An article "The church is killing its gay kids"

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Jon71 said:
I don't get how anyone who knows God could believe that homosexuality is a sin. People are born gay or straight or bi just like people are born black or white or Hispanic, tall or short, cis gendered or not-cis gendered, right handed, left handed or ambidextrous. It's not comparable to a sin which is a decision to disobey God. God made people gay, he never made anyone a drunkard, a murderer, an idolater, etc. The acerbic non sequitors that are often tossed do not reconcile with the loving nature of God.
This is what no one will ever lead away from believing. God is the author of creation. God is inerrant. God loves us. Those three truths drive me to support my gay brothers and sisters as fully as I can.
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--Hi Jon your Idea seems to lack understanding. As I was born a Mail. I was in in the army Jon . I know I can kill, was I born a killer poss yes. Am I able to control that yes or I would be in jail. I was a Liar from the time I was young . Today I still must struggle that I still do not use it.As a male I must be very careful how I view women. You must be obedient to GOD . If you would walk with HIM. His Word The Bible is a part of understanding are walk. He dose not ask us to obey . He demands we obey.I must learn to stop doing those things that He has said not to. You can find some of those things in His Word Jon.
 
airclean33 said:
This is from your post to me Jae. Perhaps I should have pull the hole post down.
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Not quite sure what you're on about here airclean. Seems to me we were in agreement that you had posted a Bible verse. Was there something else you were saying?
 
Pr. Jae said:
airclean, the term, "Minister" doesn't bother me. It is just not one we use in the Baptist tradition.



(y)



Really airclean? Where in Scripture do you see Jesus telling people that they must ask him to save them if they want to be born again?
/QUOTE
Airclean--The answer I all ready sent you.
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Rather, I believe they are those whose names were always in the book of life - those predestined before creation to be saved.



(y)



Do you believe it's possible for Christians to sin airclean?

/QUOTE-- airclean --Yes Jae as we are being tot by GOD and still learning . But I ask you . Can a Bank robber still rob banks? Or can some one who say they are saved , still go on being a drunk?[/QUOTE]


/QUOTE
It would certainly be a sign, yes. No Christian is always filled with the Spirit.



Some are daughters of God.[/QUOTE]

Airclean-Yes Jae or children of GOD.[/QUOTE]

/QUOTE

It will be resurrected when Christ returns.[/QUOTE]

Airclea-- Hi Jae can you show me in GODS word were you find the flesh will be raised ?[/QUOTE]

/QUOTE
That almost makes it sound like you're legalistically obeying God out of fear.

[/QUOTE]--So you believe you should have no fear of GOD?
Gen 22:12 He said, "Do not lay your hand on the lad or do anything to him; for now I know that you fear God, seeing you have not withheld your son, your only son, from me."
Act 13:26 "Brethren, sons of the family of Abraham, and those among you that fear God, to us has been sent the message of this salvation.
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1Pe 2:17 Honor all men. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honor the emperor.

There are many times ,that those who walked with GOD in The Bible had fear of GOD. With good reason . If I broke a window . I had great fear of my earthy dad when he got home, who loved me. Because I had done the thing he had said not to do.
 
airclean33 said:
--Hi Jon your Idea seems to lack understanding. As I was born a Male. I was in in the army Jon . I know I can kill, was I born a killer poss yes. Am I able to control that yes or I would be in jail. I was a Liar from the time I was young . Today I still must struggle that I still do not use it.As a male I must be very careful how I view women. You must be obedient to GOD . If you would walk with HIM. His Word The Bible is a part of understanding are walk. He dose not ask us to obey . He demands we obey.I must learn to stop doing those things that He has said not to. You can find some of those things in His Word Jon.
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Jon71 said:
I don't get how anyone who knows God could believe that homosexuality is a sin. People are born gay or straight or bi just like people are born black or white or Hispanic, tall or short, cis gendered or not-cis gendered, right handed, left handed or ambidextrous. It's not comparable to a sin which is a decision to disobey God. God made people gay, he never made anyone a drunkard, a murderer, an idolater, etc. The acerbic non sequitors that are often tossed do not reconcile with the loving nature of God.
This is what no one will ever lead away from believing. God is the author of creation. God is inerrant. God loves us. Those three truths drive me to support my gay brothers and sisters as fully as I can.
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One of the problems is that people make the mistake of thinking that because they know the Bible they must also know God and their faith becomes little more than an exercise in quoting their favourite Bible verses, or listening to those with whom they agree quote their favourite Bible verses. But knowing the Bible and knowing God are two separate and distinct things, complementary to each other but not identical with each other. "The God of the Bible" (or at least of those parts of the Bible that they like, which are almost always the legalistic parts because legalism is an easy framework to live by in that it gives us the rules and we can make a checklist to prove to ourselves that we've done it) becomes their static idol, rather than pursuing knowledge of the God who is witnessed to by the Bible but who is above and beyond the Bible.
 
BetteTheRed ----your quote -----
I'd say that the NASB is closer to "do thou" - an imperative - you MUST master it.

  1. An imperative sentence gives anything from a command or order, to a request, direction, or instruction. Imperative sentences are more intentional than exclamatory sentences and do require an audience; as their aim is to get the person(s) being addressed either to do or to not do something.
----your quote ----However, the ISV puts it as a question - will you take dominion over it?, which is most similar to "thou mayest:" - a choice.

This is my view ---

So here we see that the imperative sentence means ----several things ----a command ---a request ----a direction ----or instruction ---so for me all the scripture above although they use different words all mean the same thing ------God is giving Cain ---direction --and instruction telling him that Satan is on his door step edging him on through his emotions ----Cain was angry ---anger comes from fear ---fear is Satan's hook and fear stirs jealousy and envy and other emotions --God is telling him he need to take heed and take control of his emotions before they control him ------ this is what I believe -----we are influenced by and through our thinking to be tempted into sin by Satan ---it is first about control over emotions which will lead us to the right choice ------

You may think different and that is OK by me ------
 
One can never Master the word ... like god it is larger than the mortal and as explicit ... expansive ...

Some large feeling people ... can't see such wee things ... it is like a post-hole ... below them to understand lesser things ...

This creates a battle with atomism ... the belief in being supported by underlying small populations ... Browning Movement?

Expansion in the other directive ... that is implicitly humble ... mercibe ...
 
unsafe said:
BetteTheRed ----your quote -----
I'd say that the NASB is closer to "do thou" - an imperative - you MUST master it.

  1. An imperative sentence gives anything from a command or order, to a request, direction, or instruction. Imperative sentences are more intentional than exclamatory sentences and do require an audience; as their aim is to get the person(s) being addressed either to do or to not do something.
----your quote ----However, the ISV puts it as a question - will you take dominion over it?, which is most similar to "thou mayest:" - a choice.

This is my view ---

So here we see that the imperative sentence means ----several things ----a command ---a request ----a direction ----or instruction ---so for me all the scripture above although they use different words all mean the same thing ------God is giving Cain ---direction --and instruction telling him that Satan is on his door step edging him on through his emotions ----Cain was angry ---anger comes from fear ---fear is Satan's hook and fear stirs jealousy and envy and other emotions --God is telling him he need to take heed and take control of his emotions before they control him ------ this is what I believe -----we are influenced by and through our thinking to be tempted into sin by Satan ---it is first about control over emotions which will lead us to the right choice ------

You may think different and that is OK by me ------
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unsafe, I often think that you misunderstand the rules of conversation. It's not always a question of "thinking differently".

You're suggesting that three statements with different meaning mean the same thing.

Let's try it with some different words, just so I can make it a bit clearer:

1. Go and ride that bike.
2. I predict that you will ride that bike.
3. You can ride that bike, or not, as you choose.

Now do all three of those sentences mean the same thing? Of course not.

THIS is why talking about "God's Word" gets very tricky.
 
BetteTheRed ----- your quote ----- unsafe, I often think that you misunderstand the rules of conversation. It's not always a question of "thinking differently

You have every right to think as you like ------We do think different and for me it is all about thinking different -----

We disagree on your quote -----Now do all three of those sentences mean the same thing? Of course not.

You feel they don't mean the same and I do feel they mean the same ---we think different -----

We disagree on your quote ----THIS is why talking about "God's Word" gets very tricky.

You feel God's word is tricky ---I feel God's word is very clear and not tricky at all ---so we just think different -----

And nothing you can say to me will make me feel different ---as will nothing I can say to you will make you feel different ----

So our discussion further is pointless -----in my view -----

Have a great evening -----
 
unsafe said:
You feel they don't mean the same and I do feel they mean the same ---we think different -----
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Sorry unsafe, English grammar doesn't have to do with feelings. It has to do with rule-following. Here, @BetteTheRed is correct.

The ultimate answer would be, of course, to look at what the original manuscript(s) say. However, they have been lost.
 
Thank you, thank you, thank you, Jae. (P.S. Are you familiar with this particular piece of East of Eden, BTW? It has always been my seminal touchstone for why translation is important.)
 
Pr. Jae said:
Sorry unsafe, English grammar doesn't have to do with feelings. It has to do with rule-following. Here, @BetteTheRed is correct.

The ultimate answer would be, of course, to look at what the original manuscript(s) say. However, they have been lost.
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So Jae you think the GOD that wrote it is also gone missing?I have to tell you Jae He has not . I talk with Him almost every day. Here is the thing Jae ,He talks back.My GOD Lives yours it would seem not so much.
 
BetteTheRed said:
Thank you, thank you, thank you, Jae. (P.S. Are you familiar with this particular piece of East of Eden, BTW? It has always been my seminal touchstone for why translation is important.)
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Welcome Bette. (I'm not aware of anything from East of Eden. I'm just familiar with the name.)
 
airclean33 said:
So Jae you think the GOD that wrote it is also gone missing?I have to tell you Jae He has not . I talk with Him almost every day. Here is the thing Jae ,He talks back.My GOD Lives yours it would seem not so much.
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Love the transitional leaps you make sometimes airclean.
 
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