The Joys of John

[unsafe]

I think Jesus is speaking directly against this in John 10 with the reference to sheep of other folds.

Then that is what you want to think ----the way you see it --is not the way I see it -----and I will keep posting the way I do GordW ---you have no right to tell others how they should think and post here ----

you have an ignore button --If my posts upset you ignore them -----Period

 

[Waterfall]

GordW ---Just quoting Scripture ----and giving my Spiritual meaning via the Holy Spirit ----who is the only one who can give us the Rhema word of the Scripture --

Question to You

---Will you stop believing that there are many paths to heaven ----when the Scripture clearly says in this Chapter ---Jesus is the only way to have eternal life and His true Sheep follow His voice -----and the gate is closed to those who try to enter another way ------

Without Jesus' Faith in us GordW Scripture is clear here who gets to enter the Gate and who doesn't ----

if that upsets you GordW ------I guess the best person to ask your Question to here that you quote to me-----



Would be God Himself ----as I just believe what Jesus who is the Word says and I ask the Holy Spirit to guide me into the real truth of the Scripture ------and that is what I post and believe ----
You have every right to believe what you will ---same as I do ----

GordW your still in the Old Testament ---so the Ark --had one door ---whoever went through that door got saved -- there was only one entrance ----everyone else perished --think about that ----that would make a good Old Testament Sermon -----

it is the same today --

Scripture says God doesn't change ---if you want Him to change you need to ask Him if he will change the way people get into His Kingdom and provide many ways to get there instead of just one way as is prescribed in His Word ------

So Good Luck with that ---OH and -let me know if you get an answer ----

So when God says love one another, he meant just the believers and slam the door in the face of everyone else.

 

[unsafe]

he meant just the believers and slam the door in the face of everyone else.

God is always there Drawing on our hearts Waterfall to be in His Sheep fold ---God never slams the door on anyone ----We have free choice to open the door or slam it shut -----

When God's says Love one another ----this Love Is Agape ---and is a fruit of having the indwelling of the Holy Spirit ---without the HS in you the best you can offer is human Love and it will fail ---because we are flawed sinful humans with uncontrolled emotions ---

We Slam the Door on God ----it is us who rejects God ---God never rejects anyone who wants to accept His drawing


WE Humans need to take responsibility for our rejection of God ---God wants all people Saved and in His Kingdom -----but we humans want to have our sinful life and have God cater to us and our wants -----and be free to worship all our other Idols and gods and still get into hIs Kingdom -----God sent His Son to die a Brutal Death so you and all people could have a way back to Him ---and many just say big deal so what ----I shouldn't have to accept anyone to get into heaven ----Well I say die and see where that get the person -----one doesn't know till one tries it -----I say Good Luck to them -----

---We flawed humans like to play the Blame Game and put all the blame on God ----we hate taking the flack for our own bad decisions ----have to blame somebody

 

[paradox3]

So when God says love one another, he meant just the believers and slam the door in the face of everyone else.

in John's Gospel, the post resurrection Jesus tells Peter to feed His lambs (21:15). To shepherd His sheep. (21:16). To feed His sheep (21:17)

I remember a sermon years ago based on this appearance to Peter. The minister emphasized that we are not the sheep. She mentioned the "inasmuch" lesson from Matthew among other things. Jesus wanted all God's children to be fed and tended was the point.

Interesting that this discourse appears in John's high Christology gospel, no?

 

[chansen]

Then that is what you want to think ----the way you see it --is not the way I see it -----and I will keep posting the way I do GordW ---you have no right to tell others how they should think and post here ----

you have an ignore button --If my posts upset you ignore them -----Period

I, for one, enjoy your unhinged takes. I think they illustrate my arguments against Christianity marvelously.

 

[unsafe]

chansen ---I am with your thoughts on Christianity -----it is a man made Religion and today is a big Fat Farce -----the true meaning is far gone and many use the Title just cause it sounds good ----it really has nothing to offer as far as true Spiritual enlightenment --that is the truth as far as I am concerned ---it is just another dead beat man made Religion ---

 

[chansen]

Sometimes I wonder if you read your own posts.

 

[paradox3]

Do you have a faith community @unsafe ? Anyone in your life who shares your point of view? I hope your journey is not a lonely one.

 

[paradox3]

John 10:22-42

Bible Gateway passage: John 10:22-42 - New English Translation

Jesus at the Feast of Dedication - Then came the feast of the Dedication in Jerusalem. It was winter, and Jesus was walking in the temple area in Solomon’s Portico. The Jewish leaders surrounded him and asked, “How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Christ, tell us plainly.” Jesus...

www.biblegateway.com

It's winter in Jerusalem and Jesus is attending the Feast of Dedication (Hanukkah).

The Jewish leaders question him. Jesus responds that he has already told them and they don't believe. Again, he says, "The Father and I are one."

The Jewish leaders pick up rocks to stone him to death for blasphemy. Jesus escapes and crosses the Jordon River. Many believe in Jesus there.

 

[paradox3]

The seasons are passing and the discord continues.

 

[unsafe]

Do you have a faith community @unsafe ? Anyone in your life who shares your point of view? I hope your journey is not a lonely one.

Just to answer your question here ---

I sure do I do have lots of people I can share my Spiritual enlightenment with as we are all Born Again people who have Spiritual insight from involving the Holy Spirit in their reading of the scripture ----we are a like minded group ---now here is the thing the Holy Spirit will only give you the Rhema word that you can handle as to where you are in your walk with Christ --so some in the group will not be at the same level in their understanding as the more Spiritual mature people but they recognize that and will say I am not to that understanding yet ---so we as a group will explain the insight so that the Babe in Christ can grasp the Spiritual meaning --so we help each other in that regard ----it is an amazing group to be in when all can be like minded in their Spiritual walk -----

My Brother is a Pastor and is born Again as well and we have some very deep Spiritual conversations -- which are amazing -----and very enlightening ----learning and sharing Spiritual truths ----so great to be able to have that outlet -----

 

[Mendalla]

Thing is, from a Jewish standpoint (and an Islamic one, by the way), the Jewish leaders are in the right as far as blasphemy (maybe not in stoning him, though). Claiming that "the Father and I are one" makes no sense in their understanding of God and how God relates to humanity. For Jews, Jesus is basically just another dude or maybe a prophet. For Islam, he is the greatest prophet prior to Muhammad but not "God" (they believe Christians strayed from Jesus' own teachings with things like the Trinity and the deification of Jesus).

What makes his claim any truer than their understanding of God when one stands outside the Christian tradition? What I see Jesus saying here is people who believe him will follow him and others won't. So do we really need everyone to be in the "people who believe him" circle or can we have them co-existing? To be fair, though, based on what I see here, the problem is not Jesus but the Pharisees' insistence on controlling him and his message and stopping others from following him, though his penchant for confronting them doesn't help at times.

 

[paradox3]

@Mendalla With the eyes of today, we look askance at the idea of stoning anyone for blasphemy. But to put it in the context of the Pharisees, their Law dictated stoning for a great many offences. So their reaction might be less extreme than we are inclined to think.

i understand that Jesus is just another dude in the eyes of present day Judaism.

Amy Jill Levine argues that Jews and Christians have much to learn from each other about their development post second temple. I don't think she considers Jesus a prophet but I am not completely certain about this.

 

[unsafe]

So we continue to see the Jewish leaders refusing to believe who Jesus is -----they have seen all he does and still are in unbelief -----

verse 24 AMPC
24 So the Jews surrounded Him and began asking Him, How long are You going to keep us in doubt and suspense? If You are really the Christ (the Messiah), tell us so plainly and openly.

This word surround gives a picture here of Containment ----like there was no escape from them this time ---

Greek word fro surround
Lexicon
periechó: To encompass, to contain

i.e. encompass (encircle); "fully contained" (BAGD).periechó: To encompass, to contain, to include, to surround.seized

I say ---so was this meant as an hostile ambush upon Jesus -----if so this stoning was a premeditated event -----?

The Leaders here were hoping to get Jesus to confess that He was the Messiah ---they wanted Him to say it plainly and openly -----

But Jesus answers them in a way that they have no Grounds to do anything to Him ---

Jesus says ---I have told you but yet you still don't believe ----This represents a present root Problem of unbelief in the hearts of the Jewish Leaders -----

I say -------So we can go back to Pharaoh who God allowed his already hardened heart to remain hardened so God could show His power and glory of bringing His Plan to play out to free the Israelites from Egypt -----

I believe -----------God is doing the same here with the Jewish Leaders allowing their already hardened hearts to stay hardened so God the Father's plan gets His Son on the Cross ----this makes perfect Spiritual sense to me ----as they have witnesses Miracles ---Healings and Good News Preaching and still are in unbelief -----Remember we are still under the Old Testament laws here --Jesus is still alive here to fulfil the 613 laws --

This paradox3 gives you the answer you asked Yesterday about who the other Sheep are who are not in the Fold -------there are 2 gods ---one for this world and one for the Spiritual world ----

using the AMPC B
26 ;But you do not believe and trust and rely on Me because you do not belong to My fold [you are no sheep of Mine].

So they are not true Sheep----they belong to the world -----

Jesus tells them the benefits that His true Sheep have --they hear His voice and they have eternal life and one one can snatch them from Him -----they are secure and safe ----

Jesus says My Father and I are One -----

You see the leaders anger now is being put in to action as they pick up the stones to stone Jesus ------

But Jesus uses the Sword of the Word to stop them verse 34 ----He quotes a line from Psalm 82 --Scripture that they would already know ----

34 Jesus answered, Is it not written in your Law, I said, You are gods?

Psalms 82 ===this Psalm refers to Human Judges ---who corrupt their positions and God is condemning them for it -----
AMP
I said, “You are ]gods;
Indeed, all of you are sons of the Most High.

Footnotes​

1. Psalm 82:6 Most of the ancient rabbis understood the idea of “gods” referring to judges

I say -----Jesus is using this verse in this Psalm to show the ignorance and instability of His accusers here ----

I Add ------His Human judges who are corrupting their righteous Judgment in their Wrong Judgment of Jesus ----as they have no spiritual enlightenment in them ------

Verse 35 is important info on Scripture as well

35 So men are called gods [by the Law], men to whom God’s message came—and the Scripture cannot be set aside or cancelled or broken or annulled—

I say ---this is saying what is written is indeed written and cannot be changed to suit what we want it to say ----we can try to set aside what is written but you can't cancel or annul it ----the Scripture remains in tact as it is written ---

The Leaders don't give up they try to arrest Jesus but he escapes and crosses the Jordan and stays there where many believe in Him -----

His time has not yet come -----

 

[Mendalla]

So we continue to see the Jewish leaders refusing to believe who Jesus is -----they have seen all he does and still are in unbelief -----

He doesn't fit with their beliefs. Judaism does not allow for God to have a literal child. Judaism was expecting the Messiah to be a powerful militant leader like David, not a spiritual Saviour. I think it's actually unfair to them to expect them to just blithely and merrily recognize Jesus given that. And, of course, he took some pretty pointed shots at them so their anger is understandable. I don't sympathize with the anger, but I do with their failure to recognize Jesus as being who his followers said he was.

And, to be honest, if Jesus showed up today behaving the same way he did back then, I'll bet church leaders and the faithful of all stripes and strands would be deniers. Catholic, Orthodox, Protestant. Fundamentalist, conservative, mainstream, progressive. Every single one would have a reason Jesus doesn't fit their paradigm of what Jesus should be. And that's kind of the point of a lot of Gospel stories. The people who recognize Jesus are often those who don't fit into the overriding cultural paradigm themselves. Samaritans, lepers, outcasts of various sorts rather than the religious leadership and mainstream followers.

 

[unsafe]

Sometimes I wonder if you read your own posts.

If your referring to me using the word Christian ----I use it cause that is what people call themselves ----

I do not Follow the religion of Christianity ----I follow the Way and I do what the Word says --to have a a more abundant life ---and be free of stress ---anxiety ---fear ----and physical ailments --I am living such a great life ---just by following and doing the Word -----I don't need any Religion ===

The Latin word for Religion is religare

AI


Yes, the English word "religion" does indeed come from the Latin word "religare," which means "to bind fast" or "to tie back". The Latin word "religio" itself is then derived from "religare".

Why would I cling to a Religion that binds me and ties me back ------I want to go forward ----and the way --is the way forward ----so I follow Jesus way ----

 

[unsafe]

Mendalla ---where do you see any mention of Judaism in any this Scripture in the Old Testament ===God has no religion ---and God chose the Jews to be His Chosen Nation which had nothing to do with a man --made religion of Judaism ----

You are so right they wanted a King and here is the scripture ----there is no mention of any of their religion of Judaism being mentioned here ------but God ---is giving them Warnings about wanting a King ---

​

1 Samuel 8​

Israel Demands a King​

Warning concerning a King​

As far as you say if Jesus came back today -----all we can do is speculate what people and leaders would do ----and Jesus is coming back ----2 more times -----according to Scripture ---so we will see what people do then ----

 

[paradox3]

As mentioned earlier, Snoopy's text for today shows up in the lectionary this week.

We probably won't hear it because we are doing Holy Humor Sunday. Not sure what kind of a scripture lesson to expect.

 

[Mendalla]

Not sure what kind of a scripture lesson to expect.

I used to know some good Biblical jokes. Not all of them SFC (Safe For Church), though. More seriously, there's some wordplay kicking around in scripture that's kind of funny if you know what it means. So maybe some of that?

The UUs used to do humour services from time to time. I never led one but attended them.

 

[Waterfall]

When Jesus says," I am in the Father, and the Father in me."
Does it not suggest, God within(immanent) and God without
(transcendent).
Isn't this what Jews believe....it doesn't sound different to me. Should it?