What's interesting unsafe is that, as you rightly point out - he calls them. They don't up and volunteer.
This is still the way today with Christ and his followers.
The Gospel of Mark
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What's interesting unsafe is that, as you rightly point out - he calls them. They don't up and volunteer.
This is still the way today with Christ and his followers.
First you have to be a believer.
Yes, I believe so. As Paul hadn't yet been saved, he couldn't have been a believer who refused to admit his shame, repent of it and desire God to forgive him in Christ. @chansen has never been a believer.
unsafe
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Jae ---your quote -----What's interesting unsafe is that, as you rightly point out - he calls them. They don't up and volunteer.
unsafe says ----OH YA ----and you were called as an infant and responded Jae -----wishful thinking
Grasping at straws Jae ------Jesus came to earth to fulfil a prophecy ------the 12 were part of God's Plan Jae ---- nice try
unsafe says
I believe God pulls on our heart to come to Him Jae ----if you want to call that a call well go ahead but here is the thing we have Free will to accept the pull on our heart or not ---otherwise all people would be saved as God is very clear in His word that God wants all people saved not some people Jae -----Jesus shed His Blood for all sins for all time there Jae not some sins for some time ------
Your Salvation thinking of some being saved and others not By God Himself is a bunch of hooey ----in my view
unsafe says ----OH YA ----and you were called as an infant and responded Jae -----wishful thinking
Grasping at straws Jae ------Jesus came to earth to fulfil a prophecy ------the 12 were part of God's Plan Jae ---- nice try
unsafe says
I believe God pulls on our heart to come to Him Jae ----if you want to call that a call well go ahead but here is the thing we have Free will to accept the pull on our heart or not ---otherwise all people would be saved as God is very clear in His word that God wants all people saved not some people Jae -----Jesus shed His Blood for all sins for all time there Jae not some sins for some time ------
Your Salvation thinking of some being saved and others not By God Himself is a bunch of hooey ----in my view
Jae ---your quote -----What's interesting unsafe is that, as you rightly point out - he calls them. They don't up and volunteer.
unsafe says ----OH YA ----and you were called as an infant and responded Jae -----wishful thinking
Grasping at straws Jae ------Jesus came to earth to fulfil a prophecy ------the 12 were part of God's Plan Jae ---- nice try
unsafe says
I believe God pulls on our heart to come to Him Jae ----if you want to call that a call well go ahead but here is the thing we have Free will to accept the pull on our heart or not ---otherwise all people would be saved as God is very clear in His word that God wants all people saved not some people Jae -----Jesus shed His Blood for all sins for all time there Jae not some sins for some time ------
Your Salvation thinking of some being saved and others not By God Himself is a bunch of hooey ----in my view
Will start a new thread on the freedom - or lack thereof - of the human will.
If one believes powerfully ... one does not have to experience the sight ...
Then there is the alternate perspective ... if not experienced ... none would believe it and thus there is nothing to it ... if it is transparent like the prince's new suite ... crystal clear as the night sky in the dead of cold to take away the haze ...
Recall the definition of dogma:
And under corrupt authority .. no questions about the source of that predicament are allowed under despotable forces!
De spot 'ng amounts to dumping anything previous or worries about consequences. Thus denial of concerns as ANis would! Thus someone is under the gun ... dogma as Canon?
Does that outline blind laws ... or loss of something gone missing?
a principle or set of principles laid down by an authority as incontrovertibly true.
And under corrupt authority .. no questions about the source of that predicament are allowed under despotable forces!
De spot 'ng amounts to dumping anything previous or worries about consequences. Thus denial of concerns as ANis would! Thus someone is under the gun ... dogma as Canon?
Does that outline blind laws ... or loss of something gone missing?
paradox3
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Summary Mark 4: 1-41
The chapter opens with Jesus addressing a crowd on the shore as he sits in a boat on the sea. He taught by parables:
1. The Parable of the Sower
2. Light Under a Basket
3. The Parable of the Growing Seed
4. The Parable of the Mustard Seed
The purpose of parables is explained. Addressing the twelve, Jesus states, "To you it has been given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God, but to those who are outside, all things come in parables. So that seeing they may see and not perceive, and hearing they may hear and not understand, lest they should turn and their sins be forgiven them." (4:10-12 NKJ)
Jesus continued to teach through the use of parables and was never without one. When they were alone, He explained all things to His disciples. (4:34 NKJ)
On that same day, Jesus and the disciples crossed to the other side of the sea. When a windstorm came up, the waves began to fill the boat with water. Jesus, who had been asleep at the stern of the boat, arose and rebuked the storm. He said to the sea, "Peace. Be still." (4:39 NKJ)
And to the disciples, "Why are you so fearful? How is it that you ave no faith?" (4:40 NKJ)
And the disciples continue to be afraid, asking each other, "Who can this be, that even the wind and the sea obey Him?" (4:41 NKJ)
The chapter opens with Jesus addressing a crowd on the shore as he sits in a boat on the sea. He taught by parables:
1. The Parable of the Sower
2. Light Under a Basket
3. The Parable of the Growing Seed
4. The Parable of the Mustard Seed
The purpose of parables is explained. Addressing the twelve, Jesus states, "To you it has been given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God, but to those who are outside, all things come in parables. So that seeing they may see and not perceive, and hearing they may hear and not understand, lest they should turn and their sins be forgiven them." (4:10-12 NKJ)
Jesus continued to teach through the use of parables and was never without one. When they were alone, He explained all things to His disciples. (4:34 NKJ)
On that same day, Jesus and the disciples crossed to the other side of the sea. When a windstorm came up, the waves began to fill the boat with water. Jesus, who had been asleep at the stern of the boat, arose and rebuked the storm. He said to the sea, "Peace. Be still." (4:39 NKJ)
And to the disciples, "Why are you so fearful? How is it that you ave no faith?" (4:40 NKJ)
And the disciples continue to be afraid, asking each other, "Who can this be, that even the wind and the sea obey Him?" (4:41 NKJ)
paradox3
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The language of 4:10-12 is confusing to me, even in the NRSV. Here is the interpretation from The Message:
Mark 4:10-12 The Message (MSG)
10-12 When they were off by themselves, those who were close to him, along with the Twelve, asked about the stories. He told them, “You’ve been given insight into God’s kingdom—you know how it works. But to those who can’t see it yet, everything comes in stories, creating readiness, nudging them toward receptive insight. These are people—
Whose eyes are open but don’t see a thing,
Whose ears are open but don’t understand a word,
Who avoid making an about-face and getting forgiven.”
Mark 4:10-12 The Message (MSG)
10-12 When they were off by themselves, those who were close to him, along with the Twelve, asked about the stories. He told them, “You’ve been given insight into God’s kingdom—you know how it works. But to those who can’t see it yet, everything comes in stories, creating readiness, nudging them toward receptive insight. These are people—
Whose eyes are open but don’t see a thing,
Whose ears are open but don’t understand a word,
Who avoid making an about-face and getting forgiven.”
paradox3
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Reflection: Mark 4:1-41
This chapter seems to present a conflicting view of the disciples. In 4:10-12 they are said to have insight into the kingdom of God & this is contrasted with those on the outside. Later, they need to have all things explained to them when they are alone with Jesus. When Jesus finally calms the sea, the disciples are astonished and begin asking each other who He can be. Jesus has just rebuked them for being fearful and lacking faith.
What do you make of the disciples at this point? Could they be growing in awareness and understanding?
How do you understand these parables about the kingdom of God?
This chapter seems to present a conflicting view of the disciples. In 4:10-12 they are said to have insight into the kingdom of God & this is contrasted with those on the outside. Later, they need to have all things explained to them when they are alone with Jesus. When Jesus finally calms the sea, the disciples are astonished and begin asking each other who He can be. Jesus has just rebuked them for being fearful and lacking faith.
What do you make of the disciples at this point? Could they be growing in awareness and understanding?
How do you understand these parables about the kingdom of God?
Christ's missionaries were still lacking in spiritual understanding. So they took the opportunity to ask him about these parables' meanings.
He told them, "To you the Kingdom of God's mystery is given." The word "mystery" here means something that is and that should be revealed.
The missionaries understand the Kingdom's meaning, how Christ births faith in people - so that they might know him, perform good works by him, and win heaven.
Of those without, Christ says that he speaks everything to them in parables, and then quotes the prophecy of Isaiah 6:9.
The prophet's word found its application in Jesus' days. God's judgment against his former people, which had begun in Isaiah's days, was now being accomplished.
It became increasingly evident that most people that crowded to Jesus had no thought of seeking salvation; they were just inquisitive, they wanted to see and hear this Prophet, about whom they'd been told. And so God condemns them to remain in their perversity.
That said, the missionaries needed an admonition. They were spiritually flat. Theirs was the condition of many Christians today who, content with just a little Christ, lack discernment.
paradox3
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Hadn't picked up on those words being a prophecy from Isaiah . . . not sure how I missed it since my Bible has a footnote about it.
About the disciples. It is curious they have just been given the power to cast out demons yet they continue to be astonished at Jesus and need His teachings explained to them. Maybe we continue to be astonished today and ask each other, "Who can This be?"
About the crowds. In Matthew's gospel I had the sense they were drawn to Jesus largely by His powers of healing. In Mark they seem to clamor to hear His teachings. Were they seeking information about salvation? Maybe. Maybe not. I think it is more likely they were responding to the message of Hope from Jesus.
unsafe
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paradox3 ---your quote ----- How do you understand these parables about the kingdom of God?
unsafe says -----first off --the Parable of the Sower is the Granddaddy of all parables ------the Parable of the Sower tells you how the Kingdom of God works -----it works under the farming system --------you plant seeds ------
-I am going to used 2 different Bibles here so the message given can be seen from 2 perspectives from different Bible
Jesus is speaking here -----EX Bible ----verse 13 tells us this Parable is most important one to understand to get the meaning of the other parables
Jesus Tells Why He Used StoriesB)'>
10 Later, when Jesus was alone, the twelve apostles and others around him asked him about the ·stories [parables; see 3:23].
11 Jesus said, “·You can know [To you has been given] the secret about the kingdom of God. But to ·other people [outsiders] I tell everything by using ·stories [parables] 12 so that:
‘They will look and look, but they will not ·learn [perceive].
They will listen and listen, but they will not understand.
·If they did learn and understand [L Otherwise],
they ·would [might] ·come back [return] to me and be forgiven[Is. 6:9–10; cf. Is. 43:8; Jer. 5:21; Ezek. 12:2].’”
Jesus Explains the Seed Story
13 Then Jesus said to ·his followers [L them], “Don’t you understand this ·story [parable]? If you don’t, how will you understand any ·story [parable; see 3:23]
unsafe posting
This is from the AMPC Bible -----verse 13 -----important verse for understanding this parable ---13 And He said to them, Do you not discern and understand this parable? How then is it possible for you to discern and understand all the parables?-
10 And as soon as He was alone, those who were around Him, with the Twelve [apostles], began to ask Him about the parables.
11 And He said to them, To you has been entrusted the mystery of the kingdom of God [that is, the secret counsels of God which are hidden from the ungodly]; but for those outside of our circle] everything becomes a parable,
12 In order that they may [indeed] look and look but not see and perceive, and may hear and hear but not grasp and comprehend, lest haply they should turn again, and it their willful rejection of the truth] should be forgiven them.A)'>
13 And He said to them, Do you not discern and understand this parable? How then is it possible for you to discern and understand all the parables?
unsafe says ---So this parable needs special attention ---this also tells us that we need the right Lens to get the true meaning of scripture
unsafe says -----first off --the Parable of the Sower is the Granddaddy of all parables ------the Parable of the Sower tells you how the Kingdom of God works -----it works under the farming system --------you plant seeds ------
-I am going to used 2 different Bibles here so the message given can be seen from 2 perspectives from different Bible
Jesus is speaking here -----EX Bible ----verse 13 tells us this Parable is most important one to understand to get the meaning of the other parables
Jesus Tells Why He Used StoriesB)'>
10 Later, when Jesus was alone, the twelve apostles and others around him asked him about the ·stories [parables; see 3:23].
11 Jesus said, “·You can know [To you has been given] the secret about the kingdom of God. But to ·other people [outsiders] I tell everything by using ·stories [parables] 12 so that:
‘They will look and look, but they will not ·learn [perceive].
They will listen and listen, but they will not understand.
·If they did learn and understand [L Otherwise],
they ·would [might] ·come back [return] to me and be forgiven[Is. 6:9–10; cf. Is. 43:8; Jer. 5:21; Ezek. 12:2].’”
Jesus Explains the Seed Story
13 Then Jesus said to ·his followers [L them], “Don’t you understand this ·story [parable]? If you don’t, how will you understand any ·story [parable; see 3:23]
unsafe posting
This is from the AMPC Bible -----verse 13 -----important verse for understanding this parable ---13 And He said to them, Do you not discern and understand this parable? How then is it possible for you to discern and understand all the parables?-
10 And as soon as He was alone, those who were around Him, with the Twelve [apostles], began to ask Him about the parables.
11 And He said to them, To you has been entrusted the mystery of the kingdom of God [that is, the secret counsels of God which are hidden from the ungodly]; but for those outside of our circle] everything becomes a parable,
12 In order that they may [indeed] look and look but not see and perceive, and may hear and hear but not grasp and comprehend, lest haply they should turn again, and it their willful rejection of the truth] should be forgiven them.A)'>
13 And He said to them, Do you not discern and understand this parable? How then is it possible for you to discern and understand all the parables?
unsafe says ---So this parable needs special attention ---this also tells us that we need the right Lens to get the true meaning of scripture
Hadn't picked up on those words being a prophecy from Isaiah . . . not sure how I missed it since my Bible has a footnote about it.
About the disciples. It is curious they have just been given the power to cast out demons yet they continue to be astonished at Jesus and need His teachings explained to them. Maybe we continue to be astonished today and ask each other, "Who can This be?"
About the crowds. In Matthew's gospel I had the sense they were drawn to Jesus largely by His powers of healing. In Mark they seem to clamor to hear His teachings. Were they seeking information about salvation? Maybe. Maybe not. I think it is more likely they were responding to the message of Hope from Jesus.
I really think that in Mark the crowds just really wanted to check him out since his fame was growing. I don't think they were looking for salvation messages. I think they just wanted to hear what his deal was.
Deals are not good for the common people due to demands of those leaning towards oligarist attributes ... severe polity! Tis about winning and not anything to do with social and demos unusual pragmatics ... good for all (that'd be God as integral). Not common in the significantly individualized and naive regarding grasps ... a mean state?
One needs to get a grip on all that is scattered and complexly connected in the abstract ... myths?
Some will readily eliminate such cognizance ... just to prosper inequitably ... a religion in some facets of the dark!
Where trauma comes in distinct contrast to trancelike heavens ...
Reminds me of the comparative stance regarding intimacy and adversary ... love verses intelligence? If the devil has adversary ... what does god-love have to offer? A great void ... one has to jump the gap ... quantum stuff ... minute science ...
Big folks won;t take time to look there ... and yet it is the support fluid ... hypo phobic vs the superfluous ?
Big folks won;t take time to look there ... and yet it is the support fluid ... hypo phobic vs the superfluous ?
Thoughts on The Parable of the Sower...
Christ sows his word by preaching.
The gospel's hearers can be divided into four groups, according to how they treat the word.
The first group are the chance hearers, those that forget the word. They're those in whose case the seed falls along the way. The word's seed remains lying on top of their hearts, it doesn't penetrate their sensibilities. Here, it's Satan himself that takes the word away from them.
The second group are the overenthusiastic, that don't truly know God. They accept the word with joy. However, their soil isn't ready for a lasting faith. When danger signals appear, their zeal's reduced to a point where it's unusable. Persecution makes them lose all interest in the Church.
The third group are promising at first. They hear the word diligently. However, they let other plants rise up in them. The idea that money will make them happy grasps hold of them. And finally, the desire for the other pleasures which the world's children enjoy blinds them to the true values in life. Their faith is fruitless.
The fourth group are those Christians that have been sown into good soil, where the soil has been prepared in the proper manner by the law's plowing and by the gospel's rain, where the seed may sprout and grow until the ears testify to the harvest.
An important sermon's contained in Jesus' parable. All Christians should remember the seed that didn't sprout at all, the seed that didn't grow, the seed that bore no fruit and the seed that grew to Christ's expectations.
Christ sows his word by preaching.
The gospel's hearers can be divided into four groups, according to how they treat the word.
The first group are the chance hearers, those that forget the word. They're those in whose case the seed falls along the way. The word's seed remains lying on top of their hearts, it doesn't penetrate their sensibilities. Here, it's Satan himself that takes the word away from them.
The second group are the overenthusiastic, that don't truly know God. They accept the word with joy. However, their soil isn't ready for a lasting faith. When danger signals appear, their zeal's reduced to a point where it's unusable. Persecution makes them lose all interest in the Church.
The third group are promising at first. They hear the word diligently. However, they let other plants rise up in them. The idea that money will make them happy grasps hold of them. And finally, the desire for the other pleasures which the world's children enjoy blinds them to the true values in life. Their faith is fruitless.
The fourth group are those Christians that have been sown into good soil, where the soil has been prepared in the proper manner by the law's plowing and by the gospel's rain, where the seed may sprout and grow until the ears testify to the harvest.
An important sermon's contained in Jesus' parable. All Christians should remember the seed that didn't sprout at all, the seed that didn't grow, the seed that bore no fruit and the seed that grew to Christ's expectations.
paradox3
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"The farmer plants God’s message in people [L The sower sows the word]." - Mark 4:14 (EXB).
I believe that message is that newness of life is possible through Jesus Christ.