Discrimination against a Christian?

[Mendalla]

First off, the story:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...or-being-christian-in-job-rejection-1.2791323

Okay, now I don't know if they really rejected her because of her faith or because, as they did say, she didn't meet their minimum qualifications. And it no longer matters because as soon as they brought her faith into the conversation, they opened the door to discrimination charges. Obviously, they do not have an HR department because my employer's HR Director would soundly swat (figuratively, not literally), if not beat the living daylights out of, any manager who put remarks like that in an email.

So, was she discriminated against for her faith? Maybe. Based on the emails quoted, it does look like they really had it in for her based on her having gone to Trinity Western. However, they did also say that she was not qualified so maybe there were legitimate, non-discriminatory grounds for rejecting her application. But it doesn't look good on them that they followed up that simple rejection with criticism of Trinity-Western, making it sound as though her faith was a factor.

Could the company have handled this in a way that would not have left them open to this? Definitely. Just say, "We do not feel your qualifications are sufficient for the position applied for. Thank you for taking the time to apply." and leave out the anti-Trinity-Western rhetoric.

Feel free to comment.

 

[Waterfall]

The guy with the PHd is remarkably ignorant about Christianity. He also seems to be doing what he accuses this woman of doing, and that is discriminating against her own choices in life.
I think she will win her case IMO...even if she actually wasn't qualified, there seems to be enough evidence that it wasn't his main concern.

 

[Carolla]

I agree their optics are poor.

I looked at the company website. There's obvious serious respect for First Nations people (badly injured by Christian churches) and it also comments " We embrace diversity and offer our staff and clients a tolerant environment free of harassment and prejudice." Trinity Western has made its own stance clear on issues of sexual diversity, so I can see how this would be a red flag for the company.

 

[Rowan]

Reading the article I got the feeling that the company in questions is not based in Canada. I am not even 100% sure from the article if the job itself would be in Canada. So they may be applying a different standard for what's acceptable.

I personally find the University's 'covenant' and all the intolerance it implies to be cringe-worthy but unless the employer had reason to think that this woman would be shoving that belief set in the faces of co-workers or customers I don't see how it factors into her qualification for a job.

I'd also be willing to bet that if she'd been asserting that she was turned down for the position because of being Atheist or Buddhist or of basically any other faith or philosophy other than Christian this would never have made the news.

 

[revjohn]

As soon as reference to Trinity Western University was made discrimination becomes a factor.

If she wasn't qualified then she wasn't qualified and no prospective employer is obligated to tell any hopeful candidate how far they fell short. In fact, if the company isn't hiring her they aren't even obligated to inform her that she was unsuccessful in landing the job.

That they might go the extra employer mile and call unsuccessful candidates up to tell them that they didn't make it lifts them above the crowd.

They don't get any points for going the extra mile just to be jerks, in fact, that will likely cost them something.

Historically speaking I can see the grudge against Christianity.

We all know the reputation that Vikings had for being upstandingly peaceful neighbours and respective of other cultures prior to Christianity coming to norse shores so I can see why someone proudly embracing their norse traditions would be particularly sensitive to Christianity's offences.

 

[revsdd]

I read the article. Given the rather "colourful" nature of the emails the company sent this young woman, I find it utterly impossible to believe that her Christian faith didn't enter into their decision. They essentially said that the values of Trinity Western aren't their values, and that since she had gone to that university her values would not be a match with their customers. As far as I can see, that's discrimination against her on the basis of her religious values, and given their over the top emails, I have a feeling that, even setting evangelical Christianity aside, a person open about belonging to the United Church might find it difficult to be hired by this company. I doubt that they have a well developed sense of the theological differences between various groups of Christians.

Two things in response to Rowan. First, the article was very clear that the job was to be in "Canada's North." Second, I have no doubt that anyone of any faith or no faith who went to the mainstream media with such incendiary emails from a potential employer would get media coverage.

All that aside - and I think Ms Paquette has a case here - if I were her I'd be relieved I didn't get hired by this company. Based on the emails alone, I wouldn't want to work for these guys, and I wouldn't want my daughter to ever work for them.

 

[Seeler]

I'm trying to be impartial here and finding it hard.
This is a foreign company operating in Canada. I hope that they will learn about and follow Canadian laws regarding hiring and treating employees--including not discriminating because of religion or lack of religion.
It is impossible to know if she was rejected because she didn't meet their minimum requirements, or if they had many more applicants who had better qualifications. The subsequent remarks made on the letter of rejection indicate that this might have been a major factor in their decision not to hire.

On the other hand, I think all major companies not only look at your degree in biology, engineering, theology, education, computer science, whatever; but they also look at the university where you received your degree. Our local university supposedly has a great reputation in Forestry. Harvard carries a lot of weight in Business. McMaster has a reputation in medicine. Other universities might be known for their work in theology. So, if I were reviewing applications for a position that required a top-notch education in biology, I might question at an application from a small university with a reputation for taking the Bible literally. Sorting through a hundred or so applications looking to fill four or five positions, an application from a recent graduate from Trinity might not make the short list. That said, the rejection letter would thank them for their interest and let them know that their application had been rejected (period).
Going on about their religion was not only unnecessary but opened the door for charges about discrimination.

 

[ChemGal]

I wasn't expecting it to be as bad as the article sounds. I thought it would have been one email sent. Even if she was hired, I think she would have a legitimate complaint, although I'm not certain of all the details, but I thought negative remarks about one's religion on the workplace are something that are covered as well.
Continuing on the conversation was probably a smart more on her part - further evidence, not so smart on the part of the company.

 

[chansen]

The company was wrong to say that. They were stupid to put it in email form.

Trinity Western's policies are junk, and they should not be taken seriously as a school. Still, the company is wrong here.

 

[chansen]

Going on about their religion was not only unnecessary but opened the door for charges about discrimination.

Exactly. Roll your eyes if you want.

The interesting thing about this, is it shows how the pendulum is swinging. Used to be, if you weren't a Christian, people would eye you suspiciously. In parts of the US, that's still the way. Now, there are groups, and I would expect Scandanavians (says Craig Hansen) to be among them, who are quite anti-religious. The challenge will be to keep these groups from being as discriminatory as Christian groups have historically been. We should be rising above that crap, and I think atheists have to call out these organizations to not make us all look that bad.

 

[Seeler]

Why should I roll my eyes?
We agree.

 

[Mendalla]

Why should I roll my eyes?
We agree.

I think he means roll your eyes at the company's behaviour. Like most of us are doing.

 

[Lastpointe]

It might be interesting to see what the ramifications are for the company.

For instance I wonder if they might lose their license to operate in Canada? Not like a human rights commission can make a foreign national take "awareness " courses.

Certainly he sounds like someone with a major chip on his shoulder.

As to trinity. Even though students sign a waver saying they will not engage in sex outside of marriage, I don't think it necessarily follows that you are Christian to attend there. I suspect like all schools, students pick it for a variety of reasons; courses, location, costs, friends, sports, nearness or distance from home, ...

My daughter one summer did Alvin Ailey dance in New York. It was offered through Fordham university, which all the Ailey courses are through. I guess it is also a Christian school. The big rule ere was expulsion for drinking. Of any type. A guy in her program, 25 , ws expelled.

Obviously, not everyone who goes to Fordham agrees to their standards, in this case they were there only to dance

 

[Mendalla]

Trotter said if the B.C. Human Rights Tribunal concludes his client was discriminated against, he will seek compensation for lost wages and "for injury to feelings and self respect."

This could end up costing them money which is why I commented that our HR department would absolutely go ballistic on any manager here who did something like this.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

Oh no it's the Norse vs. the Christians again? Lol.

In other news there was an interview on CBC radio (Vancouver) with an evangelical Christian who is a scientist (not a Christian Scientist) speaking about the importance of paying attention to climate change - why Christians need to wake up to it - at TW. The two stories were discussed back to back. One, highlights the biases people have against Christians in general (and possibly why) and the other, someone doing something positive about that reputation.

 

[chansen]

One, highlights the biases people have against Christians in general (and possibly why) and the other, someone doing something positive about that reputation.

Oh that's crap. There are no "biases...against Christians in general." Not in general. Have we had a single PM who wasn't a Christian? I mean, we're still supposedly 60-something percent Christian as a country. There are going to be examples of bias against Christians, but there is no bias in general. That's just Christian propaganda, acting all persecuted.

 

[Mendalla]

Have we had a single PM who wasn't a Christian?

No. In fact, a quick check suggests that Harper is the first one since Pearson (who was UCCan after being Methodist pre-union) who hasn't been Roman Catholic and he's evangelical Protestant (Christian & Missionary Alliance, my brother's denomination).

 

[Seeler]

I too did a quick google - the info I found says that Kim Campbell was an Anglican, and that she did not attend church.

Before Harper most Prime Ministers didn't seem to make a big deal about their religious affiliation and many articles about them mention home towns, schools attended, previous jobs, accomplishments and family but seldom mention religion. I thought that Joe Clark might have been Protestant but he is included in the RC list.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

@chansen all I meant to say is that if Christians have a bad reputation (and I guess I feel it more in BC because we are the most non-religious province ...say you are Christian and some people will avoid inviting to parties it's true) it could be because they are seen as anti-environment - because atheists/ agnostics will make up their minds based on what they see on TV and down south if they don't know any Christians especially or if they are only exposed to climate change denying Christians.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

See...there was a time when it never even occured to me that any of the Prime Ministers in the last 50 years were Christians or any other religion. It just was not something I thought about. And...I was the one who had a bias against Christians being anti-everything and no fun at parties. Here, when I tell people I go to the United Church a lot of people have never heard of the United Church -they ask me if it is anything like Catholic, Orthodox or Baptist. Really. I am not kidding. They have no idea about different doctrines theologies and neither did I before I went. Well, I guess I knew UCCan was a little more liberal but I did not know how or in what way really. More people have heard of the names of a couple of popular church locations because of a lot of events in town have happened there, the buildings are used for a lot of different things, but many people have no idea about the denomination. It is unfortunate actually but Christianity does have a reputation with atheists and agnostics that includes the assumption that we are all climate change deniers.

The mainstream Christian people in my family stopped going to church in the 60s and 70s and they rarely if ever mentioned they were Christian - they weren`t, openly, they were agnostic. And that was the same for most people I grew up with - agnostics and atheists.That`s BC- since the 70s pretty much - so whatever my impressions are they don`t seem to fit the rest of the Canadian picture. Interestingly...being a Vancouver interview I got the impression that the radio interviewer had the same mindset...the idea that most people see Christians as anti-environment and this woman was in town to change minds.