Snoopy Considers 1 Corinthians
- Thread starter paradox3
- Start date
Welcome to Wondercafe2!
A community where we discuss, share, and have some fun together. Join today and become a part of it!
Apart from Jesus' words of institution of the Lord's Supper (11:23-25), Paul never quotes the historical Jesus. He does ALLUDE to 2 sayings of Jesus, but in both cases he only does so to point out exceptions to Jesus' rule. (1) In 9:14-15 Paul boasts that he'd rather die than apply Jesus' rule that "the (missionary) laborer is worthy of his wages."
14" In the same way, the Lord has commanded that those who preach the gospel should receive their living from the gospel.
15 But I have not used any of these rights. And I am not writing this in the hope that you will do such things for me, for I would rather die than allow anyone to deprive me of this boast."
Paul is career tentmaker and prefers to practice this trade during his apostolic ministry so as not to be a financial burden on his converts. Needless to say, this is not a favorite text of well-paid modern pastors!
(2) In 7:10 Paul endorses Jesus' prohibition against divorce, but then in 7:15 he immediately identifies as an exception a broken marriage between a believer and an unbeliever. In other words, Paul treats Jesus' moral precepts as guidelines, not absolutes, for which there may be exceptions.
Jesus treats Torah Sabbath laws in a similar way, allowing many exceptions for the strict observation of Sabbath rest.
14" In the same way, the Lord has commanded that those who preach the gospel should receive their living from the gospel.
15 But I have not used any of these rights. And I am not writing this in the hope that you will do such things for me, for I would rather die than allow anyone to deprive me of this boast."
Paul is career tentmaker and prefers to practice this trade during his apostolic ministry so as not to be a financial burden on his converts. Needless to say, this is not a favorite text of well-paid modern pastors!
(2) In 7:10 Paul endorses Jesus' prohibition against divorce, but then in 7:15 he immediately identifies as an exception a broken marriage between a believer and an unbeliever. In other words, Paul treats Jesus' moral precepts as guidelines, not absolutes, for which there may be exceptions.
Jesus treats Torah Sabbath laws in a similar way, allowing many exceptions for the strict observation of Sabbath rest.
Do you object to Paul's allowance for conditions entitling divorce and for the right to do his missionary work without financial support from his converts?
Well there are a myriad of reasons for a divorce not addressed....so somewhat blanket statements being used and of course some dietary laws are question able....
Paul makes no blanket statements on divorce. He takes up the specific Corinthian question about how to handle mixed marriages in which the unbelieving spouse is determined to get a divorce. Thus, he treats Jesus' prohibition as a guideline rather than as an absolute--a guideline that allows for ot her possible grounds for divorce such as Jesus' allowance in the case of adultery.
On diet, Paul teaches that the other person's conscience should be your guide rather than your own conscience, which may clash with the other's conscience and thus cause offense.
So was Paul allowed to add to the " rules" or only follow Jesus rules?
Eg. Can women preach? Are they equal?
Or get a divorce if her husband beats her? (According to Paul and according to Jesus?)
unsafe
Well-Known Member
What dietary laws are you speaking of in the New Testament -----can you give an example ?
I was thinking about the do not eat meat that was given to idols but I found the answer....and Romans 20-22 suggests anything goes....sort of answered my own question on that. But if you'd like to add something?
BetteTheRed
Resident Heretic
- Pronouns
- She/Her/Her
So we're suggesting that Paul's thinking evolved on certain issues? Which implies we have to figure out Paul's final position on things? It's a bit like Jesus gradually figuring out that he was to include non-Jews in his ministry? It's certainly an argument against willy-nilly proof-texting scripture to prove a particular point.
unsafe
Well-Known Member
No nothing to add --Great that you discovered your answer -----
Paul writes well before any of our Gospels were written. So we don't even know how well-versed Paul was in the oral sayings of Jesus tradition.
Yes, but first we need to understand the case against Paul's authorship of 1 Corinthians 14:34-3 and 1 Timothy 2:11-15.
The issues are complex. Would you like me to start a new thread on the status of women in Paul and Jesus' teaching?
Once it is recognized the for both Paul and Jesus the divorce prohibition is not a moral absolute, but merely a guideline for which there are exceptions, that opens the door to other unstated exceptions not discussed in Paul's epistles, e. g. a physically abusive husband.
Abuse is a grave matter. I firmly believe it is grounds for separation. It can provide the necessary safety and distance for the individual facing abuse, allowing time for intervention, healing and reconciliation. Divorce, however, is not something I see as biblically supported in these situations. Our Christian commitment must be to support those affected by such painful circumstances with compassion, ensuring their immediate safety while upholding the sanctity of marriage as a lifelong covenant
Paul shows his understanding of the complexities of human relationships and the need for compassion in applying moral precepts. His willingness to make exceptions in certain circumstances highlights the importance of context.Apart from Jesus' words of institution of the Lord's Supper (11:23-25), Paul never quotes the historical Jesus. He does ALLUDE to 2 sayings of Jesus, but in both cases he only does so to point out exceptions to Jesus' rule. (1) In 9:14-15 Paul boasts that he'd rather die than apply Jesus' rule that "the (missionary) laborer is worthy of his wages."
14" In the same way, the Lord has commanded that those who preach the gospel should receive their living from the gospel.
15 But I have not used any of these rights. And I am not writing this in the hope that you will do such things for me, for I would rather die than allow anyone to deprive me of this boast."
Paul is career tentmaker and prefers to practice this trade during his apostolic ministry so as not to be a financial burden on his converts. Needless to say, this is not a favorite text of well-paid modern pastors!
(2) In 7:10 Paul endorses Jesus' prohibition against divorce, but then in 7:15 he immediately identifies as an exception a broken marriage between a believer and an unbeliever. In other words, Paul treats Jesus' moral precepts as guidelines, not absolutes, for which there may be exceptions.
Jesus treats Torah Sabbath laws in a similar way, allowing many exceptions for the strict observation of Sabbath rest.
Jesus allowed exceptions to Sabbath laws out of compassion. Paul encourages us to apply Jesus' teachings with wisdom to the unique situations we encounter in our churches.
We're called to uphold the truth of the Good News while also being attentive to the needs of those we serve. It's about finding that balance between holding firm to our faith and being adaptable in our application of it, always with the goal of reflecting Christ's love
If you would like to start a thread on the status of of women in Paul and Jesus teachings, I would be interested but not sure if others are?
Definitely would be
paradox3
Peanuts Fan
- Pronouns
- She/Her/Her
1 Corinthians 9
www.biblegateway.com
Paul discusses his calling as an apostle and his right to be compensated fairly. He quotes the Hebrew Scriptures: Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain.
Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 9 - New English Translation
The Rights of an Apostle - Am I not free? Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord? Are you not my work in the Lord? If I am not an apostle to others, at least I am to you, for you are the confirming sign of my apostleship in the Lord. This is my defense to those who examine me. Do we...
See Paul's message, p3, as a call to value the work of all those who serve in ministry. It's about appreciation. The work of spreading the Good News is invaluable.1 Corinthians 9
Paul discusses his calling as an apostle and his right to be compensated fairly. He quotes the Hebrew Scriptures: Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain.Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 9 - New English Translation
The Rights of an Apostle - Am I not free? Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord? Are you not my work in the Lord? If I am not an apostle to others, at least I am to you, for you are the confirming sign of my apostleship in the Lord. This is my defense to those who examine me. Do we...
In today's context, this verse invites us to reflect on how we must uplift those who dedicate their lives to ministry. It's a beautiful reminder that our leaders deserve to be cared for
When Jesus sent out his disciples, p3, he told them to rely on the hospitality of others, trusting that those who welcomed them would be blessed. Similarly, Paul highlights the importance of supporting those who preach the Good News, reminding us that "the worker deserves his wages." It's about valuing the efforts of those who dedicate their lives to spreading God's Word.Snoopy's Snappy Question: 1 Corinthians 9
Does this remind anyone else of Jesus expecting hospitality for himself and the disciples when they were out and about?
Both instances emphasize the importance of support. It's a reminder that we're called to care for one another