Gender assignment

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Ritafee said:
Many professionals remain critical about the puberty-blocking treatment (e.g.25, 41, 42).

The primary counterarguments are as follows:

1. At Tanner stage 2 or 3, the individual is not sufficiently mature or authentically free to take such a decision.25, 41

2. It is not possible to make a certain diagnosis of GD in adolescence, because in this phase, gender identity is still fluctuating.25, 41, 42

3. Moreover, puberty suppression may inhibit a ‘spontaneous formation of a consistent gender identity, which sometimes develops through the “crisis of gender”’ (p. 375).43

4. Considering the high percentage of desisters, early somatic treatment may be premature and inappropriate.25

5. Research about the effects of early interventions on the development of bone mass and growth – typical events of hormonal puberty – and on brain development is still limited,7 so we cannot know the long-term effects on a large number of cases.

6. Although current research suggests that there are no effects on social, emotional and school functioning, ‘potential effects may be too subtle to observe during the follow-up sessions by clinical assessment alone’ (p. 1895).25

7. The impact on sexuality has not yet been studied, but the restriction of sexual appetite brought about by blockers may prevent the adolescent from having age-appropriate socio-sexual experiences.41

8. In light of this fact, early interventions may interfere with the patient's development of a free sexuality and may limit her or his exploration of sexual orientation.41, 42

9. Finally, for trans girls (natal boys with a female gender identification), the blockage of phallic growth may result in less genital tissue available for an optimal vaginoplasty.44

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2444866417301101

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Buying time or arresting development?
The dilemma of administering hormone blockers in trans children and adolescents.
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I'm thinking that the point is that these humans are working with medical professionals, and it's none of my business what they decide is best.
 
I'm not suggesting that there isn't potential harm with this particular strategy (hormone blockers until a pretty serious decision is made), I'm suggesting that there's no agenda involved in medical decisions made between doctor and patient.
 
Yet social transition has been shown to be predictive of persistence of GD (Ristori 2016). This means that even though young children nearly always desist from believing they are the opposite sex, socially transitioned kids are much more likely to begin puberty-blocking drugs at age 8 or 9, and then carry on with the rest of the complex medicalized transition process. If parents make any objection or refuse to “affirm” their child’s plan, they are shamed and belittled as “transphobes.” In some instances, parents can even be prosecuted and have their children taken away by the government.

Under the affirmative model, adolescents and adults are generally enabled to pursue medical interventions right away, seldom being told by their doctors “no, you are making a mistake.”

GD is not sui generis, unique, super-special! It is well within the spectrum of conditions efficaciously treated with transdiagnostic approaches. It is as though the “transition” promoters of mainstream transgenderism had some kind of a racket going on.

Trans industry “hormones and surgery” dogma has kept anyone from testing the new methods. When simple remedies are untried, it is not preferable to put healthy but confused patients on lifelong drug regimens and offer them drastic surgeries that do not accomplish what patients hope they will do and are often accompanied by significant complications.

If it is possible to help people with GD to cope with, and perhaps even recover from GD, using an inexpensive approach that is feasible to implement anywhere, this would surely be better than the extreme and lifelong medical interventions currently presented as the only alternative to a life of misery (or a life lost to suicide).

Proponents of affirmative care have dealt the deathblow to what little gatekeeping that remains. Their activities could well be described as marketing and recruitment for “being trans.” Patients of any age need only say they think they are really the opposite sex, or wish they were, and affirmative care clinicians are happy to get busy, scheduling surgeries and prescribing lifelong drug regimens. They seem to see themselves as affirmative pioneers, especially those who work tirelessly to provide medical interventions to more and more children and teens, thus creating an iatrogenic illusion from which the kids may never emerge.

Exerpts from:
The Theatre of the Body: A detransitioned epidemiologist examines suicidality, affirmation, and transgender identity
by Hacsi Horváth, MA, PgCert (Sheffield)
  • This article is a long read, and includes detailed analysis of several research studies. Interested readers may want to review the bibliography and familiarize themselves with the relevant studies in order to engage most meaningfully with this post.
 
Jae said:
Do some serious work in therapy...? What kind of therapy do you have in mind here Bette?
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Get some ... JahZ you might like what you don't know! Hidden there are vast potentials ... some gentile some corrupting powers as Jews 'd there in drah Ma ...

Can't see it? Must be out of it ... or beyond yourself ... an expansive trait! We are initiated as prone to it in either emotional or intellectual attributes ... good to awaken these as balanced ... apocalyptic instants ... then one rests again!

Thus the prayer ... give it a rest and it will heap up ... perhaps as a watchman as a bubble on a stick! Cereus lyre these may bust into a poppie or even poesy as altruism in appearance ... but say it isn't so! Thus illusionary life of the past ... it went in a vague way due to human power of corruption and redaction ... borderline behavioural tactics of greater powers?

See what powers do:


Some digging and excavation is helpful into the nature of powerful redaction is words causing great expanses of chaos ...

That's us even though many declare they know what's coming ... that's the mystery of God's whole thing ... somewhat beyond mortal capture ... thus out ... in High Flight ... some say Maleficent process ... a payne in so Rass!

Searching the meaning and reason of RASS is sheer chaos ... no end to the alteration ... in due form you will to ... a fishy transformation to amino acids? THus it all breaks down to foundations of genes ... with considerable interference from folks claiming to know what they do not! In some cases this is radically determinate ... an learning is no more ... no Moors at 'll!

Does doctor in healing allow some change ... not part of the determinate world and the indeterminate is yet to be noted as more learning to transpire ... an aspiration for those not institutionalized in emotional options ... opinions?

Professed doctrine ... can't be wrong ... thus errs are buried as in covenanted ... fabrications? Look for the robe ...
 
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If I understand the conversations among my teen and young adult kids the notion of being "gender fluid" (without intervention) is now well accepted. As I understand this means that kids/teens simply behave/dress/identify as they feel called and are supported by their community in their choices. Clarifying one's choice of personal pronouns and so on is well accepted among my boys' friends. Surgery and permanent options are delayed until adulthood (if then) and a prolonged discernment period. To me, this seems like a good thing. I like the idea that rather than forcing a person into some culturally imposed and rigid binary (by drugs, surgery, whatever) these kids are advocating for people living the lives and identities they feel most appropriate, as well as acknowledging that these identifies can be fluid.

My youngest attends a very small faith-based school where several kids identify as gender fluid and one student in gr. 12 identifies as a trans male. My son recently wrote an opinion piece for a journalism entry on the role of gender/sexuality alliance and affirmation at religious schools. I thought is was very well done.
 
DaisyJane said:
If I understand the conversations among my teen and young adult kids the notion of being "gender fluid" (without intervention) is now well accepted. As I understand this means that kids/teens simply behave/dress/identify as they feel called and are supported by their community in their choices. Clarifying one's choice of personal pronouns and so on is well accepted among my boys' friends. Surgery and permanent options are delayed until adulthood (if then) and a prolonged discernment period. To me, this seems like a good thing. I like the idea that rather than forcing a person into some culturally imposed and rigid binary (by drugs, surgery, whatever) these kids are advocating for people living the lives and identities they feel most appropriate, as well as acknowledging that these identifies can be fluid.

My youngest attends a very small faith-based school where several kids identify as gender fluid and one student in gr. 12 identifies as a trans male. My son recently wrote an opinion piece for a journalism entry on the role of gender/sexuality alliance and affirmation at religious schools. I thought is was very well done.
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:confused:o_O:eek::oops:
 
Jae said:
I think these things are generally true. They were all true with my siblings and I and our friends. Well, except that my brother and I preferred Star Trek toys to Star Wars toys.
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I would vehemently disagree that these "things" are generally true.

I have parented three boys. Same parenting approach, same schools, same faith based upbringing.

My eldest is a classic boys' boy. As a kid he loved dinosaurs, trucks, snakes, hockey, and so on. He has classic boy (now "dude") interests. He loves sports and can talk about the Leafs until we have all fallen asleep.

My youngest spend the first four years of his life preferring dresses to anything else. His interests would have been classified as more "girl" as a young child. He loved his hot pink princess bike and asked for dolls for Christmas. His preferred books would have been the sort girls borrowed from the library. He studied dance. While both of my able-bodied boys are bright, my youngest was (and is) unusually precocious and gifted.

Now as a young adult he loves theatre and complains that the high-school curriculum doesn't have enough Shakespeare. In grade eleven he chose to do an advanced study on feminist issues in Atwood's The Handmaid's Tale. Most of his friends are girls and his interests, even these days, would veer in the direction of "feminine-ish". He hates organized sports and teases his brother about how the Leaf's play baseball. He does enjoy fencing, archery, and cross country, though.

After my parenting experiences you can't convince me that these gender issues aren't hard-wired at birth. I simply stood back and allowed my boys to be who they were and nurtured them along the way. If they wanted to study ballet I signed them up. If they wanted hockey sticks I bought them. I took my cues from them without any agenda about how a boy should behave.
 
An added thought.

While my youngest presented as more "girl-ish" as a young child, what we didn't do was run him to a doctor and suggest, at age four, that he had some sort of gender identity disorder and required intervention. We just simply let him be whoever he wanted to be.
 
DaisyJane said:
I would vehemently disagree that these "things" are generally true.

I have parented three boys. Same parenting approach, same schools, same faith based upbringing.

My eldest is a classic boys' boy. As a kid he loved dinosaurs, trucks, snakes, hockey, and so on. He has classic boy (now "dude") interests. He loves sports and can talk about the Leafs until we have all fallen asleep.

My youngest spend the first four years of his life preferring dresses to anything else. His interests would have been classified as more "girl" as a young child. He loved his hot pink princess bike and asked for dolls for Christmas. His preferred books would have been the sort girls borrowed from the library. He studied dance. While both of my able-bodied boys are bright, my youngest was (and is) unusually precocious and gifted.

Now as a young adult he loves theatre and complains that the high-school curriculum doesn't have enough Shakespeare. In grade eleven he chose to do an advanced study on feminist issues in Atwood's The Handmaid's Tale. Most of his friends are girls and his interests, even these days, would veer in the direction of "feminine-ish". He hates organized sports and teases his brother about how the Leaf's play baseball. He does enjoy fencing, archery, and cross country, though.

After my parenting experiences you can't convince me that these gender issues aren't hard-wired at birth. I simply stood back and allowed my boys to be who they were and nurtured them along the way. If they wanted to study ballet I signed them up. If they wanted hockey sticks I bought them. I took my cues from them without any agenda about how a boy should behave.
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Congratulations on the successful parenting of your oldest boy.
 
So Jae.

I am asking this genuinely, so stop being a jerk for a second.

Why is it so important to you that boys be boys and girls be girls? So much so that you would force someone to be something/one they weren't.
 
I think you made good decisions with the kids you got to raise Daisyjane. I have a grand who enjoys many things that aren't typical for their gender and heartily dislikes some that are. Fortunate kids who have parents that love and support them.
 
I am sorry @DaisyJane that you would be exposed to such a remark.

When we share the story of our families, of our personal life, we open ourselves up.
This place needs to hold those relationships in the gentle hands.

Again, I am sorry. I am thankful for your participation in this thread.
 
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