiction is written, it is made to be believable and entertaining.

 

[paradox3]

Somehow I think there is more involved than an entertaining story.

 

[BetteTheRed]

He offered Grace and he loved others despite their sins.

I would go farther than that. He loved people who other people considered sinners - prostitutes, tax collectors, etc.; it seemed he preferentially sought out "sinners" as companions. It seems very likely that he loved Mary, who may have been the Mary cured of demons.

I see the late Desmond Tutu as having that same charism. And Jimmy Carter. And the late Thich Nat Hanh.

 

[Pavlos Maros]

Somehow I think there is more involved than an entertaining story.

Well you would. You been inculcated into the cult. Much like a avid star wars fan at comic-con etc. When someone is brainwashed into a particular genre, it is almost impossible to get them out of it. Only you/they can make the change, ask any person who de-converted from a religion. They will say it was not easy.