TRUMP - Some people think......... How do you feel?

[GeoFee]

Hi,

Sorry, but you are wrong on this.

Sorry, but I disagree with you on this.

There are as many points of view as there are human beings. For one point of view to declare itself right and others wrong stands at the heart of human conflict. We are in the trajectory of history together. We will either work together as human beings or we will continue in bondage on the trajectory of destruction.

George

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

Simple, you just keep repeating the litany of lies. All of which there is sane proof of all the misrepresentations.

The left always say what they say Trump said, but it is never the actual recording of what Trump said.

Bernie was kicked out of a commune for being lazy. People who are on the right work for reward. People on the left think they deserve to be able to take from those who work.

People on the right believe that if everybody who are able to work gave 10%, that would be enough to support those who cannot work.

People on the left want everything given to them by a government for free, knowing it is not really free, but that somehow the money will be extorted from those who work.

The Liberal government of Canada does not allow MPs to be pro life. Meaning there is no Liberal MP who cares about what I care about.

Whatever. Trump has been recorded lying repeatedly.

You don't even care about inequality and lack of opportunity. You don't understand that you are fortunate.

And you care about the unborn but not so much about the born. You believe in authoritarian power, and preserving your privelege, and you don't want to pay taxes for the greater good - that's the reason for your support of the right.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

You're not seeing it because you're not even looking. There is a difference between principles and specifics. You are talking about Trump and his supporters. That's specifics. I'm talking about values. There are people who hold healthy right-wing values. What you're describing is the Republican policies which bear little to no resemblance to what the party stood for or what healthy conservatives believe.

There are conservatives who cannot stand the direction in which the president is taking the country. They are working on that. Perhaps work with people like that to find common ground. There is indeed common ground. Both conservatives and liberals who want money spent wisely and for citizens to live healthy lives.

After spending many years in a conservative part of the country I'm finding it interesting being in a more liberal part of the country, arguable the most liberal. This area does fit with my values better. At the same time, there's some whackadoodle (best word I can come up with before coffee kicks in) views on the left as well.

What are healthy right wing values?

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

You're not seeing it because you're not even looking. There is a difference between principles and specifics. You are talking about Trump and his supporters. That's specifics. I'm talking about values. There are people who hold healthy right-wing values. What you're describing is the Republican policies which bear little to no resemblance to what the party stood for or what healthy conservatives believe.

There are conservatives who cannot stand the direction in which the president is taking the country. They are working on that. Perhaps work with people like that to find common ground. There is indeed common ground. Both conservatives and liberals who want money spent wisely and for citizens to live healthy lives.

After spending many years in a conservative part of the country I'm finding it interesting being in a more liberal part of the country, arguable the most liberal. This area does fit with my values better. At the same time, there's some whackadoodle (best word I can come up with before coffee kicks in) views on the left as well.

The most dangerously wackadoodlest views are on the right. Wackadoodles like Marianne Williamson are pretty average out here...she's not even weird, she's like half of my friends' moms in high school and I'm not even joking...she is far less dangerous, even harmless, compared to what's on the right - especially in the US. Bernie Sanders is like a lot of people here too.

For the record I think the Federal Liberals are too conservative.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

Simple, you just keep repeating the litany of lies. All of which there is sane proof of all the misrepresentations.

The left always say what they say Trump said, but it is never the actual recording of what Trump said.

Bernie was kicked out of a commune for being lazy. People who are on the right work for reward. People on the left think they deserve to be able to take from those who work.

People on the right believe that if everybody who are able to work gave 10%, that would be enough to support those who cannot work.

People on the left want everything given to them by a government for free, knowing it is not really free, but that somehow the money will be extorted from those who work.

The Liberal government of Canada does not allow MPs to be pro life. Meaning there is no Liberal MP who cares about what I care about.

The right are the biggest supporters and beneficiaries of corporate welfare. They expect wealth and privelege commensurate with status not hard work. Nepotism is not hard work, it's privelege. A lot of people born into poor circumstances and bad luck work hard just to survive, whether they get a stipend from the government or not. They're too busy surviving to get ahead and you don't seem to give a s**t about that. Of course I'm sure you've got one exception, one desperate rags to riches story that you think should apply to everybody so you can continue not to care about the rest who are just busy surviving.

 

[Northwind]

What are healthy right wing values?

Seriously? You're that entrenched in your views that you absolutely can't see any other view?

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

Whatever. Trump has been recorded lying repeatedly.

You don't even care about inequality and lack of opportunity. You don't understand that you are fortunate.

And you care about the unborn but not so much about the born. You believe in authoritarian power, and preserving your privelege, and you don't want to pay taxes for the greater good - that's the reason for your support of the right.

This is something I would like to start a new thread about. Hard left has NO Understanding of the realities of how money works. Just some fake utopia they are always going to bring about when they are running things.

People who invest money in the growth of civilization, are never going to pay taxes. If you try to take their stuff, they are just going to go to a more favourable location and make their money there.

Ask AOC.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

This @Northwind i wish I'd written it myself - this expresses exactly my thoughts and feelings:

"Because we live in a two-party system, there is an eternal need for legacy media outlets like the Times and CNN to be “balanced,” to give conservatism a platform to rebut all those dirty, screeching liberals. It’s as if the Timesstrives to recreate every hallway conversation on The West Wing by dishing out a healthy salary to any conservative writer who imitates a William F. Buckley fart from 1971 like it's a bird call. It’s a nice thought, this balance. And lord knows that liberals (like me) have a habit of shouting down those that they don’t particularly agree with.

But here’s why I do that from time to time: it’s because conservatism is a big f***ing lie."

To read more:

The Great Lie of Conservatism

The philosophical foundation of conservatism is a template for exploitation, argues Drew Magary, and it's time to stop treating it as half our country's guiding principles.

www.gq.com

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

This is something I would like to start a new thread about. Hard left has NO Understanding of the realities of how money works. Just some fake utopia they are always going to bring about when they are running things.

People who invest money in the growth of civilization, are never going to pay taxes. If you try to take their stuff, they are just going to go to a more favourable location and make their money there.

Ask AOC.

I think you're referring to libertarians, actually.

 

[Northwind]

@Kimmio Laughterlove you need to go outside of the island and Lower Mainland to meet some real people who consider themselves conservatives. I think you'd be surprised that they are actually decent human beings.

 

[Northwind]

Hard left has NO Understanding of the realities of how money works. Just some fake utopia they are always going to bring about when they are running things.

And the hard right seems to have no idea what struggling human beings experience. I'm challenging Kimmio on her single-minded focus. You're just as bad, just coming from the other side.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

@Kimmio Laughterlove you need to go outside of the island and Lower Mainland to meet some real people who consider themselves conservatives. I think you'd be surprised that they are actually decent human beings.

Several of my relatives from Alberta, and one of my parents is conservative, the other pretends to be liberal mostly but I have come to realize they've absorbed some crappy conservative attitudes, or reverted back to some "in my day" thinking - I love them because they are family but I can't stand their political views. It's all fine if we never ever discuss them but at the same time I have to be authentic - I think their views are ignorant as hell - so it makes me wonder how I ended up in this family because we're so different.

For example...driving in Edmonton with my relatives...my ex was a refugee with a European accent and they never even learned how to pronounce his last name - they just laughed at their laziness...we're having a good time until somebody makes disparaging remarks about the Somali neighbourhood we passed through...then more disparaging remarks about the mosque trying to copy the signs on the churches. But they are friendly...if you're not too "different". They are friendly to their neighbours who are like them, for sure. They're a bit wary of diversity...and at the end of the day that just pisses me off.

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

And the hard right seems to have no idea what struggling human beings experience. I'm challenging Kimmio on her single-minded focus. You're just as bad, just coming from the other side.

Mr. Vibrating: Oh, I'm sorry, just one moment. Is this a five minute argument or the full half hour?

Man: Oh, just the five minutes.

Mr. Vibrating: Ah, thank you. Anyway, I did.

Man: You most certainly did not.

Mr. Vibrating: Look, let's get this thing clear; I quite definitely told you.

Man: No you did not.

Mr. Vibrating: Yes I did.

Man: No you didn't.

Mr. Vibrating: Yes I did.

Man: No you didn't.

Mr. Vibrating: Yes I did.

Man: No you didn't.

Mr. Vibrating: Yes I did.

Man: You didn't.

Mr. Vibrating: Did.

Man: Oh look, this isn't an argument.

Mr. Vibrating: Yes it is.

Man: No it isn't. It's just contradiction.

Mr. Vibrating: No it isn't.

Man: It is!

Mr. Vibrating: It is not.

Man: Look, you just contradicted me.

Mr. Vibrating: I did not.

Man: Oh you did!!

Mr. Vibrating: No, no, no.

Man: You did just then.

Mr. Vibrating: Nonsense!

Man: Oh, this is futile!

Mr. Vibrating: No it isn't.

Man: I came here for a good argument.

Mr. Vibrating: No you didn't; no, you came here for an argument.

Man: An argument isn't just contradiction.

Mr. Vibrating: It can be.

Man: No it can't. An argument is a connected series of statements intended to establish a proposition.

Mr. Vibrating: No it isn't.

Man: Yes it is! It's not just contradiction.

Mr. Vibrating: Look, if I argue with you, I must take up a contrary position.

Man: Yes, but that's not just saying 'No it isn't.'

Mr. Vibrating: Yes it is!

Man: No it isn't!

Man: Argument is an intellectual process. Contradiction is just the automatic gainsaying of any statement the other person makes.

(short pause)

Mr. Vibrating: No it isn't.

Man: It is.

Mr. Vibrating: Not at all.

 

[Northwind]

Great response @Pontifex Geronimo 13. Thanks for the giggle. I actually agree. Still, when we hold fast to one side, arguments happen. It's hard to discuss properly.

 

[Northwind]

Several of my relatives from Alberta, and one of my parents is conservative, the other pretends to be liberal mostly but I have come to realize they've absorbed some crappy conservative attitudes, or reverted back to some "in my day" thinking - I love them because they are family but I can't stand their political views. It's all fine if we never ever discuss them but at the same time I have to be authentic - I think their views are ignorant as hell - so it makes me wonder how I ended up in this family because we're so different.

Nice. Now go and live in "redneck" Alberta or northern BC and get back to me.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

Nice. Now go and live in "redneck" Alberta or northern BC and get back to me.

I'd be run out of town for my views. I've been to Edmonton dozens of times. Redneck enough. (And it really is - compared to here - things I find shockingly redneck now - didn't notice as a kid - are fairly normal there. It must be one of the most conservative cities in the country.)

 

[Pontifex Geronimo 13]

I'd be run out of town for my views. I've been to Edmonton dozens of times. Redneck enough. (And it really is - compared to here - things I find shockingly redneck are fairly normal there. It must be one of the most conservative cities in the country.)

Disagree, you’re a misguided sweetheart. I could lend you my “Make Trudeau a Drama Teacher Again” hat, and you’d be swarmed by eligible men!

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

Nice. Now go and live in "redneck" Alberta or northern BC and get back to me.

You missed that I said this:

For example...driving in Edmonton with my relatives...my ex was a refugee, and a citizen, with a European accent and they never even learned how to pronounce his last name - they just laughed at their laziness...we're having a good time until somebody makes disparaging remarks about the Somali neighbourhood we passed through...then more disparaging remarks about the mosque trying to "copy" the signs on the churches - even though they are verses from the Quran about Jesus. But they are friendly...if you're not too "different". They are friendly to their neighbours who are like them, for sure. They're a bit wary of diversity, at best, disinterested in it...and at the end of the day that just pisses me off.

 

[Northwind]

I'd be run out of town for my views. I've been to Edmonton dozens of times. Redneck enough. (And it really is - compared to here - things I find shockingly redneck now - didn't notice as a kid - are fairly normal there. It must be one of the most conservative cities in the country.)

Edmonton tends to vote NDP. In fact, you'd probably be surprised to learn that the party that comes in second in the conservative ridings where I lived is the left leaning party. Usually the NDP. You are using a very small sample size to make your assumptions.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

Edmonton tends to vote NDP. In fact, you'd probably be surprised to learn that the party that comes in second in the conservative ridings where I lived is the left leaning party. Usually the NDP. You are using a very small sample size to make your assumptions.

That may be but Alberta is more conservative than BC - the people are, you said you noticed it yourself - and Edmonton seems moreso than Calgary (I lived in Calgary for a few months).

Did you read about my experience visiting Edmonton with my ex, above? Neither of us were impressed but they were our hosts, so we just kept our mouths shut. I talk to him still and he still brings up how "redneck" that experience was - he can laugh, because it's my family (his have their own prejudices that are far removed from North American politics)...but that doesn't exactly make me feel proud.