Loaves and Crumbs (Mark 7:24-30)

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In discussing Mathew's version of the story, keep 2 facts in mind:
(1) The scholarly consensus is that Mark is a source used (90%) by Matthew. But Matthew also has his special source that scholars call M. In some cases there is a Mark/M overlap and our story is one such case.
(2) From its inception Mark is criticized for getting the sequence of events in Jesus' life wrong. Living eyewitnesses are able to correct that sequence. But Mark's Gospel is based on Peter's catechetical notes and reminiscences, which are designed for preaching and teaching purposes, not for an academically sequential biography. This makes it impossible to fit our story into precise chronological sequence of Jesus' ministry, though it seems to make a shift to an inclusion of Gentiles.
 
Mystic stated: designed for preaching and teaching purposes, not for an academically sequential biography.

Are you say preaching and teaching in charisma-like fashion (kerygma) is primarily designed to cause fervent unconscious passions and chaos?

Sounds like a corporate, governmental approach to keep the sheep stupefied ... stunned by the shock of it all ... on the end a great apoplexy and a shaft off Jinni ... rising in columns of abstract monumental value! From there the powers dash right into full corruption ... a learning experience on what goes on under the cover of night; the good, bad, ugly and beautiful risings --- Attica Finch!

Perhaps to profound for those following the lye 'n piously laid out ... as the way has a broadside! May take the jawbone of an ass ... clear Satyr? Hard to see or grasp ... as word too evolves ... one has to observe it over some stretch of time ...
 
paradox3 said:
Longing for what falls under the rich man's table is mentioned in Luke's parable of Lazarus at the gate. Interestingly enough, dogs are also involved in the narrative.

But the story doesn't appear to be a parallel account of Loaves and Crumbs.(Mark 7: 24-30)
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Imagine the lower beasties as ephemeral and apt to take flight without gentile activity ... night angels as Honk-Eire ... Shrieking psyche?

That strange sound coming out of the depths ... Lo it was!
 
Could there be a message about scarcity and abundance in the Loaves and Crumbs story?

I am thinking along the line of misperceptions.
 
paradox3 said:
Could there be a message about scarcity and abundance in the Loaves and Crumbs story
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Hmmm...interesting idea. There's an implication from the conclusion that Jesus represents abundance - that he cannot spread himself too thinly (scarcity).
 
Reminds me of the feeling that very young children sometimes have with the addition of siblings. They need convincing a bit that parental love is infinite; that sharing it with siblings doesn't lessen the amount of love each child gets.

OTOH, I'm sure that polygamists try to sell that bill of goods to second and subsequent wives, LOL.
 
Redbaron said:
Well, Matthew's gospel's rendition adds the phrase 'Lord, son of David" into the mix. Mark's gospel doesn't say anything about that. Does that make any difference to the story?
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"Son of David" would ordinarily be Jewish designation for "Messiah," who must descend from David. But it also has a less common usage as a reference to a Jewish exorcist and that seems to be the meaning here. In Jesus' day Solomon (son of David) was considered an expert in magic which was thought to
include exorcism.
 
paradox3 said:
Could there be a message about scarcity and abundance in the Loaves and Crumbs story?

I am thinking along the line of misperceptions.
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The woman thinks that "crumbs" will suffice to get her daughter healed, and so, might be a metaphor for imparted healing faith.
"The apostles said to the Lord: Increase our faith (Luke 17:5)." Evidently they have heeded Jesus instruction about healing the sick and performing exorcisms, but have not been as effective as they wished. They think they need Jesus to impart more faith. But notice how Jesus answers:
If you had faith the size of a mustard seed (the smallest of seeds), you could say to this mulberry tree, "Be uprooted and planted in the sea," and it would obey you." So what is the point of this Semitic hyperbole? Don't introspect to see how much faith you have because the very act of doing so automatically creates doubt. Rather, boldly act on the assumption that you have all the faith you need can you can get results. In other words, you don't need the whole load; acting on the small crumbs of faith can be very effective.


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paradox3 said:
Just googled "breadcrumbs and mustard seeds."

Found a really good sermon about our relationship with God.

Also found several recipes for chicken and lamb. :ROFLMAO:
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All depends on what you can gather ... or otherwise clean up on with a sense of sharing ... in a sad state of existence some Pun Kin are handy!

Maybe even as incarcerated critical matter? Sara Chasm ... Sara once being the head in one story ... thus all those swamp folk put heads on the wall ... here in NB some Moosehead may be encountered as swamp donkeys ... bogged down in passions!

Much void space to look into ... it is out there ...
 
My view
When Jesus says to The Woman ----it is not right to take the children's crumbs and throw them to the dogs --
the Woman then sees her chance to come back at Jesus and show Him that she has enough Faith in Him to know that she believes that whatever attention and power He had to Spare is enough to heal her daughter ------

The children's crumbs represent the Jews ----the dogs represent the Gentiles -----Jesus came to the Jews first ---and the Woman didn't argue with that which showed Jesus that she didn't expect him to heal her daughter but know He could heal her -----and had the faith and trust in Him to do so --So He did what she ask ----
 
I would have said the full loaves represent the Jews rather than the crumbs. Agreed about the dogs. I take the crumbs to mean what is left over after the Jews have eaten first.

Just as an aside, we get this spin on the story more from Matthew than Mark. Interesting that Luke doesn't even mention the encounter.
 
Thanks everyone for your participation on this thread. It's been both fun and enlightening.

So who's up for the next BPotW thread? Don't be shy. Go for it!
 
I attend, virtually these days, a weekly bible study, in lectio divina format, based on the lectionary. Next time a really interesting one comes up, I'll share.
 
Mystic said:
Pastoral sermons usually avoid this text because they are usually dismissed as crumby sermons. :cautious:
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Dissemination is expansive and dissociative so as to hide the greater purpose and reason from those not wishing to know ... a vestige group of wisdom?

Not knowing much appears popular!
 
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