TRUMP - Some people think......... How do you feel?

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Pontifex Geronimo 13 said:
Well, there are Muslims who follow the Koran, who I would consider to be Muslims, and there are Muslims who do not follow the Koran, or even know anything about it. I would not consider them Muslims.

Just like Christians who never crack a bible are not Christians.

ISIL or ISIS are true Muslims. They should not be welcome.

This is David Wood. He likes to show people what the Koran says. We are being fed a load of BS by the media what Muslims believe.

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I guess by your definitions the KKK are true Christians. And those of us who don't follow the directives in our Bibles to stone children to death, own slaves, rape, murder, commit genocide - we aren't really Christians.
 
Seeler said:
I guess by your definitions the KKK are true Christians. And those of us who don't follow the directives in our Bibles to stone children to death, own slaves, rape, murder, commit genocide - we aren't really Christians.
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Words have meanings. Saturn may look like a star to most people, but it is not. As Jesus did not give any directives in our bibles to do those things, I can assume you don't know who Christ is. And as you bring up a lot of OT problems that baby Christians have to struggle with and atheists like to bring up to discredit God, I can assume you don't have much of an understanding of who God is or who we are in the whole scope of things.

 
You do know what happens when you ASS U Me...don't you?

Rather than relying on a second-hand description of several out of context verses (a bit like making that daft story where Elijah has the bear murder the children for laughing at his bald head some sort of central theme in Christianity), I'd seriously invite you to check out a series I found very educational: http://www.livingthequestions.com/xcart/home.php?cat=493 Following this series, we also made a visit to our local mosque, with whom we had previously established relations. We've found them a little more conservative than some of the more liberal Muslims many of us know/know of (our spiritual leader, the Rev Dr. E____ becomes Mrs Joe for her relationship to her husband, for example), but they're eager participants in our refugee family plans, offering translation services, grocery shopping/dietary assistance, etc. And in fact, the part of Ontario wherein I reside is more conservative than many, anyways; why would it be different for the Muslim population?
 
Kimmio said:
Now this is funny...and ironic. Even a bald eagle named Uncle Sam disapproves of Trump!

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...atch-donald-trump-dodges-bald-eagle/77087796/

To be fair, we don't know if he'd be friendly with any candidate, probably not because he's a wild bird, but it's still funny!
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Sorry forgot to include Mohammed Ali's name - former boxer and American Muslim who criticized Trump.

Doh, and I quoted the wrong comment of my own. Oh well. Too lazy to fix it right now, it's tedious on my phone.
 
A trump card is good for collapse of the house ... or is that in the bridging game?

Something has to bring the powers down in tears ... a virtue AL RIP PUR? Pure old fart of the ancient school of war without restrictions? Could encourage and end ... a kind of ethic in some praxis!
 
Not me. Hoping for good changes - a turn about - to come out of present troubles. An "ah hah" moment that we might not see in the din, but begins the process. I'll keep hoping no matter what.

Can a change of heart soften the hard hearted?
 
Real people don't learn without a pain in the ass!

Is trump the pain or is the general paradigm the pain in the other tensor ?
 
Pontifex Geronimo 13 said:
Words have meanings. Saturn may look like a star to most people, but it is not. As Jesus did not give any directives in our bibles to do those things, I can assume you don't know who Christ is. And as you bring up a lot of OT problems that baby Christians have to struggle with and atheists like to bring up to discredit God, I can assume you don't have much of an understanding of who God is or who we are in the whole scope of things.

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The Bible I read contains both the Hebrew and Christian scriptures. Jesus ofteen quoted from the Hebrew scriptures. Did he pick and choose? - we all do.
You judge me not to know who Christ is and to lack understanding of who God is.
I could say the same about you. From your posts it appears to me that you have a very limited understanding of the scope and wonder of God, or in Jesus who revealeed God's love and God's Spirit to us.
Fortunately I do not judge all Christians by what I see in your writing.
 
Thus the Pix Zae in the Celtic sharpening of odds ...

Oddly enough many Christians support hate for the other and that reciprocates somehow ... a dark function to those that can't see logic, formerly shaped as LOGOS!

One could say that that's the word ... and then someone tried to neuter the expression of experience ... after the production of unique experience everything and everybody we numbed ... so we are told by autocrats. So we are not allowed to go there ... except with great trepidation ... unless you're intrepid ... words uncommonly experienced by people fearing dark unknowns ... God is like that ... something you should get to know ...

Thus literary devices that those that don't know call the devil ... or satyrs in the shadow of the forest ... where wee green characters evolve ... rye even!
 
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The numbers deceive...

This article talks about how Bernie Sanders has only slightly fewer supporters on the Dem side than Trump has on the Republican side... But the wide gap between Sanders and Clinton is because there are simply more Democrats than Republican voters (and Donald Trump is the loudest most obnoxious one they've ever had - riding the wave of celeb/ populism). That does not mean he has the support of enough Americans to come close to winning. He's getting a kick out of alarming everybody.



It discusses how people should be talking more about how important it is that Democrats are moving towards Sander's Nordic style policy leanings. It just isn't as exciting, sensational for TV, perhaps - rather humble in fact - but it is an important shift. More people are going to go with what they know - that'd be Clinton. But it doesn't mean she hasn't noticed the shift within her own party supporters.

We've got to stop believing that the basest views have more influence, or allowing them more influence.

http://www.vox.com/2015/12/11/9888034/trump-sanders
 
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Seeler said:
The Bible I read contains both the Hebrew and Christian scriptures. Jesus ofteen quoted from the Hebrew scriptures. Did he pick and choose? - we all do.
You judge me not to know who Christ is and to lack understanding of who God is.
I could say the same about you. From your posts it appears to me that you have a very limited understanding of the scope and wonder of God, or in Jesus who revealeed God's love and God's Spirit to us.
Fortunately I do not judge all Christians by what I see in your writing.
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:) What one calls very limited, another may call accurate. Words are little signs designed to convey meaning.

When I say God, Jesus, Holy Spirit, Christian, Grace, Faith - words like that, my definition is in line with the bible's representation of the above. The Quran on the one hand affirms the bible's representation, while on the other rejects.

Example: The Quran says Jesus was not killed on a cross and raised from the dead and was not God. Christians are low lifes that are to be oppressed and made to pay Muslims.

So, when I say Jesus - it is not the Jesus of the quran, but the Jesus of the bible.
When I say Jesus, it is a wholly different person than who Chanson thinks it is. Or BetteTheRed or maybe you. I have met Jesus, just like airclean33 and millions others.

The bible is the only (not the book of Mormon) accurate portrait of who Jesus, God and the Holy Spirit are. And using it as the map to find them - your face is always looking in the right direction to see them. If you want to say Jesus did no miracles and is not the lamb of God. You will always be looking in the wrong direction at his approach and walk right by unless he stops you. And the more you reject about him, the further your gaze is away from him until there is not even the chance of a peripheral glance.

That is why there are so many cool testimonies of atheists who are at the end of their rope. They have always kept their back to Jesus - so they just have to stop and turn around and there he is right there. That is why I think it is easier for atheists to find Jesus than people who make up a different God.
 
Pontifex Geronimo 13 said:
Example: The Quran says Jesus was not killed on a cross and raised from the dead and was not God. Christians are low lifes that are to be oppressed and made to pay Muslims.
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Much of your post I have no problem with. Your use of the above example, though, simply shows that, like the Bible, the Koran can be quoted selectively to support a particular point of view.

The Koran also says that Christians are closest to Muslims in love and humility, and that Christians and Jews are among those who believe in God and will be rewarded by God. Christians and Jews along with Muslims are also repeatedly called People of the Word. You see, it's all a matter of which verses you choose to cherry pick, just as Christians can cherry pick the Bible to make it suit their pre-existing beliefs. Honest biblical (or koranic) understanding would seek the spirit rather than the strict letter, just as Jesus did with the Torah.
 
Pontifex Geronimo 13 said:
:) What one calls very limited, another may call accurate. Words are little signs designed to convey meaning.

When I say God, Jesus, Holy Spirit, Christian, Grace, Faith - words like that, my definition is in line with the bible's representation of the above. The Quran on the one hand affirms the bible's representation, while on the other rejects.

Example: The Quran says Jesus was not killed on a cross and raised from the dead and was not God. Christians are low lifes that are to be oppressed and made to pay Muslims.

So, when I say Jesus - it is not the Jesus of the quran, but the Jesus of the bible.
When I say Jesus, it is a wholly different person than who Chanson thinks it is. Or BetteTheRed or maybe you. I have met Jesus, just like airclean33 and millions others.

The bible is the only (not the book of Mormon) accurate portrait of who Jesus, God and the Holy Spirit are. And using it as the map to find them - your face is always looking in the right direction to see them. If you want to say Jesus did no miracles and is not the lamb of God. You will always be looking in the wrong direction at his approach and walk right by unless he stops you. And the more you reject about him, the further your gaze is away from him until there is not even the chance of a peripheral glance.

That is why there are so many cool testimonies of atheists who are at the end of their rope. They have always kept their back to Jesus - so they just have to stop and turn around and there he is right there. That is why I think it is easier for atheists to find Jesus than people who make up a different God.
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'words are little signs designed to convey meaning'. Unfortunately they do not always convey the samee meaning to all people all of the time.
Take for instance the word 'God'. The Bible contains many different pictures of God, many different ways to think about God, many different ways to describe God. You and I are not likely to agreee on many of them.
The same could be said about almost any other term used in the Bible. Some peoplee experienced Jesus differently than others. You claim to have met Jesuss. So have I. You can tell me that the Jesus I know is not the 'right' Jesus. Then it becomes a pointless argument. He said - she said.

I will simply say that the Jesus I know has shown me the love of God, and the love of God's creation - and has asked that I love God and love others. I have no room for or patience with those who do not shaare that love.
 
revsdd said:
Much of your post I have no problem with. Your use of the above example, though, simply shows that, like the Bible, the Koran can be quoted selectively to support a particular point of view.

The Koran also says that Christians are closest to Muslims in love and humility, and that Christians and Jews are among those who believe in God and will be rewarded by God. Christians and Jews along with Muslims are also repeatedly called People of the Word. You see, it's all a matter of which verses you choose to cherry pick, just as Christians can cherry pick the Bible to make it suit their pre-existing beliefs. Honest biblical (or koranic) understanding would seek the spirit rather than the strict letter, just as Jesus did with the Torah.
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I have been listening to Muslim/Christian debates lately. These are the things they discuss. It's not cherry picking. How do you come to understand each other unless you get to the heart of it. Any Muslim will tell you they are not trinitarian. That is offensive.
 
Pontifex Geronimo 13 said:
I have been listening to Muslim/Christian debates lately. These are the things they discuss. It's not cherry picking. How do you come to understand each other unless you get to the heart of it. Any Muslim will tell you they are not trinitarian. That is offensive.
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Of course they're not trinitarian. The Christian understanding of the divinity of Christ and the trinity is probably THE theological stumbling block between Christians and Muslims. My reference to cherry picking was simply to the fact that you can quote verses of the Koran that are violent toward other faiths, but it's just as easy to quote verses of the Koran that honour people of other faiths. I'm not trying to suggest that Christianity and Islam are the same.
 
It (the trinitarian concept) is offensive to Jews, too, PLUS we absconded with their scriptures and like to interpret them ourselves.
 
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