Pale Blue Dot

[Neo]

I've always considered "time" to be intimately connected with space, or "matter" to be more accurate. Gravity wells, produced by the mass of galaxies, stars or planets, have the ability to bend and slow down time. But in a vacuum, devoid of dimension and matter, time doesn't exist.

The following quote on time from the Tibetan is a different perspective:

The spiritual man is not conscious of time, once he is separated from the physical body. Time is the sequential registration by the brain of states of awareness, and of progressive contacts with phenomena. There is no such thing as time on the inner planes, as humanity understands it. There are only cycles of activity or of non-activity.

- from the book: The Ray and the Initiations (A Treatise on the Seven Rays, Vol. V)

 

[Luce NDs]

Spiritual man ... a person in a mood ... or having just blown his temper ... so that he knows little ... especially what time it is?

Sounds like an essential state of mind, soul or psyche ... and this is a timeless device! Since people see this as dark ... it must be an abstract thingy ... sort of a darker shade ... holy crap a cloudy thing ... for those people wandering lonely ... because the determinate kind won't have anything to do with those drew out of time ... or Drae Goans for short ... some believe they can fly ... like a flash in the corner of a well-rounded "i" if you can emma jin nations like that ... fa route ...

 

[Waterfall]

Actually, time is one of those things that is still up in the air.

It is a way of measuring motion, but it is also relative suggesting there is more to it than that. If you travel fast enough, time measurably slows down (in fact, time is slower for a faster moving object at any speed but it's not measurable at the speeds we are used to dealing with day by day). That's from Special Relativity and it is proven. In fact, we use it everyday to keep our GPS satellites' clocks synchronized with our Garmins and iPhones. Because the satellites move at a high velocity relative to ground stations, their clocks slow down relative to the clocks in the ground stations, requiring us to build in a correction that is calculated using some of Einstein's math. At the speed of light, time stops completely (ie. photons, the only objects that move that fast, do not experience time at all). Technically speaking, if you could exceed the speed of light, time would flow backwards for you but that, among other paradoxes that arise, is why Einstein hypothesized that exceeding the speed of light is impossible.

Some suggest that there is no time, but that all times exist simultaneously and what we perceive as "time" moving is really us moving through space within time. They even have math to show how you can derive the time dilation effect (what I talked about above) from this position.

And there are other takes on it.

Everyone involved in physics and cosmology agrees that there is "time" but exactly what it is and how it operates is still elusive.

So I'd say @Void is basically right and, yet, it can't be proven yet and may, in fact, end up being wrong.

Makes me wonder, when Jesus says he is the light....can he reverse any known law known to man? In the above video that Inanna posted, can an omelette be turned back into an egg? Why was the sun created after the light? Or the sun created after the plants (all in Genesis)? Or even how can the dead rise again? God is outside of time or IS time? Time and God is a concept or is it real?

 

[Luce NDs]

Once heis blown it he become more calm passionate ... a state of psyche bought on by the lady of the lake ... Hiawatha in some traditions ... they love to calm a man with a proper floe ...

 

[Luce NDs]

Makes me wonder, when Jesus says he is the light....can he reverse any known law known to man? In the above video that Inanna posted, can an omelette be turned back into an egg? Why was the sun created after the light? Or the sun created after the plants (all in Genesis)? Or even how can the dead rise again? God is outside of time or IS time? Time and God is a concept or is it real?

Is that irrational or what?

 

[Hermann]

Sure, events unfold, and we have arbitrarily divided the sequential unfolding of events into segments of time. As long as we all agree on this segmentation, we have a useful framework of reference that is common to us all, that we all can go by and that helps us understand our reality, ourselves, and each other. Time and distance are measurements we have invented to measure reality, and they serve us well. Whether or not they exist in an absolute sense is not really important.

To me, time is just an arbitrary segmentation of eternity into measurable units. And eternity, to me, is not an endlessly long time but merely the absence of time.

I'm just not into time. I vastly prefer timelessness.

 

[Waterfall]

I'm just not into time. I vastly prefer timelessness.

How would you know this, having never experienced timelessness?

 

[Mendalla]

Makes me wonder, when Jesus says he is the light....can he reverse any known law known to man? In the above video that Inanna posted, can an omelette be turned back into an egg? Why was the sun created after the light? Or the sun created after the plants (all in Genesis)? Or even how can the dead rise again? God is outside of time or IS time? Time and God is a concept or is it real?

IF there was a supernatural, all-powerful deity (and I'm agnostic on the point as you well know), then I'm sure that messing with time and things like relativity would be within that deity's power. A less omnipotent deity like that of process theology, perhaps not. Perhaps that God would be as trapped by relativity as we are.

 

[Hermann]

How would you know this, having never experienced timelessness?

I experience timelessness all the time!

If you want a rational argument in favour of timelessness, then there is the Law of Complementarity, which appears to be one of the basic cosmic laws, if not THE basic cosmic law. According to Complementarity, opposites necessiate each other, and time necessitates timelessness. Or, in other words, time does not exist because it exists, or time proves timelessness truthful.

 

[Neo]

Don't we all experience relative timelessness while we sleep?

 

[Waterfall]

Don't we all experience relative timelessness while we sleep?

define timelessness......does that include we don't age, grow, think?

 

[Layton November]

"Small" and "large" are relative to each other, and relative to the viewpoint of the observer, and space and time may just be human inventions: cosmic analyses we have created to enable us to analytically comprehend a universe that is beyond analytical comprehension. And if this incomprehensible universe really is an inseparably unified whole in an ultimate state of synthesis, then we are not only part of IT--we are IT!


Getting IT

IT is we; we are IT.
We can't comprehend IT without experiencing IT,
But we can experience IT without comprehending IT--
For we are IT!

IT reveals everything;
IT explains nothing.

The interpretations
Of ITs revelations
Are our creations.

-Hermann


I don't mean to say that the cosmic analysis is not true. If the cosmic analysis is undertaken according to the principles of logic, and the scientific method is strictly followed, then the cosmic analysis is analytically true. But if the universe is in an ultimate state of unity or synthesis, then the cosmic synthesis is the ultimate and higher Truth. (And is goes without saying that synthesis is antithetical to analysis.)

Then there are two diametrically opposed types of truth: small t truth and capital T Truth: analysis and synthesis: duality and nonduality; with the analysis being relatively true--relative to the viewpoint of the observer--and the synthesis absolutely True. But absolute cosmic Truth can only be experienced, and is being experienced, in the pure, unconceptualized experience of reality.

A human being is a part of the whole, called by us, "Universe," a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest -- a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty. Nobody is able to achieve this completely, but the striving for such achievement is in itself a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security -- Albert Einstein

 

[Neo]

A human being is a part of the whole, called by us, "Universe," a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest -- a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty. Nobody is able to achieve this completely, but the striving for such achievement is in itself a part of the liberation and a foundation for inner security -- Albert Einstein

Einstein was definitely an initiate of the mysteries. I love quotes like these, they echo the ancient wisdom.

 

[Neo]

define timelessness......does that include we don't age, grow, think?

Only our consciousness temporally experiences timelessness. Physically we are still connected to the body via the life line to the heart, the "silver cord" of the Bible. It's the connection to the head that's disconnected during sleep. If the life line breaks during sleep then of course the body begins to disintegrate, the opposite of growing. And then we definitely and completely fall out of time into timelessness.

 

[Mendalla]

Whereas, scientifically speaking, we are always experiencing time because we exist in space-time. We may not always be conscious of it, but it is still happening. Timelessness would only exist prior to the Big Bang. Certain meditative states may give us an experience of something like timelessness but we still exist in space-time, we have detached from the experience of it at conscious level is what has happened.

(Well strictly speaking, photons may experience the universe as timeless because they move at the speed of light per my earlier post, but that's not something any human will experience).

 

[Neo]

(Well strictly speaking, photons may experience the universe as timeless because they move at the speed of light per my earlier post, but that's not something any human will experience).

Could this be the key to how the great Teachers gain the ability to plant a foot in both camps, i.e. be aware of the spiritual and the physical planes simultaneously?

It's said that the more spiritually advanced we become the more we draw the finer sub-atomic materials, such as electrons, into our physical being. We become more and more like light itself, answering why auras of light are often depicted around such Teachers. This could also shed light, no pun intended, on the mystery known as "the resurrection", a myth-phenomenon attributed to more than just the man Jesus.

 

[Mendalla]

Perhaps but I'll believe that to people who believe in a spiritual plane.

 

[Hermann]

Don't we all experience relative timelessness while we sleep?

Yes, and when unconscious or sedated, or when in a meditative, contemplative, hypnotic, trance or ecstatic state, when, as we say, "time stands still."

 

[Hermann]

Whereas, scientifically speaking, we are always experiencing time because we exist in space-time. We may not always be conscious of it, but it is still happening. Timelessness would only exist prior to the Big Bang. Certain meditative states may give us an experience of something like timelessness but we still exist in space-time, we have detached from the experience of it at conscious level is what has happened.

(Well strictly speaking, photons may experience the universe as timeless because they move at the speed of light per my earlier post, but that's not something any human will experience).

Why not? After all, we humans are energy, and to experience ourselves as such is entirely plausible. And prior to the Big Bang we were energy that had not yet split itself into opposites. The energy before the Big Bang was nondualistic energy, if you will. We, the collective cosmic we, are the totality of energy, right back to before the Big Bang, before space-time. And some of this nondualistc energy might still be around, and still be inseparably united with the split and chaotic space-time energy of which we human beings are but one of many forms.

If, as many philosophers speculate, reality is an an ultimate state of nonduality or synthesis, then it does not seem far-fetched or unnatural for us to experience this state. Indeed, I think and feel--from personal experience!--that mystical experience is experiencing ourselves as the indivisible, unnameable, self-generative singularity of eternal energy of which we are an inseparable part and which we ultimately are.


The TAO that can be told is not the TAO.
-Lao Tsu


The TAO that can be experienced is the TAO.
-Hermann

 

[Delightful Life]

For me, belief in an eternal God is the belief that there is a realm which exists beyond time, in which past, present and future indeed wrap themselves around each other, so to speak. There is also a realm in which space has no meaning. Everything is together all at once. It is the basis for me of my belief in God's omniscience. My belief in God's grace assures me that at some point I will exist in that realm. In what form, I can't be sure, but I believe that I will and that I will be conscious of it. How that will happen I am content to leave to God.

cool & neet and nifty :3

are you looking forward to creating new universes when you get to that realm or plunging back in or chats on why canucks never won a stanley?