MAID Concerns - How Will Our Politicians Respond?

Welcome to Wondercafe2!

A community where we discuss, share, and have some fun together. Join today and become a part of it!

Register Log in
For those interested, here is a link to the plan (editted out the link in the one previous as it wasn't the right link)

My Plan - ACP in Canada | PPS au Canada

It’s easy to make and share your plan! To make your free plan, please choose an option from below. Complete our easy online form Complete online The Advance Care Planning National Workbook is available as an online form. You can save your work and continue later. Upon completion, a PDF copy can...
www.advancecareplanning.ca www.advancecareplanning.ca
 
Hi @Kimmio , I asked in an earlier post if the wish was to move the dementia related dialogue to another thread. There seemed no desire.
 
Pinga said:
For those interested, here is a link to the plan (editted out the link in the one previous as it wasn't the right link)

My Plan - ACP in Canada | PPS au Canada

It’s easy to make and share your plan! To make your free plan, please choose an option from below. Complete our easy online form Complete online The Advance Care Planning National Workbook is available as an online form. You can save your work and continue later. Upon completion, a PDF copy can...
www.advancecareplanning.ca www.advancecareplanning.ca
Click to expand...
This isn’t what this thread is for. start a new one.
 
Actually, on page 3 of this thread, there was discussions regarding a 90yr old man, and later other people and lives were introduced, I don't see it as a stretch from the first 70 pages.

@Kimmio Laughterlove , it is funny as it doesn't matter how i might attempt to lift the conversation, even to other disabled folks, you feel that i am attacking.

It is quite hard to have a dialogue which doesn't fit your world, or your world view.
 
Kimmio Laughterlove said:
Anything but address the real issue creating the most suffering for most people with disabilities, which is poverty. You don’t lift anything. You keep us down.
Click to expand...
Kimmio, this thread is about MADD to my knowledge; however, if you wish to speak regarding poverty.

Per the stats on poverty, there are 85.6% of the population of disabled people who do not live below the poverty line, and so, though poverty is a factor, it is not the only factor. In addition, just because you are poor, does not mean that you would not want some form of an advanced directive and clear wishes. In fact, you may wish to be more intentional about documenting it, as per your earlier comments, you could not expect those who would fit into the category to act based on your wishes:

These stats come from the Council of Canadians with disabilities: http://www.ccdonline.ca/en/socialpo...of Canada,%, comprising nearly 600,000 people.

Disability and Poverty​
The overall poverty rate for Canadian adults was 10.5% in 2006, comprising 2.6 million people. The Conference Board of Canada recently found that Canada ranks 15th out of 17 countries in terms of poverty among working-age people and gave Canada a 'D' rating on that basis.[4] For people with disabilities the poverty rate was 14.4%, comprising nearly 600,000 people.​
 
Pinga said:
Kimmio, this thread is about MADD to my knowledge; however, if you wish to speak regarding poverty.

Per the stats on poverty, there are 85.6% of the population of disabled people who do not live below the poverty line, and so, though poverty is a factor, it is not the only factor. In addition, just because you are poor, does not mean that you would not want some form of an advanced directive and clear wishes. In fact, you may wish to be more intentional about documenting it, as per your earlier comments, you could not expect those who would fit into the category to act based on your wishes:

These stats come from the Council of Canadians with disabilities: http://www.ccdonline.ca/en/socialpolicy/poverty-citizenship/demographic-profile/poverty-disability-canada#:~:text=Disability and Poverty&text=The Conference Board of Canada,%, comprising nearly 600,000 people.

Disability and Poverty​
The overall poverty rate for Canadian adults was 10.5% in 2006, comprising 2.6 million people. The Conference Board of Canada recently found that Canada ranks 15th out of 17 countries in terms of poverty among working-age people and gave Canada a 'D' rating on that basis.[4] For people with disabilities the poverty rate was 14.4%, comprising nearly 600,000 people.​
Click to expand...
  • No disability—Poverty rate of 9.7%
  • Any disability—Poverty rate of 14.4%
  • Mobility—Poverty rate of 15.2%
  • Agility—Poverty rate of 14.8%
  • Pain—Poverty rate of 15.2%
  • Communicating—Poverty rate of 24.1%
  • Hearing—Poverty rate of 10.3%
  • Seeing—Poverty rate of 17.1%
  • Any cognitive or psychological—Poverty rate of 22.3%
what about someone with mobility and psychological impairment? Do I add them up, or split the difference? Mobility is only 6% higher which is still a lot. Psychological...that includes depression, anxiety, 22.3%. Nearly 2.5 times the poverty rate of the general population.

It’s those who are poor whose lives are at risk, Pinga. Not those who are not.
 
Or, Pinga this was 2017:

thetyee.ca

People With Disabilities in Poverty Trap, Says Report | The Tyee

Ranks of working poor growing; activists still awaiting poverty plan from Ottawa.
thetyee.ca thetyee.ca

The median income for people with disabilities in Canada is nearly half that of those without disabilities, and 23 per cent of people with disabilities between 25 and 64 are living in poverty

again, it’s those who are poor whose lives are at risk not those who are well off. That’s why I bring up poverty.
 
Again, there are significant volume that aren't in poverty.

Are you stating that those with disabilities who aren't in poverty should not have directives?

So poverty combined with disability is the only people whose lives are at risk?

Are you indicated that those who either are not disabled or are not poor, or both, should not have any POA or directives?
 
I’m stating that people with disabilities are more at risk of getting MAiD for poverty rather than their condition. That happened in the Truchon case. He had CP. He wasn’t dying. The reason he wanted to die was because he couldn’t get home care, his only option was a nursing home, or death.

removed insults



also it’s inappropriate to keep bringing up advanced directives for dementia when Bill C7 is happening right now. It’s a pretty critical decision. This thread is about protecting people with disabilities, and our lawmakers decision.

removed insults

 
Last edited by a moderator:
There was an article in the Star today about the upcoming MAID legislation vote - Feb 17 I think it is; commented that the Senate "has signaled its intention to propose substantial amendments" - which would have to be dealt with quickly in order to meet the court imposed deadline of Feb 26. That there are 'substantial amendments' suggests, to me at least, that legislators have been soberly considering the input of Canadians. The article ended by commenting - "It sets up two sets of rules for eligibility: more relaxed rules for those who are near death and more stringent rules for those who are not and would prohibit assisted dying fir individuals suffering solely from mental illness". It will be interesting to see more info on the details and what passes into law.
 
Carolla said:
There was an article in the Star today about the upcoming MAID legislation vote - Feb 17 I think it is; commented that the Senate "has signaled its intention to propose substantial amendments" - which would have to be dealt with quickly in order to meet the court imposed deadline of Feb 26. That there are 'substantial amendments' suggests, to me at least, that legislators have been soberly considering the input of Canadians. The article ended by commenting - "It sets up two sets of rules for eligibility: more relaxed rules for those who are near death and more stringent rules for those who are not and would prohibit assisted dying fir individuals suffering solely from mental illness". It will be interesting to see more info on the details and what passes into law.
Click to expand...
Some of the substantial amendments will be to try to open it up wider. Anyway, I put you on ignore for liking a post I found offensive. I said goodbye to this place. It’s hurting me to stay here. Too much tone deafness. It drives me crazy.

I hope an amendment that happens is a complete Supreme Court challenge to the constitutionality of including disability. That would put C14 into question, too, and we’d have to start over. That’s what I hope while I go on my way.
 
www.ctvnews.ca

New proposed assisted-dying law is 'racist,' says disability rights activist

Those who support expanding access to medical assistance in dying are doing so because they have not grappled with the consequences of medical racism, a disability activist said Monday before senators began debating the proposed legislation.
www.ctvnews.ca www.ctvnews.ca

"Bill C-7 is anti-working class, racist and ableist," Sarah Jama of the Disability Justice Network of Ontario told a virtual news conference.
 
Thus we rush down the pathei logos ... to the hooded One ...

Even Mises was denied a glimpse ... or so it is said if you believe that!
 
I read that article too Carolla. I wished they had some specifics

I think we can add this file to another file that Trudeau has handled poorly
 
I have been surprised by the stats of how many people have used MAID since it was enacted. At the time I remember that a lot of the talk was infrequently would be the usage. But it’s not infrequent

does that speak to the lack of palliative care for this dying of cancer? I would be interested, though I couldn’t find it, on stats of how often cancer patients, getting supportive palliative care use MAID compared to those who don’t have palliative care

i know our little community raised money for a hospic center. I think it has five beds. and Is constantly full
 
Ok, just read this letter: https://www.cspcp.ca/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/CHPCA-and-CSPCP-Statement-on-HPC-and-MAiD-Final.pdf
That may cause me to not choose a hospice.

There is also this document from a Canadian researcher, which wouldn't hold the same weght by a longshot, but, puts more of my words and quandary into the MAID dialogue, and the battle between hospice care & MAID

healthydebate.ca

Last rights: Connecting the space between palliative care and MAiD - Healthy Debate

It is one thing to talk in the abstract about the possibility that one’s mother will have a medically assisted death. It is quite another to be at the other end of the phone when she says she’s going to pursue it, as I was this past February.
healthydebate.ca healthydebate.ca


and one more document from a researcher showing some global information
 
Last edited:
Pinga said:
wouldn't someone in a hospice who chose palliative also choose maid?
Click to expand...
Those sound like 2 separate decisions to me - actually 3. 1) whether or not to go with palliative care 2) whether or not to use a hospice facility - depends on 1 being a yes 3) whether or not to choose maid
 
Last edited:
Here, MAID is not an option if one goes into a hospice. I don’t agree with that. I think that
alliative care is the task of accompanying people until their death- which doesn’t have to be a natural one. A pleasant hospice setting would be so much more suitable than a hospital setting.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top