Heaven and Hell

[airclean33]

You should read her earlier posts in this thread. You'll flip. She says heaven and hell are not physical places.

I think you know what you have to do

-- Hi Chansen---Seeler has a right to believe what she wants. It dose bother me some . That she also teaches so may give her ideas to others. But again as a christian I feel GOD through His Holy Spirit is the Teach.As far as Heaven and Hell go . I have never been to either one, as far as I know. Although I do believe I came from one, I have no memory of it.

 

[Hermann]

I think it's a mistake to view God as a being as we would imagine Him to be. No one knows fully what God is but we do know one thing for sure.....Humans are NOT in control of the universe or this world for that matter. So whatever God is....it isnt us.

Hi Waterfall:

Is it possible that you are biased by your belief in the "otherness" of God?

Is it not possible for God to be the self-creative totality of being?

And, if it is, are we humans then not an inseparable part of God?

If the self-creative totality of being is a singularity in a state of synthesis, then there are no separations. Then God just is, and everything that is is God. Then God cannot be figured out analytically, because analysis is antithetical to synthesis, but God can be experienced, and is being experienced, in the pure experience of reality.

The mystery of mysteries, eh?



"I AM"

-God, according to Moses

 

[Waterfall]

@ chansen...The Bible informs us of a history of a people that either chose to hold the known and unkown that controls our world and universe, in high regard with utmost respect or not. We are made capable to acquire some of this knowledge and to be informed of facts as they are slowly being revealed to us over time through our limited capacity within our brains. The Bible remains relevant to me because it speaks to the essential human condition that we are born into and why we should focus on respecting what we have inherited.

We can do everthing right and misfortune may still visit us ( see Job) and God seems "evil" because we often fail to recognize that we exist in a place that also has a satanic rule. Not to be confused with SATAN as an entity. We are also doomed to die and that isn't very nice either....but we are offered, what some choose not to believe, a way out of this. Is this "grace" something that is doled out willy nilly, or is it an actual rule built into our universe, that the Universe is quite aware of?

 

[Waterfall]

Hermann, "Is it possible that you are biased by your belief in the "otherness" of God?"

Yes!



Hermann,"And, if it is, are we humans then not an inseparable part of God?"

Well the Bible informs me that there is a way that we can be separated.....in life and in death.

 

[Jaebius]

What we Christians offer is cruciform communities which - through living out the gospel - shine God's light into societies held captive by dark powers and authorities who have held them captive. In such a way - we loose the Spirit's redemptive power into the world that God is reclaiming from the evil powers he has already triumphed over.

 

[chansen]

@ chansen...The Bible informs us of a history of a people that either chose to hold the known and unkown that controls our world and universe, in high regard with utmost respect or not.

You have a strange definition of the word "history". We've been over the fact that the Exodus never happened. Genesis itself is full of fables, not history. The rest of the bible builds on this mythical foundation. Archaeologists have largely given up on using the bible as a field guide.

We are made capable to acquire some of this knowledge and to be informed of facts as they are slowly being revealed to us over time through our limited capacity within our brains. The Bible remains relevant to me because it speaks to the essential human condition that we are born into and why we should focus on respecting what we have inherited.

And you can gain insight to the human condition through numerous works of art. There is nothing special about the bible there.

We can do everthing right and misfortune may still visit us ( see Job) and God seems "evil" because we often fail to recognize that we exist in a place that also has a satanic rule. Not to be confused with SATAN as an entity. We are also doomed to die and that isn't very nice either....but we are offered, what some choose not to believe, a way out of this. Is this "grace" something that is doled out willy nilly, or is it an actual rule built into our universe, that the Universe is quite aware of?

Everything points to "grace" being a human invention. You can talk circles around this fact, but that doesn't make it go away. The discussion points include whether it was invented to gain control over people, or to make people feel better. The motivations of those who shaped Judaism and Christianity and Islam into what they became would be among the most interesting things in the world to know.

 

[chansen]

What we Christians offer is cruciform communities which - through living out the gospel - shine God's light into societies held captive by dark powers and authorities who have held them captive. In such a way - we loose the Spirit's redemptive power into the world that God is reclaiming from the evil powers he has already triumphed over.

I think some of the original meaning was lost when you regurgitated that from memory. You can try again if you want.

 

[blackbelt1961]

Great, so you get to quote scripture and threaten people by proxy, instead of directly. You've outsourced your judgment and your disdain. You've hired an eternal hit man.

so by me not judging peoples eternity is considered a threat?, Chasen you need to go back to school

What you and Jae have is absolutely nothing worth communicating.

but an atheist does ? really your religious belief is what is suppose to define everything

you should take your above quote and apply it to yourself

And that's the beauty of living in Canada today - what you believe has no power any more.

instead of talking out of the side of your mouth all the times show me proof of your allegations , What you cant , figures your just hot air

We're free to dismiss or ignore ridiculous ideas without personal repercussions. I can live quite happily with you telling me I'm going to be judged by your imaginary friend. Doesn't bother me in the least. That it could and does weigh on others makes it worthwhile for me to come to a public forum such as this and point out how utterly stupid these beliefs are.

yes this I agree with you are as Free as the Lord has giving you freedom of choice in Life to be as ignorant in your demeaning character as you wish

good show Chasen [/quote]

 

[Jaebius]

I think some of the original meaning was lost when you regurgitated that from memory. You can try again if you want.

That's an odd comment.

 

[chansen]

That's an odd comment.

Yours made no sense. Here, read it again:

What we Christians offer is cruciform communities which - through living out the gospel - shine God's light into societies held captive by dark powers and authorities who have held them captive. In such a way - we loose the Spirit's redemptive power into the world that God is reclaiming from the evil powers he has already triumphed over.

It's completely nonsensical. I'm guessing you recently read a book like "Cruciform: Living The Cross Shaped Life" and wanted to paraphrase some of it here. It did not work out for you.

 

[blackbelt1961]

Yours made no sense. Here, read it again:

It's completely nonsensical. I'm guessing you recently read a book like "Cruciform: Living The Cross Shaped Life" and wanted to paraphrase some of it here. It did not work out for you.

like HELLO !of course its nonsensical to you, your an atheist,,

you have no understanding of the spiritual , what is what Jae wrote above

 

[chansen]

so by me not judging peoples eternity is considered a threat?, Chasen you need to go back to school

You think you've solved the problem. You get to tell people they are going to be judged, and hide behind the empty claim that God will do the judging. You threaten people, then wash your hands of the threat in the same sentence.

I think it's important to point out that your threat, or God's threat, is complete bulls**t. It's the sort of claim we should openly mock and laugh at, to allow those who might be concerned about what you're quoting to laugh as well. I think if people can laugh at religious claims and stop treating it as a serious thing, it'll be easier for them to walk away without the guilt that religion can instill in people.

I'm not this blunt and abrasive with most here, because they don't come out and issue threats by proxy like you do. To me, if you're being that arrogant with baseless threats, I have licence to say what I think.

instead of talking out of the side of your mouth all the times show me proof of your allegations , What you cant , figures your just hot air

The religious have very little political or social power in Canada any more. Not sure what you mean by "talking out of the side of [my] mouth" here. Everyone knows that there is no religious requirement for just about anything in Canada any more, except positions within religious institutions. You can't make people believe, and you have a terrible track record at convincing young people, and here are no repercussions for not believing in most of Canada. In large parts of the US, nonbelievers are ostracized, which is why you see the big push-back against religion in the US.

But scripture has a nasty way of staying with people who were raised with it, and so I write a lot of what I write with that in mind.

 

[chansen]

like HELLO !of course its nonsensical to you, your an atheist,,

you have no understanding of the spiritual , what is what Jae wrote above

Aaaaah. It was written in tongues. I thought that was only a verbal form of communication. Can somebody translate it to English for us mere mortals?

 

[Jaebius]

Yours made no sense. Here, read it again:

It's completely nonsensical. I'm guessing you recently read a book like "Cruciform: Living The Cross Shaped Life" and wanted to paraphrase some of it here. It did not work out for you.

It makes sense to me - and I imagine anyone else who has had their imagination and perspective quickened by the Spirit's power. What it follows is the blessing of a year in seminary - with two more years to come. Stay tuned for more insights in the future. As for now - which part of what I wrote have you failed to understand?

 

[chansen]

It makes sense to me - and I imagine anyone else who has had their imagination and perspective quickened by the Spirit's power. What it follows is the blessing of a year in seminary - with two more years to come. Stay tuned for more insights in the future. As for now - which part of what I wrote have you failed to understand?

Which year will you cover basic sentence structure and writing for your audience instead of your prof? Even if I reconcile your double insistence that these captive societies were held captive, and maybe correct "loose" to "lose" (that doesn't seem right either), what I'm left with are impressive looking words that were never meant to be placed in that order unless a decoder ring was provided.

Seriously, anyone understand this?

What we Christians offer is cruciform communities which - through living out the gospel - shine God's light into societies held captive by dark powers and authorities who have held them captive. In such a way - we loose the Spirit's redemptive power into the world that God is reclaiming from the evil powers he has already triumphed over.

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

Makes sense to me.

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

Alpha course starts at churches all over Canada in September. You should take it with your wife. about 12 free meals and a chance to try to convert a bunch of people to atheism. You know nothing about Christianity, and this would be your chance to pick up the basics and maybe hone your argument.

 

[Jaebius]

Which year will you cover basic sentence structure and writing for your audience instead of your prof? Even if I reconcile your double insistence that these captive societies were held captive, and maybe correct "loose" to "lose" (that doesn't seem right either), what I'm left with are impressive looking words that were never meant to be placed in that order unless a decoder ring was provided.

Seriously, anyone understand this?

Admittedly you're right - I did use the word "captive" twice when I could have - more economically - used it but once. One gold star for you.

 

[chansen]

Makes sense to me.

If it makes sense, rewrite it. Explain how "...shine God's light into societies held captive by dark powers..." relates to "Let's deny science and yell at people we don't like."

Alpha course starts at churches all over Canada in September. You should take it with your wife. about 12 free meals and a chance to try to convert a bunch of people to atheism. You know nothing about Christianity, and this would be your chance to pick up the basics and maybe hone your argument.

That could be epic. If they were open to another viewpoint and wanted to make it a discussion or debate, I'd consider it.

Is it offered at Nobleton United? Before I even ask, is there any minister here who would truthfully want me to attend, understanding what I would likely say if I were in attendance. If I need to spell it out, I would wait for times when the audience was encouraged to ask questions and provide feedback. I not really a heckler. I just think it would be interesting to see if I could counter the Alpha course and steer the other attendees away.

 

[chansen]

Moved to next page.