What is Faith? It is not trust.

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Jae said:
They're not examples, chansen, but metaphors. And no metaphor is perfect. Still, they show that you are willing to believe in the existence of some things that are invisible.

I do disagree with your definition of love. I don't agree that love's an emotion. Rather, I'd say love's an active decision. The Bible says that no one has greater love than one who will lay down their life for others. That's not something that's only emotion. I think a lot of problems in personal relationships are caused by the notion that love's just a feeling
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Do literalists ever consider the metaphorical virtues when they are hard on another track? Generally they never consider the alternate's ide ... their Pro states it is just another CON and it reflects ... because of lack of gathering anything ... huge jousts occur ... physically, mentally and emotionally! Have patience something will come 4th in time that's short and thus soon ... alas some can't get there heads about some images ... like the dark night of sol when the lights were out ...
 
Somewhere in the literature was a comment that a tryst was best if honest about all things ... especially in what we know of infinite stretches.

Long ago I discovered this was a long way off with some solid faiths ... they are way out there! This occurs when yyou examine the heavens ... someone ate a big hole in it ... there's not much solid intuit ... maybe nex tuit? The someone told me tuits were round abouts ... so there could be turns of events ... and how things wend ... leaving all things open to query ... the bible says: "question all things" and if in the bible is that solid? Firmly we question ... what's got these folk on the wrong tracks? If you probe deeply you find the logi as part of and overriding system of logistics that has been wasted ... a prodigal offshoot?

In the distance ... alo' sigh 'n ... in the celestial winds ... sometimes observed as 4 degrees absolute as an irregularity in the abstract ... here a dippy point in space that someone ID'd as a Black Hole ... a place of rest for the wicked? Sometimes they never come TU! Una WOKE ... no wish to ...

Sometimes the reason to pay attention to classic literature as not just myths ... there might be something there about lights in GEO Ghia and Lambda's ... as not everything is shades by the shadowy lady ... is that sordid or what Thor did ... generates an axis? So the spin ... a bit English ... there's a lot of other tongues residing there in the ink & anon ... patience id'll come to yah ...

The farmers even say that the cows will freshen up ... but you cannot speak of it ... even if it is Qua Naan (Ka nôn) as exotic? There wae are screwed down from lack of abstract ... hysterical ramping of what little have? Like a wedge in the celestial spheres ... and further wringing of yah Annes ... due to hairy phobias ...

Someone told me that hairy once meant scary and thus the logic continues ...
 
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Pavlos Maros said:
I don't think you actually read the OP, Jae. The clue was in the thread title.
Go back and read it, then you will understand that trust and faith are not the same. Do try to do better please.
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It's OK Jae ---Real faith and Real trust are way beyond Pavlos Maros's pay grade --PM's intellect is all that Pavlos has and can rely on -----anything else is foolish to Pavlos Maros's brain cause the right Spiritual discernment is needed and that PM does not have ------

Intellectual Faith which is what PM has is limited to--- what one sees in this world --feels in this world --hears from this world ---tastes what is made in this world and touches what is in this world -

Spiritual Faith and Trust is way beyond PM's grasp and Understanding -----

Meaning of testable

TESTABLE | English meaning - Cambridge Dictionary​

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Cambridge Dictionary
https://dictionary.cambridge.org › dictionary › testable

TESTABLE definition: 1. able to be proved by testing: 2. able to be tested: 3. able to be proven by testing:

And all these things are invisible, yet all are testable.

I say --not all

11, Worldly Peace---you can't test worldly Peace ---you experience peace within yourself and others will notice your peaceful state ---so peace is not invisible ----

12,Worldly Love ----is a feeling in this world ---and so you can only test a persons feelings to see if Love is there ---so love can be visible in this world ---So love is not invisible

13, Worldly Happiness---is an emotion in this world ----so you can only test a person's emotion to see if they are happy ----Happiness can be visible in this world so it is not invisible

14, Worldly Justice---is a virtue ---so in this world justice can be seen by ones behaviour so it is not invisible in this world ----

15,Worldly Freedom ---is a state of being ---and in this world our state of being is flawed and that can be seen so it is not invisible ---Can you test freedom ---you can tests your state of being --I would say

16, Worldly Courage ----is a emotion and is visible by the person displaying it in this world ----so you can test the person's emotion only to see if they have courage ----and courage is in invisible

17, Worldly Forgiveness ----is a conscious Choice -----and will be visible to the person that will be forgiven ----so forgiveness is not invisible -----you can only test yourself to whether you will forgive or not ---

18, Worldly Hope ----is the expectation of something desired ---so Hope in my view cannot be tested as hope is in our future ----and worldly hope can turn into burnt ashes -----called False hope ---I don't think you can test Hope itself as you expect what you hope for or you don't ----

19, Worldly Trust----is a belief ---and has to be earned ---and can be tested and is not invisible ---it can be experienced and seen in this world

20, Worldly Faith ---is a belief in what we See --Feel ---Hear--Taste and Touch ---so it relies on our 5 Senses ---Faith can be tested --and we can display our Faith in this seen world so Faith is not invisible ----
 
There the revenge lover goes trashing a creation again ...

Does deified defy determinacy in mortals given our limited powers of observation when yoked by blinders? Always the expression: "I am better than thou because of Gods choice ... then situation ethics kicks in ... the sidekick to the presumed hero clustered on the opposed side of the void?

What was ova there countering them? Obviously the plae Kate Eire and the clown to make the painful lesson about pious Christianity a bit of a joust ... thus stuck according to the classic Ք that thing that Jesus got in the ribs as a pain in theis ide ... stick it in the dirt and listen to the sordid myths!

There is an edge to what is hidden and sacred ... mostly because of vengeance regarding virtue being exposed ... the powers cannot tolerate truth ... especially with what lies all about us ... corruption? Some old sage did say that corruption was with us ... also a mule ... did jah see it? DidjahEK'd ... as prodigal ...

Prodigal Summa was a grand myth ... very ole sum ... theis TAB!
 
Whomever is moaning about the use of "Invisible" Best talk to Jae.
This was stated by Jae in post#31 "If your problem with the chair is that you can't see it, how will you ever put your trust in other things that you can't see, like wind, gravity, peace, and love?"
And this from Jae at post #34 "They're not examples, chansen, but metaphors. And no metaphor is perfect. Still, they show that you are willing to believe in the existence of some things that are invisible." He brought it up.
 
Pavlos Maros said:
Whomever is moaning about the use of "Invisible" Best talk to Jae.
This was stated by Jae in post#31 "If your problem with the chair is that you can't see it, how will you ever put your trust in other things that you can't see, like wind, gravity, peace, and love?"
And this from Jae at post #34 "They're not examples, chansen, but metaphors. And no metaphor is perfect. Still, they show that you are willing to believe in the existence of some things that are invisible." He brought it up.
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In post #30, @chansen wrote, "You hand out invisible chairs and say we can trust them. I don't buy it. More people shouldn't." I responded to that
 
Jae said:
In post #30, @chansen wrote, "You hand out invisible chairs and say we can trust them. I don't buy it. More people shouldn't." I responded to that
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Ok. However, you did liken peace and love to invisibility. Which was the point that other imbecile, was responding too.
 
Pavlos Maros said:
Ok. However, you did liken peace and love to invisibility. Which was the point that other imbecile, was responding too.
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No, I didn't. I asked @chansen how he can believe in those invisible things but I didn't liken those things to invisibility.

And, hey, stop it. No one who's here is an "imbecile"
 
So you didn't say this in post #31 "that you can't see, like wind, gravity, peace, and love?" Did you mean he was "Blind" or was you using the generalized term for those things being intangible. "Cant see, cant touch, cant smell, cant hear, cant taste, so in effect invisible." "The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike. - Delos banning McKown."
And yes that person did show they were an imbecile by quote mining. They lost all their credibility in that one instant.
 
Jae said:
No, I didn't. I asked @chansen how he can believe in those invisible things but I didn't liken those things to invisibility.

And, hey, stop it. No one who's here is an "imbecile"
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To sae such a thing is to be blind to what the word says surrounds us ... a great mule! Then there are those chairs with holes holy por Celin ... and thro' there pours you know what ...

It is like the conflict between Psyche and Cupid ... once know as Eros and Eris and therein the dissonant ... a disturbing read if you read intu ide ... initially!

Somme never get ah round tuit ... a closed circle ... it is rumored ... intellect is loched out as it is it tho't wise ... thus it wends!

From there space warps ... no wonder I feel so bent out of shape ... especially about in existential -ism being a word that you can believe as an "-ism"!

So there it wasn't as outlined by incarnate ... you have to experience it! Its why vapors condense ...

Do you know folk that look up words like incarnate in the Lexus? Hoo'd wish to know if you're a confidence man to begin with ...
 
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Please be advised that the use of the word 'imbecile' is insulting and unnecessary. We would advise all to refrain from the use of insults and slurs. Thank you.
WC2 Mods
 
WC2Mods said:
Please be advised that the use of the word 'imbecile' is insulting and unnecessary. We would advise all to refrain from the use of insults and slurs. Thank you.
WC2 Mods
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If you're handing out warnings to people in conversations I'm involved in, but I'm not at least one of the people being warned, the United Church will not be happy.

And what I'm really confused about is who the "imbecile" is. Is it Berserk? If so, that's the wrong insult. I have many others that are more applicable. Just ask.
 
WC2Mods said:
Please be advised that the use of the word 'imbecile' is insulting and unnecessary. We would advise all to refrain from the use of insults and slurs. Thank you.
WC2 Mods
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What word or synonym would be appropriate, when someone does something extremely foolish or idiotic? Could you say for instant Imbecilic or
Imbecile-like, as long as you are not calling them an imbecile directly.
And what of quid pro quo when someone is constantly rude to or about you.
 
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No such word is polite or necessary because anyone can easily recognize your irrational screed without the need for insulting labels.
 
Berserk, have you seen a gerontologist to diagnose your cognitive decline? I have noticed a very pronounced increase in the weird misuse of words, tenses, parts of speech. As loathesome as is your personality and your theology, you used to be noticeably more literate. Now, every post contains at least one, often a number, of errors.
 
Mystic said:
I'm sure the United Church is gratified by your "forced apology" rightly engineering by Aaron.
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And the United Church was fine with you accusing me of "not wanting healing that badly" when my son was in the Cardiac Critical Care Unit at Sick Kids Toronto.

So I don't give the United Church social media group (lead by Aaron) any points when it comes to knowing when an online comment merits an apology or any other action. They are f***ing useless.
 
chansen said:
And the United Church was fine with you accusing me of "not wanting healing that badly" when my son was in the Cardiac Critical Care Unit at Sick Kids Toronto.
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Ah, now you resort to the desperate expedient of lying.
(1) Jesus taught that the right kind of faith can produce miracles. As an atheist, you be definition have no faith in God granting you a healing.
Without faith "wanting healing badly enough" is irrelevant in your case.
(2) As I recently noted here, I have experienced many clairvoyant revelations, but never a healing miracle achieved through my own private prayers, no matter how badly I wanted the miracle, though I have seen healings through prayer groups of which I was a part. If I've never experienced effective faith for healing, I certainly would not expect an atheist to acquire such faith.
 
Mystic said:
Ah, now you resort to the desperate expedient of lying.
(1) Jesus taught that the right kind of faith can produce miracles. As an atheist, you be definition have no faith in God granting you a healing.
Without faith "wanting healing badly enough" is irrelevant in your case.
(2) As I recently noted here, I have experienced many clairvoyant revelations, but never a healing miracle achieved through my own private prayers, no matter how badly I wanted the miracle, though I have seen healings through prayer groups of which I was a part. If I've never experienced effective faith for healing, I certainly would not expect an atheist to acquire such faith.
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Course, in the New Testament, while faith's often a significant theme, Jesus' compassion and power to heal were not always contingent on the individual's faith
 
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