Professional Cover-up?

[Mendalla]

You're right, but why is it that the RBC is the only one implicated in this particular one? Do we think it's because that particular law firm (from whom these records were 'leaked') used RBC?

I think it's the other way around. RBC was using the law firm to set up companies for its clients and that documentation showed up in the leak. Whether those were Canadian clients or overseas clients (they are one of the most active of the Canadian banks internationally) is not clear from what I have read. The fact that there are no documents from other Canadian banks could just be a matter of them using different law firms. I find it hard to believe that CIBC, TD, etc. would not be offering their clients a service that RBC did.

 

[Delightful Life]

Assets? LOL...

*chuckle* i guess you would be alright with having your bank account(s) at RBC frozen, then...free range living, mmm-mmm

 

[Delightful Life]

David Brin warming up on this news story

 

[Mendalla]

Even if that meant all of your RBC assets being seized?

An ordinary depositer with an ordinary deposit account (chequing, savings, CDIC-insured RRSP, etc.) are unlikely to face any consequences. The type of banking the Panama papers are dealing with generally involves the management and movement of millions of dollars and therefore tends to be the province of the 1% (or even the 0.1%). Someone with a few hundred or even a few thousand dollars in a regular account isn't going to be noticed or affected. In fact, other than CRA taking a long hard look at Canadian clients of RBC's overseas operations (which, incidentally, they are supposed to be doing anyhow but apparently not doing), I doubt there will be much by way of consequences here in Canada. Even if regulators or courts at home or in some part of the world come down hard on RBC, it is likely that CDIC or the government will make sure ordinary depositers like us are protected. It is one of the biggest of the big banks so will surely fall under "too big to fail".

 

[Delightful Life]

An ordinary depositer with an ordinary deposit account (chequing, savings, CDIC-insured RRSP, etc.) are unlikely to face any consequences. The type of banking the Panama papers are dealing with generally involves the management and movement of millions of dollars and therefore tends to be the province of the 1% (or even the 0.1%). Someone with a few hundred or even a few thousand dollars in a regular account isn't going to be noticed or affected. In fact, other than CRA taking a long hard look at Canadian clients of RBC's overseas operations (which, incidentally, they are supposed to be doing anyhow but apparently not doing), I doubt there will be much by way of consequences here in Canada. Even if regulators or courts at home or in some part of the world come down hard on RBC, it is likely that CDIC or the government will make sure ordinary depositers like us are protected. It is one of the biggest of the big banks so will surely fall under "too big to fail".

ty :3

i was more interested in BR's feelings if her own money was on the line--its easy to feel glee at someone else's misfortune when one's own skin isn't in the game :3 & her insights regarding that and her lifestyle could provide help to others here in how to deal with this uncertain & chaotic world :3

 

[Delightful Life]

 

[BetteTheRed]

ty :3

i was more interested in BR's feelings if her own money was on the line--its easy to feel glee at someone else's misfortune when one's own skin isn't in the game :3 & her insights regarding that and her lifestyle could provide help to others here in how to deal with this uncertain & chaotic world :3

I'm not sure how it's mis'fortune' when it's a deliberate attempt at evading taxes. And I absolutely love it when corporations' 'skin' is in the game. Free market capitalism is a mugs game rigged to the rich, so it's nice to see them getting their comeuppance, at least occasionally.

And what's your particular interest in my 'lifestyle'? It's the lifestyle of a woman who has worked all her life to raise kids, care for parents, etc. I have a little bungalow and two dogs and two cats, a boomerang kid back in the basement, and an old guy who visits occasionally. And have you ever had butter tart beer? It's a very interesting flavour.

 

[Mrs.Anteater]

I think it's the other way around. RBC was using the law firm to set up companies for its clients and that documentation showed up in the leak. Whether those were Canadian clients or overseas clients (they are one of the most active of the Canadian banks internationally) is not clear from what I have read. The fact that there are no documents from other Canadian banks could just be a matter of them using different law firms. I find it hard to believe that CIBC, TD, etc. would not be offering their clients a service that RBC did.

Oh, they are likely all alike. I was getting uncomfortable with RBC, because they seem to throw a lot of money into publicity (sponsoring/ advertising the Olympics and so on. They seem to do this more than others. I am thinking about Credit Union.

 

[ChemGal]

I actually don't think all of the banks are as bad as RBC, just due to personal experience. They were absolutely horrible for lying when asked direct questions just so they could take small amounts of money from me. It was ridiculous. I'd love to see them knocked down a few pegs.

 

[Delightful Life]

I'm not sure how it's mis'fortune' when it's a deliberate attempt at evading taxes. And I absolutely love it when corporations' 'skin' is in the game. Free market capitalism is a mugs game rigged to the rich, so it's nice to see them getting their comeuppance, at least occasionally.

It's still a misfortune no matter the culpability?

Personally, I think you've already condemned 'them' and that's quite normal -- always, when presented with information, we try to categorize it as soon as possible, unconsciously mostly...and then when we think aboot it, the reason why, we come up with reasons why, we justify it and even use cognitive biases to justify it...our unconscious selves are very quick -- i think it is faster than our conscious selves

(i'll note that a recent time that happened to me was with the Edward Snowden scandal -- it felt GOOD to feel that these schmoes were exposed...)

again, all pretty normal...I was just curious if you'd be feeling as much glee if you were affected as well by having all your RBC accounts frozen so you had to survive on your own...but you don't have to answer that; it wasn't that type of question

And what's your particular interest in my 'lifestyle'? It's the lifestyle of a woman who has worked all her life to raise kids, care for parents, etc. I have a little bungalow and two dogs and two cats, a boomerang kid back in the basement, and an old guy who visits occasionally. And have you ever had butter tart beer? It's a very interesting flavour.

Nopers, never had the benefit of butter tart beer -- this is the first I've ever hoid of it--is it nice?

 

[Delightful Life]

another analysis of the conspiracy known as the Panama Papers

 

[BetteTheRed]

It's still a misfortune no matter the culpability?

Personally, I think you've already condemned 'them' and that's quite normal -- always, when presented with information, we try to categorize it as soon as possible, unconsciously mostly...and then when we think aboot it, the reason why, we come up with reasons why, we justify it and even use cognitive biases to justify it...our unconscious selves are very quick -- i think it is faster than our conscious selves

(i'll note that a recent time that happened to me was with the Edward Snowden scandal -- it felt GOOD to feel that these schmoes were exposed...)

again, all pretty normal...I was just curious if you'd be feeling as much glee if you were affected as well by having all your RBC accounts frozen so you had to survive on your own...but you don't have to answer that; it wasn't that type of question



Nopers, never had the benefit of butter tart beer -- this is the first I've ever hoid of it--is it nice?

"Fortune" implies luck of some sort. Mis"fortune" implies bad luck. Planned malfeasance is hardly bad luck, unless you're talking the "getting caught" part.

And no, I don't generally feel glee when the 99% suffer; I pretty well restrict it to the 1%....

Maple butter tart beer? Made by a local craft brewery in Midland. It's a creamy brown ale type thing with some caramel & maple flavouring; really does have a flavour reminiscent of a nice butter tart in a nice brown ale-y packaging...

 

[ChemGal]

"
And no, I don't generally feel glee when the 99% suffer; I pretty well restrict it to the 1%....

Many of the 1% still fall within the working class. In many cases it's someone where they are the only income earner in their family who forwent wages or had made very little money while getting a post-secondary education. Think of many doctors. They aren't struggling financially after often struggling when they were younger but why feel glee when they suffer?

 

[BetteTheRed]

Chemgal, I'm going out on a limb here, but I'd guess NONE of the 1% fall in the working class, although there may be the odd stockbroker in there. I'd be betting that a large portion of the 1% cruise to their position on inherited wealth.

 

[ChemGal]

Chemgal, I'm going out on a limb here, but I'd guess NONE of the 1% fall in the working class, although there may be the odd stockbroker in there. I'd be betting that a large portion of the 1% cruise to their position on inherited wealth.

Working class meaning they must work for their income. Many high paid professionals have loans to pay off, didn't inherit a large amount of wealth, etc. Their main source of income doesn't come from their investments.

I know people who fall into that 1% distinction and they are working class. It's really horrible to hear that you would take glee in their suffering.

 

[BetteTheRed]

OK, in deference to your opinions, although, like I said, I think it's mainly inherited wealth, I will remove glee from my feelings source, and replace it with more indifference than I have to the plight of the 99%. Think that's the best I can do.

And in fact, if you look back, it was the big bank that I was getting sorta gleeful about. And I think big corporations are a mistake and that governments should be allowed to regulate away oligopolies.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

Working class meaning they must work for their income. Many high paid professionals have loans to pay off, didn't inherit a large amount of wealth, etc. Their main source of income doesn't come from their investments.

I know people who fall into that 1% distinction and they are working class. It's really horrible to hear that you would take glee in their suffering.

I'm not taking glee in anyone's suffering...but, by your estimation, when someone works hard to get to the 1% does that give them the privedge to stuff tons of money in offshore accounts and screw over the 99% ? Having said that, I wouldn't doubt there many who are at the lower end of the 1% who were ill advised about what to do with their money. But for the gazillionaires who knowingly get away with it, and don't seem to really care, everyone else suffers. Think of what those billions could do for the world while real working class people get nickel and dimed, and social programs are cut or stretched thin, etc.

 

[ChemGal]

I'm not taking glee in anyone's suffering...but, by your estimation, when someone works hard to get to the 1% does that give them the privedge to stuff tons of money in offshore accounts and screw over the 99% ? Having said that, I wouldn't doubt there many who are at the lower end of the 1% who were ill advised about what to do with their money. But for the gazillionaires who knowingly get away with it, and don't seem to really care, everyone else suffers. Think of what those billions could do for the world while real working class people get nickel and dimed, and social programs are cut or stretched thin, etc.

I don't think the majority of the 1% is doing that.
I do think those who are doing something illegal should be punished. I don't see how an arbitrary income cut-off point has anything to do with that though.

 

[ChemGal]

How many of those with the offshore accounts are even accounted as the 1%? They are doing a pretty decent job of hiding their income. I suspect they also split the income they do declare here amoungst family members by claiming a business or some of the other loophole type things (and thus avoiding being in the top 1% of income earners) I do know of people doing.

 

[BetteTheRed]

I don't think the majority of the 1% is doing that.
I do think those who are doing something illegal should be punished. I don't see how an arbitrary income cut-off point has anything to do with that though.

You don't see a systemic re-structuring of our society to increase the gap between the richest and the poorest, even more firmly cementing power with wealth?