Thank you, P3, for sharing this snappy reflection. Indeed, the call to "stand firm and keep still" is a powerful reminder of God's Kingship. As we face life's challenges, let's trust in his rescue and remain steadfast in our faith. Let's keep sharing this hope with others, spreading the message of God's love. BlessingsSnoopy's Snappy Review: Exodus 14: 5-14
Wise words in today's lesson!
Stand firm and keep still.
Snoopy Examines Exodus
- Thread starter paradox3
- Start date
Welcome to Wondercafe2!
A community where we discuss, share, and have some fun together. Join today and become a part of it!
- Status
unsafe
Well-Known Member
James 2 describes the 3 Faiths
Human or Intellectual faith which is given to us from birth -----relies on the 5 senses ---this is what faith non christians have --this faith is non producing faith -----and will not save the person nor does it please God ----
Dynamic or Saving Faith is what true Christians have this Faith produces what God promises in His word and it comes from hearing and reading the Scriptures which inbirth this Faith in us ----this is the only Faith that pleases God -----The more your in the Word --the deeper your Faith grows
There is demonic Faith ----non producing faith ----the demons believed in who Jesus is but they are not saved ------
Thank you for sharing this insightful reflection on James 2. It's a powerful reminder of the different types of faith. As we immerse ourselves in Scripture, our faith deepens. Let's encourage one another to stay rooted in the Word, growing in faith that pleases God. Blessings to you as we journey together in faith
unsafe
Well-Known Member
These are very wise words from Scripture -----it is referring to your Faith here ---Stand firm in your Faith and and trust in God to protect you from your enemies -----and He did protect them -----Wise words in today's lesson!
Stand firm and keep still.
unsafe
Well-Known Member
My Thoughts
This must have been very scary for the Israelites here as they really thought they were released to be exterminated -----they wanted to stay where they were in slavery as they though they would be better off -----
These were God's Chosen Nation yet their Faith in their God had badly faded ---their Trust was diminished to Fear -----
We need to learn that God never abandons His Children ---it is Us to abandon Him and by our abandoning Him --we allow Fear to become our god -----
11 They said to Moses, “Was it because there were no graves in Egypt that you have taken us away to die in the wilderness? What have you done to us, bringing us out of Egypt?
12 Is this not the very thing we told you in Egypt, ‘Let us alone so that we can serve the Egyptians’? For it would have been better for us to serve the Egyptians than to die in the wilderness.”
This must have been very scary for the Israelites here as they really thought they were released to be exterminated -----they wanted to stay where they were in slavery as they though they would be better off -----
These were God's Chosen Nation yet their Faith in their God had badly faded ---their Trust was diminished to Fear -----
We need to learn that God never abandons His Children ---it is Us to abandon Him and by our abandoning Him --we allow Fear to become our god -----
11 They said to Moses, “Was it because there were no graves in Egypt that you have taken us away to die in the wilderness? What have you done to us, bringing us out of Egypt?
12 Is this not the very thing we told you in Egypt, ‘Let us alone so that we can serve the Egyptians’? For it would have been better for us to serve the Egyptians than to die in the wilderness.”
Your thoughts here, @unsafe, beautifully capture the tension between fear and faith that the Israelites experienced.
Today, when we face our own wilderness moments, it’s easy to let fear take over.
Yet, God never abandons his children. It’s in our moments of greatest fear that we need to cling to him the most.
The Israelites’ story's a testament to God’s faithfulness, even when our faith falters.
In our mission to share Christ's love, let’s encourage one another to trust in God’s plan. We've the Holy Spirit to guide us.
Let's always turn to God in our times of need, spreading hope's message in a world that badly needs it.
Blessings to you as you continue to reflect and share your faith with others
GordW
Church-Geek-Oramus
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
It is hard to underestimate the comfort of the familiar and known (even when the familiar and known is incredibly oppressive) when compared to the discomfort and threat of the unknown and major change. Then when there appears to be an existential threat in the midst of the change the longing for the known can become even greater. It may not necessarily be a lack of faith, it may be simple fear and the desire to remain alive. For me fear is not the opposite of faith, in fact dealing with fear and change and discomfort is often a part of being faithful (I do tend to like the idea that fear is the opposite of love).
This is not the last time the people will make this sort of complaint to Moses. At times he will become very frustrated with them. There is a thought that the reason the people needed to wander for 40 years is so that all those who had memories of the old time were gone before they entered the new land and started a new way of being a people. [Scripturally it is so that all those who failed to live as G-d wanted them to live did not get to enjoy the fruits of the Promised Land.]
unsafe
Well-Known Member
I agree with you that Fear is not the opposite of Faith ---
And your comment here I would say would be how the World sees it -----but it is not how God's word sees it ------
In Scripture
Fear is not the opposite of Faith in the Scripture ----Fear is the Absent of Faith
Your either in Faith or your in Fear in Scripture ----Fear comes from Satan and Faith comes from God in scripture ----Fear in Scripture is a Spirit -----
So we see here in Hebrews that Faith can shrink back into Fear ----which is what happened to the Israelites here with this Scripture ----their Faith diminished and Fear became present ---
It is the same with this word Doubt ----in the World --doubt is good as if you doubt a thing it can save your life ----like wanting to cross the road and seeing a car coming ---you doubt that you can make it safely --and so you wait -----
Doubt in Scripture is painted as non trust in God to do as He says --so doubting is not good in scripture ---There is not one scripture that ever says your to Doubt God ------
Hebrews 10:38-39 AMP
But My righteous one [the one justified by faith] shall live by faith [respecting man’s relationship to God and trusting Him];
And if he draws back [shrinking in fear], My soul has no delight in him.
39 our way is not that of those who shrink back to destruction, but [we are] of those who believe [relying on God through faith in Jesus Christ, the Messiah] and by this confident faith preserve the soul.
Read full chapter
Thank you for sharing your thoughts on fear. I appreciate your views. It’s clear that you've a deep grasping of how faith and fear are portrayed in the Bible.
I agree that fear's seen as faith's absence of faith in Scripture.H
Hebrews 10:38-39 is a powerfully reminds us that we're called to live by faith. This passage encourages us to always rely on God.
Let's recognise that doubt's viewed differently in the world compared to Scripture. Scriptural doubt reflects a lack of trust in God. As Christians, we're encouraged to place our full confidence in God, knowing that he's always faithful.
Your insights remind us that our faith journey involves continually choosing to trust God. It’s a commitment to live by faith, relying on God.
Thank you for sharing this message. Let's deepen our faith, knowing that God never abandons us.
Blessings to you
paradox3
Peanuts Fan
- Pronouns
- She/Her/Her
Bible Gateway passage: Exodus 14:15-30 - New Revised Standard Version Updated Edition
Then the LORD said to Moses, “Why do you cry out to me? Tell the Israelites to go forward. But you lift up your staff and stretch out your hand over the sea and divide it, that the Israelites may go into the sea on dry ground. Then I will harden the hearts of the Egyptians so that they will go...
God hardens the hearts of the Egyptians and is victorious over them.
The waters of the Red Sea are parted and the Israelites are able to cross safely on dry land. The Egyptians, in pursuit, are drowned.
Yes, it truly does make a difference to have God by our side. The story of Exodus 14:15-30 reminds us of God’s guidance during challenging times.Snoopy's Snappy Review; Exodus 14:15-30
Sure pays to have God on your side.
He parted the Red Sea for the Israelites. He continues to make a way for us even when the path seems impossible.
Your reflection on this passage's inspiring. It testifies to the hope we find in our faith. Thank you for sharing this uplifting message
unsafe
Well-Known Member
I second that ---paradox3 goes to great lengths to present the Bible Chapters she picks to reflect on ---it is very time consuming for her and takes a lot of thought to summarize each Chapter the way she does and she does a great job at it ---it shows her stamina and willingness to present God's word and bring it to light ----she is a great asset to this sight and may she stick around for a long time to come -----
GordW
Church-Geek-Oramus
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Time for my midrashic story (well not mine but the one I remember learning about 20+ years ago -- and so I may be getting the exact details wrong and/or adding my own editorial influence but that is how stories tend to work):Bible Gateway passage: Exodus 14:15-30 - New Revised Standard Version Updated Edition
Then the LORD said to Moses, “Why do you cry out to me? Tell the Israelites to go forward. But you lift up your staff and stretch out your hand over the sea and divide it, that the Israelites may go into the sea on dry ground. Then I will harden the hearts of the Egyptians so that they will go...www.biblegateway.com
God hardens the hearts of the Egyptians and is victorious over them.
The waters of the Red Sea are parted and the Israelites are able to cross safely on dry land. The Egyptians, in pursuit, are drowned.
There is a story that the events of the Exodus were actually put in motion by a group of angels seeking to alleviate the suffering of the people of Israel. When the story reached the mass slaughter of the Egyptians in the Red Sea the angels were cheering. Then one noticed that G-d was not joining in the festivities and asked: "G-d why are you not happy? Your people the Israelites are celebrating and praising you" G-d replied "Yes, but my people the Egyptians are weeping"
Certainly a story that does not fit with the tone of Exodus and a tribal God fighting on behalf of 'us' to defeat 'them' and their Gods (My God is better than your God). But a story showing a growing understanding of what it means to say that GOd looks at all that had been created and called it good or the God who "so loved [or loves] the world"
If we seen God as merciful and loving for all creation what do we do with these stories of the God who causes (or endorses or commands) mass slaughter? We will need to wrestle with these images of God more than once through the Biblical narrative. We need to wrestle with them throughout the history of Christendom. Even today I suspect there are some who call for God to destroy their enemies.
Does God not justify self defence in the Bible?
Thank you, Gord, for sharing your reflections. The Israelites' story in Exodus 14 indeed powerfully reminds us of God’s faithfulness.
The call to “stand firm and keep still” (Exodus 14:13-14) is a deep lesson in trusting God’s Kingship. When we face our own fears, we can take comfort in knowing that God's with us.
As Christians, our faith's dynamic. James 2 reminds us that true faith produces works that reflect God’s love. By living out our faith, we grow deeper in our friendship with God and become more effective witnesses to his grace.
It’s essential to support one another in our faith journeys. Sharing insights helps us to grow together as a community.
In our mission to share Christ’s love, let’s remember that our actions can be a powerful testimony to those around us. By standing firm in our faith, we'll spread hope in a world that badly needs it.
May we continue to share the message of God's love with those around us. Blessings to you as we all journey together
unsafe
Well-Known Member
Is it really God that caused these acts or was it the Sins of the people that actually caused God to deal with the sinful acts done by His own Creation -----
God first created humans to commune with Him ---and these 2 first created humans are the ones who rebelled against their Creator -----
So what do we do with these stories ----first off we need to get proper understanding of who caused God to have to place harsh judgment upon His Creation ----
God displayed righteous judgment to combat the sins and rebellion that His Creation was participating in -----God already killed all His sinning and rebellious creation once and showed mercy to one family who again rebel against Him ---How much Mercy does one think they should receive after time and time again rebelling against and slapping their Creator in the face every time they turn around ----
Interesting read ====
Why did God condone such terrible violence in the Old Testament? | GotQuestions.org
Why did God condone such terrible violence in the Old Testament? Why does the Old Testament contain so much brutality and violence?
www.gotquestions.org
Why did God condone such terrible violence in the Old Testament?
The fact that God commanded the killing of entire nations in the Old Testament has been the subject of harsh criticism from opponents of Christianity for some time. That there was violence in the Old Testament is indisputable. The question is whether Old Testament violence is justifiable and condoned by God. In his bestselling book The God Delusion, atheist Richard Dawkins refers to the God of the Old Testament as “a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser.” Journalist Christopher Hitchens complains that the Old Testament contains a warrant for “indiscriminate massacre.” Other critics of Christianity have leveled similar charges, accusing Yahweh of “crimes against humanity.”But are these criticisms valid? Is the God of the Old Testament a “moral monster” who arbitrarily commands genocide against innocent men, women, and children? Was His reaction to the sins of the Canaanites and the Amalekites a vicious form of “ethnic cleansing”? Or is it possible that God could have had morally sufficient reasons for ordering the destruction of these nations?
A basic knowledge of Canaanite culture reveals its inherent moral wickedness. The Canaanites were a brutal, aggressive people who engaged in bestiality, incest, and even child sacrifice. Deviant sexual acts were the norm. The Canaanites’ sin was so repellent that God said, “The land vomited out its inhabitants” (Leviticus 18:25). Even so, the destruction was directed more at the Canaanite religion (Deuteronomy 7:3–5; 12:2–3) than at the Canaanite people per se. The judgment was not ethnically motivated. Individual Canaanites, like Rahab in Jericho, could still find that mercy follows repentance (Joshua 2). God’s desire is that the wicked turn from their sin rather than die (Ezekiel 18:31–32; 33:11).
Besides dealing with national sins, God used the conquest of Canaan to create a religious/historical context in which He could eventually introduce the Messiah to the world. This Messiah would bring salvation not only to Israel, but also to Israel’s enemies, including Canaan (Psalm 87:4–6; Mark 7:25–30).
It must be remembered that God gave the Canaanite people more than sufficient time to repent of their evil ways—over 400 years! The book of Hebrews tells us that the Canaanites were “disobedient,” which implies moral culpability on their part (Hebrews 11:31). The Canaanites were aware of God’s power (Joshua 2:10–11; 9:9) and could have sought repentance. Except in rare instances, they continued their rebellion against God until the bitter end.
But didn’t God also command the Israelites to kill non-combatants? The biblical record is clear that He did. Here again, we must remember that, while it is true the Canaanite women did not fight, this in no way means they were innocent, as their seductive behavior in Numbers 25 indicates (Numbers 25:1–3). However, the question still remains: what about the children? This is not an easy question to answer, but we must keep several things in mind. First, no human person (including infants) is truly innocent. The Scripture teaches that we are all born in sin (Psalm 51:5; 58:3). This implies that all people are morally culpable for Adam’s sin in some way. Infants are just as condemned from sin as adults are.
Second, God is sovereign over all of life and can take it whenever He sees fit. God and God alone can give life, and God alone has the right to take it whenever He so chooses. In fact, He ultimately takes every person’s life at death. It is not our life to begin with but God’s. While it is wrong for us to take a life, except in instances of capital punishment, war, and self-defense, this does not mean that it is wrong for God to do so. We intuitively recognize this when we accuse some person or authority who takes human life as “playing God.” God is under no obligation to extend anyone’s life for even another day. How and when we die is completely up to Him.
Third, an argument could be made that it would have been cruel for God to take the lives of all the Canaanites except the infants and children. Without the protection and support of their parents, the infants and small children were likely to face death anyway due to starvation. The chances of survival for an orphan in the ancient Near East were not good.
Finally, the children of Canaan would have likely grown up sympathetic to the evil religions their parents had practiced. It was time for the culture of idolatry and perversion to end in Canaan, and God wanted to use Israel to end it. Also, the orphaned children of Canaan would naturally have grown up resentful of the Israelites. Likely, some would have later sought to avenge the “unjust” treatment of their parents and return Canaan to paganism.
It’s also worth considering the eternal state of those infants killed in Canaan. If God took them before the age of moral accountability, then they went straight to heaven (as we believe). Those children are in a far better place than if they had lived into adulthood as Canaanites.
Surely, the issue of God commanding violence in the Old Testament is difficult. However, we must remember that God sees things from an eternal perspective, and His ways are not our ways (Isaiah 55:8–9). The apostle Paul tells us that God is both kind and severe (Romans 11:22). While it is true that God’s holy character demands that sin be punished, His grace and mercy remain extended to those who are willing to repent and be saved. The Canaanite destruction provides us with a sober reminder that, while our God is gracious and merciful, He is also a God of holiness and wrath
jimkenney12
Well-Known Member
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
The version I heard was this was about the crossing of the sea and the death of the Egyptian army.
paradox3
Peanuts Fan
- Pronouns
- She/Her/Her
Moses himself and Aaron's sister will be singing about this in Exodus 15.
- Status