The Joys of John

[paradox3]

@Waterfall
I think many of us are familiar with Hanukkah because of its proximity to Christmas. It gets commercialized to some extent. Ditto for Diwali, the Hindu festival of light.

 

[Mendalla]

Also interesting that Jesus says Moses didn't initiate circumcision but the forefathers. Would that have been from the Canaanites or after that?

Given current historical and archaeological evidence is that, in fact, the Israelites probably were a Canaanite tribe who became dominant in the region during or after the Bronze Age collapse (rather being refugees from Egypt as Exodus claims), then it would follow that the practice of circumcision could have predated the writing of the Torah and the Torah simply made it "official".

I like the temple leader's response to Jesus. It's a reaction you see a lot when educated leaders are confronted with a knowledgeable, determine person who got their knowledge informally or claims to have received it through revelation. It's realistic, in other words. And thinking they are out to kill him after he publicly accuses them of not following The Law? Yeah, he might have been reading their minds. I'm sure a few were ready to jump him right there and then.

To be honest, claiming that someone who says that your temple's leadership are out to kill him is possessed by a demon seems quite appropriate. It's the equivalent of us going "that's crazy" in response. Probably applies to Jesus claims of divine authority to some degree, too.

 

[Mendalla]

@Waterfall
I think many of us are familiar with Hanukkah because of its proximity to Christmas. It gets commercialized to some extent. Ditto for Diwali, the Hindu festival of light.

And it's exposure, too. With the large South Asian population here in Ontario, Diwali has simply become more prominent due to the number celebrating it increasing. Same with Ramadan and Eid al'Adha. People now have Muslim neighbours (or even family members ) and there's more discussion of related events in the media, both mainstream and social.

 

[chansen]

We see the Jewish Leaders are amazed at Jesus' teaching ----they are Baffled as to how He could know these things without teaching ---

This immediately reminded on a Trump-esque boast:

People...the best people...come up to me, with tears in their eyes. They ask, "How is it that you are so smart, sir? How do you know all these things?"

It seems this sort of line has been working on a subset of the population for thousands of years.

"How did you know sir," indeed.

 

[paradox3]

John 7:25-36

Bible Gateway passage: John 7:25-36 - New English Translation

Questions About Jesus’ Identity - Then some of the residents of Jerusalem began to say, “Isn’t this the man they are trying to kill? Yet here he is, speaking publicly, and they are saying nothing to him. Do the ruling authorities really know that this man is the Christ? But we know where this...

www.biblegateway.com

Questions about Jesus' identity arise. The chief priests and Pharisees want to arrest him. They try to seize him but no one lays a hand on him.

Jesus says, "You will look for me but will not find me, because where I am going, you cannot come."

The Jewish leaders are puzzled. What did he mean?

 

[paradox3]

It seems that Jesus already knows how events will unfold, but it is not yet time.

Does supernatural intervention prevent the Jewish leaders from seizing him just yet?

 

[unsafe]

Jesus says, "You will look for me but will not find me, because where I am going, you cannot come."

The Jewish leaders are puzzled. What did he mean?

Love this statement by Jesus =====again this shows they have no Spiritual concept of what Jesus is saying ----all they have is the Logos word ----the Rhema word is far from therm =====

 

[paradox3]

Agreeing with @unsafe that the Jewish leaders are missing the whole point of Jesus.

However, this might be just fine. As we know from history, the Pharisees will form the basis of rabbinical Judaism.

Second temple Judaism (which Jesus followed) eventually diverged into early Christianity and rabbinical Judaism.

 

[unsafe]

Jesus was speaking openly and the people were surprised that the rules were not after Him ---so it made the people think that maybe the rules did believe He was the Christ as no one touched Him

The people make this statement ---

27 No, we know where this Man comes from; when the Christ arrives, no one is to know from what place He comes.

I say ----So it seems they were waiting for a messiah to just appear --and not be in the world -----

I think they would have gotten that thinking from Malachi 3 ---they would have known of this scripture ----

AMP ---
The Purifier
3 “Behold, I am going to send My messenger, and he will prepare and clear the way before Me. And the Lord [the Messiah], whom you seek, will suddenly come to His temple; the]Messenger of the covenant, in whom you delight, behold, He is coming,” says the Lord of hosts.

The crowd might have been confused as to who Jesus was and where He came from --but Jesus wasn't and tells them straight up ---that they do not know the one who sent Him ----

verse 28 --- I have not come on My own authority and of My own accord and as self-appointed, but the One Who sent Me is true (real, genuine, steadfast); and Him you do not know!

I say ----So this shows us that we can know of God but not Know God ------and that holds true today

The Jewish Leaders were eager to arrest Him but again with God this plan has a time for everything and the time had not come for Jesus to be taken ------Jesus was protected until the time was right for Him ----

Many did come believe in who Jesus was ---and the pharisees heard what the people were saying and did come to try arrest Jesus ----

Jesus spouts out Spiritual Revelations to them and they have no clue what He is saying ------

And that is the same today ---without the Holy Spirit indwelling in a person --their Spiritual understanding is veiled ------

Jesus always tells it like it is ---straight up ----calling a spade a spade ----no sugarcoating --no watering down ---we need more like Jesus in our Churches today in my view ----

 

[paradox3]

This is a fascinating journey through John. It is my first time reading it in its entirety.

 

[paradox3]

John 7:37-52

Bible Gateway passage: John 7:37-52 - New English Translation

Teaching About the Spirit - On the last day of the feast, the greatest day, Jesus stood up and shouted out, “If anyone is thirsty, let him come to me, and let the one who believes in me drink. Just as the scripture says, ‘From within him will flow rivers of living water.’” (Now he said this...

www.biblegateway.com

On the last day of the feast, Jesus teaches about the Spirit. The crowd has differing opinions. Some want to seize him, but again, no one lays a hand on him.

The officers return to the chief priests and Pharisees. None of them believe in Jesus.

Nicodemus, who previously went to Jesus at night, speaks out. "Our law doesn't condemn a man unless it first hears from him and learns what he is doing, does it?" (v.51)

 

[paradox3]

Too bad we don't know more about Nicodemus. He seems to be a guy with an open mind and a strong character. Just the kind of follower Jesus needs, even today.

 

[Mendalla]

Too bad we don't know more about Nicodemus. He seems to be a guy with an open mind and a strong character. Just the kind of follower Jesus needs, even today.

Yeah, he's kind of a foil for the rest of the leaders, isn't he. The one good egg in the crowd sort of thing. The RCs, Eastern Orthodox, and Oriental Orthodox churches have all canonized him, in fact. In at least one tradition, Nicodemus shares his feast day with Joseph of Arimathea (the guy whose tomb Jesus was buried in and in Arthurian mythology, the guy who brought the Holy Grail to Britain).

The whole thing about a prophet not coming from Galilee thing is interesting, especially given that at least one older Gospel has Jesus born in Bethlehem as the council thinks the Messiah should be. I suppose that might not have been well-known, though. They keep harping on it, too, even using it against Nicodemus. Apparently Galilee was not looked on well by the Jerusalem crowd.

 

[paradox3]

According to John's Gospel, Nicodemus plays a role in the burial of Jesus. Makes sense that he would share a feast day with Joseph of Arimathea.

 

[Mendalla]

According to John's Gospel, Nicodemus plays a role in the burial of Jesus. Makes sense that he would share a feast day with Joseph of Arimathea.

My thoughts too but I wasn't sure if you wanted that spoiler yet.

 

[unsafe]

This verse tells us that Jesus is announcing something very important

Jesus stood, and He cried in a loud voice, If any man is thirsty, let him come to Me and drink!

I say ---Here Jesus is calling anyone who Believes in Him in their inner most being shall flow rivers of Living water ---and this water is a continual Flow of water ---as He is speaking of the Holy Spirit who will come

And again this belief is not human surface or a wishy washy belief ---this is a deeper rooted belief ====

verse 38 AMP --- believes in Me [who cleaves to and trusts in and relies on Me
Some people start to believe and some remain in unbelief ----

Some questioned where the Messiah was coming from Galilee --Bethlehem ----as the scriptures says He comes from the offspring of David ---

So there was division and tension among the people concerning Him

Jesus came to divide not to bring peace as so many people like to think ----

Some wanted to arrest Him but on one touched Him ---- the Guards go to the chief Priests and Pharisees and they ask the guards why they haven't brought Him in ---they were amazed as to what He was saying ----

The Pharisees say to the guards are you diluted ---and led astray -----

Nicodemus kinda stands up to the Pharisees here and says does the law convict someone before a hearing is set ---

Their answer was for Nicodemus to look up the scripture that says no Prophet comes from Galilee ----

These Pharisees are suppose to be teachers of God's word and should know the Scriptures well ---but in their diluted knowledge of the Scripture they show their ignorance of really knowing the Scriptures ===

From Google
It's incredible that these supposed experts did not know that five prophets came out of Galilee— Jonah, Nahum, Hosea, Elijah, and Elisha. Jesus was born in Bethlehem and raised in Nazareth, which is in Galilee.

 

[paradox3]

John 8:1-11

Bible Gateway passage: John 8:1-11 - New English Translation

But Jesus went to the Mount of Olives. Early in the morning he came to the temple courts again. All the people came to him, and he sat down and began to teach them. The experts in the law and the Pharisees brought a woman who had been caught committing adultery. They made her stand in front of...

www.biblegateway.com

Today we come to John's story about the woman caught in adultery. It is a well-known narrative although it doesn't show up anywhere in the Revised Common Lectionary.

The experts in the Law and the Pharisees bring the woman to Jesus, seemingly as a test. Moses commanded them to stone such a woman. But charges could be brought against Jesus (presumably by the Romans) if he invokes the death penalty.

Jesus famously says, "Whoever among you is guiltless may be the first to throw a stone at her." (v.7 NET)

The Jewish leaders flee without condemning her. Neither does Jesus condemn her and he tells her to go & sin no more.

 

[paradox3]

A curious detail in this story is that twice Jesus bends over and writes on the ground. We are not told what he wrote.

Was he stalling for time? Gaining his composure? Thinking it over?

Was he recording actual words? Or doodling, maybe?

 

[GordW]

John 8:1-11

Bible Gateway passage: John 8:1-11 - New English Translation

But Jesus went to the Mount of Olives. Early in the morning he came to the temple courts again. All the people came to him, and he sat down and began to teach them. The experts in the law and the Pharisees brought a woman who had been caught committing adultery. They made her stand in front of...

www.biblegateway.com

Today we come to John's story about the woman caught in adultery. It is a well-known narrative although it doesn't show up anywhere in the Revised Common Lectionary.

The experts in the Law and the Pharisees bring the woman to Jesus, seemingly as a test. Moses commanded them to stone such a woman. But charges could be brought against Jesus (presumably by the Romans) if he invokes the death penalty.

Jesus famously says, "Whoever among you is guiltless may be the first to throw a stone at her." (v.7 NET)

The Jewish leaders flee without condemning her. Neither does Jesus condemn her and he tells her to go & sin no more.

It is an intriguing story (where was the partner after all--usually adultery takes [at least] 2 people). It is also a passage where the textual evidence is mixed at best. the footnote in my Jewish annotated New Testament (which uses the NRSV) reads:
"The most ancient authorities lack 7:53-8:11; other authorities add the passage here or after 7:6 or after 21:25 or after Luke 21:38, with variations of text; some mark the passage as doubtful."

So one of the questions we could raise is why this story was added in to the tradition....

 

[paradox3]

Yes, the question of the story's authenticity has been raised. It's one of those cases where you might be inclined to think, if it's not true it should be.

Perhaps this explains why it was not included in the RCL?