The Gospel of Mark

[Mendalla]

The number 153 has all sorts of fascinating properties

Most of which it shares with any multiple of 9. End of digression.

 

[paradox3]

The way I understand it, a number of people were following after Jesus from which group he chose his Twelve.

The fishermen are called right after the wilderness experience & the imprisonment of John although Jesus has already begun preaching in Galilee. I don't see any multitudes of people yet but perhaps they are implied.

 

[Luce NDs]

@unsafe, yes, numbers in the bible can be quite interesting.

Remember the story of the 153 fish? I think it appears in Luke.

The number 153 has all sorts of fascinating properties. But I digress.

In eternity is much digression ... especially from hard Nuts ... permanent dark Ness?

In Quies now ...

 

[paradox3]

Why do we think Jesus called the disciples? Did He need friends and companions? Or were they called solely to assist Him in His work?

@Jae is correct. Later in the story, Jesus has close associates (some of them women) who do not form part of the 12.

 

[unsafe]

paradox3 -----your quote ------Remember the story of the 153 fish? I think it appears in Luke.

unsafe says ----Not in Luke ----In John 21 just to clarify ------------
Jesus and the Miraculous Catch of Fish

 

[paradox3]

paradox3 -----your quote ------Remember the story of the 153 fish? I think it appears in Luke.

unsafe says ----Not in Luke ----In John 21 just to clarify ------------
Jesus and the Miraculous Catch of Fish

Right you are, unsafe!

The story comes almost at the end of John's gospel and it takes place after the resurrection of Jesus.

I had to pull out my bible to check.

 

[Mendalla]

Why do we think Jesus called the disciples? Did He need friends and companions? Or were they called solely to assist Him in His work?

Most teachers of that era had them. Socrates did. The Buddha. Confucius.

Some thoughts:

Part of it is just having someone to talk to more intimately. It's hard to have two way conversations like Jesus has with the disciples with a crowd of hundreds. Today, we can pass around hand mikes and such, but back then, there was not an easy way to do it.

Part of it is, as you say, doing the work and making sure it carries on. Jesus seemed pretty aware that he was not going to be around for long so had to make sure the message could be transmitted after he was gone. Also, he was one person and to spread it more widely required more people.

Why not write it down? Most people were functionally illiterate. There is no certainty that Jesus himself was literate beyond a basic level though he was able to read the Torah in synagogue, which suggests some education. Writing it down would only get the message to those who were educated while sending out preachers with the message could reach everyone.

 

[unsafe]

PARADOX3 ----Your Quote -------Why do we think Jesus called the disciples? Did He need friends and companions? Or were they called solely to assist Him in His work?

unsafe says -----I certainly don't think the Disciples came to be because Jesus needed Friends and Companions -----God in the beginning had a Plan before He created this world and having disciples and their bring the number 12 were already planned for ----- Jesus did what His Father directed Him to do so Jesus picked the number and who the 12 would be by taking direction from His Father -----Remember Satan enters Judas --So Judas was picked for a purpose ---to fulfil the Prophecy -----all in God's Plan from the start ---

unsafe posting from Luke here ----

Luke 22:3-6 (GW)
3 Then Satan entered Judas Iscariot, one of the twelve apostles. 4 Judas went to the chief priests and the temple guards and discussed with them how he could betray Jesus. 5 They were pleased and agreed to give him some money. 6 So Judas promised to do it. He kept looking for an opportunity to betray Jesus to them when there was no crowd.

unsafe says
God's Plan then for the Disciples except for one was to continue to Preach and spread the Good News to the world after the assentation of Jesus so His free gift of eternal Salvation could be known to all the world ---

And God's plan is still playing out and no one will stop it-- till it plays out to the end whether we like it or not or whether we believe it or not -----We Humans have no say in God's Sovereign Plan -----The Good News is here but many refuse to believe or hear or take heed to it ---

 

[BetteTheRed]

-So Judas was picked for a purpose ---to fulfil the Prophecy -----all in God's Plan from the start ---

Presumably, Judas had absolutely no free will in this plan.

 

[Mendalla]

Presumably, Judas had absolutely no free will in this plan.

Assuming unsafe's version, no he did not. But we are getting ahead of things here.

 

[paradox3]

Five disciples have been chosen so far. . . four fishermen in Mark 1 and the tax collector in Mark 2.

Any ideas about why they were chosen? Did Jesus pick them at random? Did Jesus pick them for any particular reason? Was their selection preordained?

 

[Mendalla]

Mark, at least, doesn't seem to give any indication. Perhaps the Spirit guided them to him/him to them?

 

[Luce NDs]

Too much esteem can blow a good situation ... furies and vapours scatter ...

Entropy considerations can baffle as well as the concept of event horizons! Thus come downs ...

Few find these transparent situations ...

 

[Jaebius]

Assuming unsafe's version, no he did not. But we are getting ahead of things here.

But wait - @unsafe has claimed numerous times in the past that she thinks everyone's will is free.

As for Jesus and the 12, I believe that he chiefly needed people to help him carry out his mission, to continue on in his work once he was gone, and to be his friends while he was on Earth.

 

[Jaebius]

Five disciples have been chosen so far. . . four fishermen in Mark 1 and the tax collector in Mark 2.

Any ideas about why they were chosen? Did Jesus pick them at random? Did Jesus pick them for any particular reason? Was their selection preordained?

So, again, I believe Jesus had a group of missionaries following after him - not just these five. Later in Mark's account we'll see Jesus select his 12 from among them all.

 

[paradox3]

Thinking about Jesus calling those first five disciples, I realize how attached I am to the notion of Him making a random selection.

In those days and in present times, Jesus simply says, "Follow me."

Or so I believe.

 

[Luce NDs]

But wait - @unsafe has claimed numerous times in the past that she thinks everyone's will is free.

As for Jesus and the 12, I believe that he chiefly needed people to help him carry out his mission, to continue on in his work once he was gone, and to be his friends while he was on Earth.

Will is far more free than ideas and intellect as those with brutal will often tell thoughts to bes ephen off ... to allow brute forces to fall on whoever!

 

[unsafe]

paradox3 ---your quote -----Five disciples have been chosen so far. . . four fishermen in Mark 1 and the tax collector in Mark 2. Any ideas about why they were chosen? Did Jesus pick them at random? Did Jesus pick them for any particular reason? Was their selection preordained?

unsafe says ====this is my take on why God chose the fishermen -------Fishermen are adaptable to their surroundings and are hard working loyal dependable people because catching fish is their livelihood ----they know what equipment they need to do the job ---they have to be alert and observant to their environment and not mine being without sleep if necessary to bring home the food --they need to know what kind of nets and bait to use to catch the fish they are fishing ------So they already have the qualities and stamina that is needed to be Fishers of Men ------


unsafe says -----As far as the tax collector goes -----Levi was a Jew and was working for the Romans ----he invited other tax collectors and sinners to his house so it says to me his heart was open to accepting Jesus teaching -----again just my view ------

They all could have heard John The Baptise Preach before Jesus came so they could have had some exposure to John's preaching of the coming Messiah ??????

This I Know as it is scriptural ----- Jesus did nothing on His own He did what His Father directed Him To do Jesus was sent to pave the way for the New Covenant by preaching IT and then Bringing it to Pass by dying on the Cross ----God opened these men's hearts to following Jesus as soon as He said follow me ---they left straight way and followed Him ------they left their boats just as they were and never looked back and Levi followed without hesitation as well -----this is my belief ----they were called and responded to the call -------


unsafe posting here below ------this is an interesting read

What is the Meaning of 'Fishers of Men' Phrase? Elaborated Here

Lost in Translation!

'Fishers of men' in the Greek language is halieis anthrôpos. The word 'halieis' is used for someone who works at the sea, or someone who has to do with the sea. 'Anthrôpos' means mankind or humanity.

Therefore, the accurate meaning of the phrase may be described as working at the sea to catch (save) humanity, not how it is usually misunderstood that Jesus is referring to catch men physically. It is more about their spiritual salvation.

The Holy Bible has answers to every possible dilemma that this world can put on our way to seek the truth. It is just that the answers are not as direct as we wish them to be and are often misinterpreted by many. Jesus always answered questions using another question, or by means of parables. He also said in Matthew 13:9 ESV, "He who has ears to hear, let him hear." By saying this, He didn't address the physical deafness, but the spiritual deafness of the people. This spiritual deafness is something we experience even today. Our thoughts are overpowered by worldly customs and beliefs.

Therefore, the words that were uttered by our Savior more than two thousand years ago are often misunderstood, manipulated, and even falsely portrayed by the non-believers.

The phrase 'fishers of men' is interpreted in various ways by many. While some say that this phrase was used by Jesus because he was talking to Andrew and Simon Peter, as both were fishermen,
others say that the link goes back to the Old Testament, in Jeremiah 16:16, where God promises to send many fishers to help the people on earth. -----The Link With Jeremiah 16:16
The following excerpt is taken from Jeremiah 16:16, from the English Standard Version of the Holy Bible.

16 Behold, I am sending for many fishers, declares the LORD, and they shall catch them. And afterward I will send for many hunters, and they shall hunt them from every mountain and every hill, and out of the clefts of the rocks.

Many experts believe that Jesus used the phrase 'fishers of men' in relevance with the aforementioned verse of the Old Testament. In doing so, He is announcing to these men that the promised one has come to save the people on earth. When analyzing the two verses―Jeremiah 16:16 and Matthew 4:18-20―it may be implied that Jesus was actually asking Simon and Andrew to follow his footsteps and take part in the process of hunting sinners and catching lost souls, in the same way that they caught fish in the net.

Many experts doubt if Jesus used this phrase to make a connection with the Old Testament prophecy, or if it was just his way to connect with them using words that matched their occupation; only now, they had to use their skills for a higher purpose, which is to save mankind for which the Lord will give them the strength and knowledge that is needed.

 

[Mendalla]

or if it was just his way to connect with them using words that matched their occupation

I have always kind of assumed it was this kind of wordplay. Then again, I am very fond of wordplay myself so that could be a bias.

 

[Jaebius]

Thinking about Jesus calling those first five disciples, I realize how attached I am to the notion of Him making a random selection.

In those days and in present times, Jesus simply says, "Follow me."

Or so I believe.

As you know, I believe differently. I hold that Jesus does call certain people to follow him while passing by the rest.