Snoopy on the Psalms

[Mendalla]

No where in the Scriptures did Jesus ever say follow Judaism ---Jesus kept the Feasts days that His Father put in place but Jesus never followed the Religion of Judaism and chastised the Pharisees for their man made rules and regulations that they themselves added to God's Laws ---

Jesus said --I am the Way --follow me ----no Religion mentioned ----

The Pharisees rules were not Judaism, though. That he was at odds with them simply means he did not observe their brand of Judaism, not that he was not a Jew. In his day, the Pharsaic rule was not even the only interpretation. Sadducees, Essenes, and other schools existed. That remains true today, even if the schools are different. At its root, Judaism is exactly what you describe as him doing - following the Torah laws and observing the feast days. The fact is, he went to synagogues at least on occasion, observed the Passover, and clearly attached importance to the temple given the cleansing and his insistence on being in Jerusalem for Passover. Seems pretty first century CE Jewish to me. The separation of him from Judaism is a Christian invention, largely due to Christian anti-Semitism rooted in supersecessionism.

 

[paradox3]

No where in the Scriptures did Jesus ever say follow Judaism ---Jesus kept the Feasts days that His Father put in place but Jesus never followed the Religion of Judaism and chastised the Pharisees for their man made rules and regulations that they themselves added to God's Laws ---

Jesus said --I am the Way --follow me ----no Religion mentioned ----

Jesus did say he had not come to abolish the Law but to fulfill it.

You are correct in saying Jesus often challenged the Pharisees' interpretation of the law. There were times he thought the Pharisees were too rigid and other times he thought just the opposite.

He didn't need to say "Follow Judaism" because he was talking primarily to Jews. Scripture notes the few occasions he spoke to someone else. He moved a little off his initial position that he had come only for the lost tribes of Israel.

 

[Waterfall]

Again this is their perception --- far as their view of what has not been fulfilled ---it is coming in the future ---it hasn't happened yet ----so again their understanding of what the scripture is saying is from only taking the Old Testament as their scriptures and not understanding that the Old Testament is prophesying what Will happen in the end times which will happen in the future which the Jews know nothing about because they disregard the New testament -----

This is from your article you posted

What is the Messiah supposed to accomplish?

A. Build the Third Temple (Ezekiel 37:26-28).---see below

b Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel (Isaiah 43:5-6).----see below

c Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. As it says: "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore." (Isaiah 2:4) see below ----

D. Spread universal knowledge of the God of Israel, which will unite humanity as one. As it says: "God will be King over all the world—on that day, God will be One and His Name will be One" (Zechariah 14:9).
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I say --

The third temple will be built in the Middle pf the 7 year tribulation period ------where the anti-christ will sit for a short time ---

When is the third temple built? | Verse By Verse Ministry International

Understand Bible references to the third temple, its timing, the Antichrist, and tribulation. Learn how prophecy connects temple events to scripture.

versebyverseministry.org

When is the third temple built?​

July 25, 2023

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Is the third temple rebuilt before the rapture takes place?
The Bible never makes a connection between the timing of the resurrection (rapture) and the start of the Jerusalem Temple being built except that the resurrection must occur before the start of tribulation because scripture states that by the mid-point of tribulation the temple will be built and defiled by the Antichrist.

Bible Verses about the Third Temple​

2 Thessalonians 2:1-17 - Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to him, we ask you, brothers, not to be quickly shaken in mind or alarmed, either by a spirit or a spoken word, or a letter seeming to be from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come.

Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God. Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? ...

End-Time Prophecy: Why is the Third Temple so Important? | Messianic Bible

The Hebrew prophets all proclaimed that in the last days the exiles of Israel would return to the Promised Land and the Temple would be rebuilt--but for whom?

free.messianicbible.com

Daniel, Yeshua, the Anti-Messiah, and the Third Temple​

In the prophetic writings of the Book of Daniel and the Brit Chadashah (New Testament), we find significant details about the role of a rebuilt Temple in the end times.

Both Daniel and Yeshua (Jesus) tell us that the Anti-Messiah will defile the Third Temple before the return of the true Messiah.

They both call this spiritual defilement in the Temple the abomination of desolation:

“So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination that causes desolation,’ spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand—then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.” (Matthew 24:15–16; compare with Daniel 9:27, 11:31, and 12:11)
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I say -----So the Jewish Nation is not correctly understanding the scriptures in the Old testament that tell you that this in the end times which has not come to pass yet ------

the second one they sight is ------

The gathering of the Jews back to their land -------again this happens in the end times -----the Jews are gathered back into their 12 Tribes and God seals them to preach the Gospel to all the world -----

Revelation 7---read it yourself ----​

​

New International Version​

144,000 Sealed​

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Next one listed is

Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. As it says: "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore." (Isaiah 2:4)


This is speaking of the New Jerusalem at the end of the 7 year Tribulation see Revelations for that ---again in the future and Again misinterpreted by the Jews ------

The New Jerusalem​

21 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth. The first heaven and the first earth had disappeared, and there was no sea anymore. 2 And I saw the holy city, the new Jerusalem,[a] coming down out of heaven from God. It was prepared like a bride dressed for her husband.

3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne, saying, “Now God’s presence is with people, and he will live with them, and they will be his people. God himself will be with them and will be their God.[b] 4 He will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and there will be no more death, sadness, crying, or pain, because all the old ways are gone.”

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last one listed is this in the Old Testament -----

Spread universal knowledge of the God of Israel, which will unite humanity as one. As it says: "God will be King over all the world—on that day, God will be One and His Name will be One" (Zechariah 14:9).

End times prophecy not happened yet -----will be fulfilled when God is ready to execute His final plan -------and the New Earth is born where God will be King over all the world and He will be the only King -----

Matthew 24:14
AMP
This good news of the kingdom [the gospel] will be preached throughout the whole world as a testimony to all the nations, and then the end [of the age] will come.

I say ----
So we see that unfortunately the Jewish Nation would not fully grasp the scripture because they refuse to see the New Testament as revellent -------so they are missing the real Prophecy coming to be fulfilled in the future ----but they will come to see it as they will be a part of the end times and the fulfillment of the prophecies they say were not fulfilled ----

How great is that -----so just because the Jewish Nation says that these prophecies have not been fulfilled does not mean they won't be in the future ------

The Jewish nation believes the prophesies will be filled also, just not the way you and others within Christianity interpret the OT scriptures.
They say you don't interpret the OT correctly and you say it's the Jewish nation that doesn't.
Hmmm....except they don't attempt to correct/convert you, because they believe the truth will be revealed to every religion in time.

 

[paradox3]

One of the major differences between Judaism and Christianity is the philosophy around conversion of others to the faith.

It is possible to convert to Judaism after much study with a rabbi. But it is not believed to be necessary to put anyone right with God. Or to secure a place in the world to come.

Christians OTOH have made bringing others to Jesus almost their sole reason for existence. Even in our liberal denomination, this was taught to me in my Sunday school days.

It's curious that two such divergent traditions have so much scripture in common. Including these Psalms we are discussing here.

 

[unsafe]

Something to think about ----

We need not worry about the Jewish Nation ----God has their Back and they will be Triumphant in the end -----we should be concerned where we will decide to end up ---the Jews are looked after already ----we gentiles are not ----

 

[Mendalla]

Christians OTOH have made bringing others to Jesus almost their sole reason for existence.

It, Islam, and some degree Buddhism are the "missionary religions". Buddhism is less aggressive about it but does believe in spreading the word of the Buddha's teachings so others may be enlightened. The other two, well, history shows their records. Wars, forced conversions, imposition of their laws on non-believers, and so on. If Christianity simply took the same approach as Buddhism, of spreading the "Good News" rather than insisting on it being the only way and ramming their faith down people's throats, maybe there would be less animosity towards Christianity in some sectors. And I guess the liberal traditions in some denominations did end up going that way but there's still plenty of belief in the more aggressive approach, I find.

 

[GordW]

I say --

The third temple will be built in the Middle pf the 7 year tribulation period ------where the anti-christ will sit for a short time ---

When is the third temple built? | Verse By Verse Ministry International

Understand Bible references to the third temple, its timing, the Antichrist, and tribulation. Learn how prophecy connects temple events to scripture.

versebyverseministry.org

When is the third temple built?​

July 25, 2023

SHARE​

Link copied
Español English
Is the third temple rebuilt before the rapture takes place?
The Bible never makes a connection between the timing of the resurrection (rapture) and the start of the Jerusalem Temple being built except that the resurrection must occur before the start of tribulation because scripture states that by the mid-point of tribulation the temple will be built and defiled by the Antichrist.

Bible Verses about the Third Temple​

2 Thessalonians 2:1-17 - Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to him, we ask you, brothers, not to be quickly shaken in mind or alarmed, either by a spirit or a spoken word, or a letter seeming to be from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come.

Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God. Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? ...

End-Time Prophecy: Why is the Third Temple so Important? | Messianic Bible

The Hebrew prophets all proclaimed that in the last days the exiles of Israel would return to the Promised Land and the Temple would be rebuilt--but for whom?

free.messianicbible.com

​

Here is a Jewish source that talks about the problems with the "build the third temple" rhetoric and how it has been used recently. (bit of a long read,but, like anything Rabbi Ruttenberg puts out, is a good read)

 

[Mendalla]

Let's face it, plans for rebuilding the temple mostly involve removing the Muslim sites on the Temple Mount. The upheaval from doing that would make the current Gaza situation look like a quaint little picnic. I would suggest that would be world war level aggression. And the Muslim states that have largely stayed out of the way in Gaza would not in that event.

 

[Waterfall]

Something to think about ----

We need not worry about the Jewish Nation ----God has their Back and they will be Triumphant in the end -----we should be concerned where we will decide to end up ---the Jews are looked after already ----we gentiles are not ----

Who are the "we" you refer to? Are you referring to everyone that's not Jewish needs to follow Jesus?

 

[unsafe]

Who are the "we" you refer to? Are you referring to everyone that's not Jewish needs to follow Jesus?

waterfall this is my post and I say who the we are -----

We need not worry about the Jewish Nation ----God has their Back and they will be Triumphant in the end -----we should be concerned where we will decide to end up ---the Jews are looked after already ----we gentiles are not

It is not enough to just Follow Jesus Waterfall to have eternal life ---The Jews will be saved at the end of the 7 year tribulation -----the Gentile Nation who have not Received Jesus as their Lord and saviour will not have eternal life at the end of the 7 year tribulation ---that is what I am saying ----

 

[paradox3]

Christian Zionism would probably be worth a thread of its own.

Just a few more thoughts on religious conversion. There are a few small groups (Druze etc) that don't allow conversion at all.

The Samaritans are an interesting case. They sought converts when they were on the verge of extinction in the 1920's. The effort was successful and their numbers have been increasing. But it's stii a very small group with both Israeli and Palestinian citizenship.

 

[paradox3]

waterfall this is my post and I say who the we are -----

Nothing wrong with seeking clarification on these threads. That's what Waterfall is requesting

It is not enough to just Follow Jesus Waterfall to have eternal life ---The Jews will be saved at the end of the 7 year tribulation -----the Gentile Nation who have not Received Jesus as their Lord and saviour will not have eternal life at the end of the 7 year tribulation ---that is what I am saying ----

Various Christians have various ways of looking at end times. No surprise really.

 

[paradox3]

Any final thoughts about Psalms 1 - 15?
This thread has meandered into a few areas that could be threads of their own.

It has been said that the Psalms are the heart of the bible. This is true literally. If you try to open a hard copy bible halfway, you will land in the Psalms. Is it true in other ways?

As I said earlier, I plan to take a break from Snoopy's OT studies but I will return in the fall at the latest.

At this point I have read 156 chapters of the bible and discussed most of them here on WC2. I have read Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Jude, Genesis and 16 Psalms.

At 1189 chapters in total, I have a long way to go.