Snoopy Examines Exodus

[Mystic]

We think we are keeping Sabbath, but not as strictly as ancient Jews.
When I toured Israel, I once stayed on the 22nd floor of a huge hotel on the Dead Sea on the Sabbath.
The hotel restaurant was in the basement. When I stepped into the elevator, I found to my amusement that the buttons had been disabled because pushing an elevator button was deemed "work." So the elevator stopped at each of the 22 floors and the door opened for a long wait, even though no one was waiting to get on! It took what seemed like forever to get down to the basement for breakfast..

 

[unsafe]

How completely does God expect us to adhere to these commandments? Is 100% compliance even possible?

Are all ten commandments equal in God's eyes?

You can't keep them ----if you break one you break them all ---so it is fruitless -----and if your thinking that all you have to do is keep the 10 ----No ----the law includes 603 laws plus the 10 which makes it 613 laws which are to be kept ----

The Israelites make a big mistake by promising to keep the Commands ----God knew they couldn't keep any of the 613 law perfectly ----cause they are flawed human being and the laws are perfect ---

God gave the laws to show the Israelites their sin -----the law was their schoolmaster -----till Jesus came to fulfil the 613 laws ----perfectly ---so He could bring in His new Covenant ===

The law still stands today for unbelievers ---

1 Timothy 1:9-20

 

[paradox3]

Haven't we already discussed the 613 laws? And the Noahide laws?

Could we focus on Exodus 20 please?

IMHO the Ten Commandments are goalposts, so to speak.

 

[unsafe]

interesting read here

The 10 Commandments: List and Bible Meaning Explained

The 10 Commandments were given to the Israel nation through Moses. These laws of "thou shalt not" are meant for our protection and guidance. We have written a complete guide to the 10 Commandments below including full Scripture passages, helpful articles and videos, and a short summary list.

www.biblestudytools.com

Meaning of the 10 Commandments​

The ten laws that God gave the Israelites at Sinai have come to be known as The Ten Commandments or the Decalogue, “a Hebrew expression, which occurs three times in the Old Testament and literally means ‘ten words.’” The first four commandments deal with the Israelites' responsibility to God, and the final six commandments address the Israelites' responsibility toward each other. Here is a summary and brief explanation of the Ten Commandments found in Exodus 20:

1. “You shall have no other gods before me.” God desires our complete loyalty and allegiance for our own benefit, not to forget His divine providence. This command forbids placing anyone or anything above God. (New Testament References: 1 Corinthians 8:6; 1 Timothy 2:5)
2. “You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below….” This command forbids the use of any man-made image for the purpose of worship. No human has the ability to create a piece of artwork or construct a statue that accurately represents God. He alone is worthy of worship. (New Testament References: 1 John 5:21, Galatians 4:8, Romans 1:21-23)
3. Don’t misuse God’s name—This command forbids mishandling, lightly using, or speaking in vain the name of God. (New Testament References: 1 Timothy 6:1, Matthew 5:33-37)
4. Remember the Sabbath day and keep it holy—This commandment required the Israelites to set aside a specific day of the week to dedicate as a day of rest to the Lord—the Sabbath. (New Testament References: Hebrews 4:1-11 tells us that Jesus fulfilled this law completely. Christians find their Sabbath rest in the person of Jesus Christ. Colossians 2:16 confirms that New Covenant Believers are no longer required to adhere to Sabbath laws.)
5. Honor your mother and father—This command requires that parents be shown honor and respect. It’s also the only command that comes with a promise. “so that you may live long in the land the LORD your God is giving you.” (New Testament References: Ephesians 6:1-2, Matthew 15:4-9)
6. Do not murder—This command forbids the premeditated killing of another human being. (New Testament References: Romans 13:9; 1 Peter 4:15)
7. Don’t commit adultery—This command forbids breaking the sacred marriage covenant by having sexual relations with anyone other than one’s spouse. (New Testament References: 1 Corinthians 6:9-10, John 8:1-20)
8. Don’t steal—This command forbids taking someone else’s possessions without permission. (New Testament References: Ephesians 4:28, Luke 19:8)
9. Don’t give false testimony against your neighbor—This command forbids testifying falsely against someone in court, but the context also implies that lying is forbidden. (New Testament References: Revelation 21:8, John 8:44)
10. Don’t covet—This command forbids harboring a desire for someone else’s possessions, spouse, or property. (New Testament References: Colossians 3:5, Ephesians 5:3)

 

[unsafe]

Don’t give false testimony against your neighbor—This command forbids testifying falsely against someone in court, but the context also implies that lying is forbidden. (New Testament References: Revelation 21:8, John 8:44)

IMHO ---The 9 Command is the goalpost changer ------

Remember if you break one law you break them all ------at some point in our daily ---weekly monthly --yearly life we have all told a lie -----who can say that they have never lied -----no one -----

So even if you kept all others ----except this one ----you just failed keeping all 10 commandments -----

Not an easy fix here to keep them -----and God designed it that way ----to show sin ----

Then Jesus came and made it more difficult to keep them by saying if you just think in your mind of doing one of these --your guilty of doing it ----so trying to keep these 10 Commands is futile -----

Jesus who is our Saviour is the only one who can get you clear of failing to keep the 10 laws -----

 

[paradox3]

@unsafe
Sorry, I don't understand how breaking one commandment means breaking them all. Please elaborate and explain where you are getting this.

You are correct about Jesus upping the ante on a few of the laws.

I do not accept the idea that God gave the Israelites these laws in order to demonstrate sin. I prefer to think that God desired ethical behaviour and defined it for them in simple terms.

I would have picked coveting over lying to make the point that we all fall short of God's commandments. Gratitude as a spiritual practice can be elusive.

 

[GordW]

I do not accept the idea that God gave the Israelites these laws in order to demonstrate sin. I prefer to think that God desired ethical behaviour and defined it for them in simple terms.

Some sections of Paul (or some pseudo-Paul as I recall the idea shows up in multiple letters) can lead to that conclusion as PAul tries to explicate the LAw-Grace equation. Certainly that is not the predominant Jewish understanding of Torah.

 

[Jaebius]

@unsafe
Sorry, I don't understand how breaking one commandment means breaking them all. Please elaborate and explain where you are getting this.

You are correct about Jesus upping the ante on a few of the laws.

I do not accept the idea that God gave the Israelites these laws in order to demonstrate sin. I prefer to think that God desired ethical behaviour and defined it for them in simple terms.

I would have picked coveting over lying to make the point that we all fall short of God's commandments. Gratitude as a spiritual practice can be elusive.

The concept that breaking one commandment means breaking them all is rooted in James 2:10, “Suppose you keep the whole law but trip over just one part of it. Then you are guilty of breaking all of it” (NIrV). This verse stresses the Law's holistic nature. It’s about the spirit of obedience

 

[paradox3]

Certainly that is not the predominant Jewish understanding of Torah.

One Jewish interpretation of the Law is that it serves to imbue holiness into every aspect of life.

 

[unsafe]

One Jewish interpretation of the Law is that it serves to imbue holiness into every aspect of life.

That is not what God says -----the law was given to show the Israelites their sin ---and it does the same today for those who are still under the laws ----all unbelievers today are still under the laws ----as per scripture ----

Galatians 3:19​

​

19 Why, then, the Law [what was its purpose]? It was added [after the promise to Abraham, to reveal to people their guilt] because of transgressions [that is, to make people conscious of the sinfulness of sin


How could the law imbue holiness into every aspect of the Jewish life ----when they couldn't keep it ---and they can't keep it today -----their interpretation makes no sense ---The Laws themselves are perfect and holy ---but no human being Jewish or otherwise can keep the laws ----Jesus is the only one who kept the laws in a perfect and holy manner ----

 

[BetteTheRed]

Again, unsafe, you disrespect the religion from which yours arose.

 

[paradox3]

Bible Gateway passage: Exodus 20:18-26 - New English Translation

All the people were seeing the thundering and the lightning, and heard the sound of the horn, and saw the mountain smoking—and when the people saw it they trembled with fear and kept their distance. They said to Moses, “You speak to us and we will listen, but do not let God speak with us, lest...

www.biblegateway.com

The people tremble with fear. Moses tells them the fear of God will keep them from sinning. Moses approaches the thick darkness where God is.

God instructs Moses to build an altar of earth and to sacrifice on it burnt offerings and peace offerings. God promises to come with blessings.

 

[paradox3]

Snoopy's Snappy Review: Exodus 20: 18-26

God desires both ethical behaviour and animal sacrifices.

How weird is that?

 

[paradox3]

The concept that breaking one commandment means breaking them all is rooted in James 2:10, “Suppose you keep the whole law but trip over just one part of it. Then you are guilty of breaking all of it” (NIrV). This verse stresses the Law's holistic nature. It’s about the spirit of obedience

This, too, is open to interpretation. And context is everything. Perhaps James is stressing the universal need for God's grace.

At any rate, I am not sure we should be relying on the New Testament to interpret the Old. I do not view the Bible as one continuous narrative although there are some Christians who do.

 

[Jaebius]

This, too, is open to interpretation. And context is everything. Perhaps James is stressing the universal need for God's grace.

At any rate, I am not sure we should be relying on the New Testament to interpret the Old. I do not view the Bible as one continuous narrative although there are some Christians who do.

Your point of view on the relationship between the Old and New Testaments is an interesting one. While you don't view the Bible as one continuous narrative, many Christians, including myself, see it as one that reveals God's redemptive plan for humanity. This point of view helps us grasp how the Old Testament's promises are fulfilled in the New Testament through Christ

 

[GordW]

Your point of view on the relationship between the Old and New Testaments is an interesting one. While you don't view the Bible as one continuous narrative, many Christians, including myself, see it as one that reveals God's redemptive plan for humanity. This point of view helps us grasp how the Old Testament's promises are fulfilled in the New Testament through Christ

This is really a whole other thread of discussion. Many do not see that the Jewish Scripture promises are fulfilled in Christ without re-interpreting what some of those promises mean. Even if all of Scripture is about the God who tries to lead humanity it a specific path/encourage humanity to live in a particular way (as I believe it is) that does not make it a continuous narrative. But that is a topic deserving its one place of discussion as it is not really about Exodus.

 

[GordW]

That is not what God says -----the law was given to show the Israelites their sin ---and it does the same today for those who are still under the laws ----all unbelievers today are still under the laws ----as per scripture ----

Galatians 3:19​

​

19 Why, then, the Law [what was its purpose]? It was added [after the promise to Abraham, to reveal to people their guilt] because of transgressions [that is, to make people conscious of the sinfulness of sin


How could the law imbue holiness into every aspect of the Jewish life ----when they couldn't keep it ---and they can't keep it today -----their interpretation makes no sense ---The Laws themselves are perfect and holy ---but no human being Jewish or otherwise can keep the laws ----Jesus is the only one who kept the laws in a perfect and holy manner ----

That is a PAuline and Christian (and I suspect that 200o years of Christian gloss may have taken this line of reasoning beyond where Paul was intending to go) interpretation. IT is not the only way of viewing TOrah-- which many Jewish commentators over the centuries have seen as God's gift to the people.

 

[paradox3]

Bible Gateway passage: Exodus 21 - New English Translation

The Ordinances - “These are the ordinances that you will set before them: Hebrew Servants - “If you buy a Hebrew servant, he is to serve you for six years, but in the seventh year he will go out free without paying anything. If he came in by himself he will go out by himself; if he had a wife...

www.biblegateway.com

God instructs Moses to set out several ordinances for the people. They fall into three categories:

Hebrew servants
Personal injury
Animals

Definitely worth a read!

Anyone who behaves disgracefully towards his parents shall be put to death.

If you happen to knock out a tooth of a male or female servant, the servant shall go free in return for the tooth.

And more!!!

 

[paradox3]

Snoopy's Snappy Review: Exodus 21

Wow!
You definitely need to read it!

 

[BetteTheRed]

Talks about men selling their daughters into slavery. Yuck.