Read my added remarks on the same post.
Is Jesus Really Coming Again?
- Thread starter Waterfall
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unsafe
Well-Known Member
Waterfall ---you said ----If the rapture were true it would mesh with all scripture about Christs coming....but it doesn't.
Well---- I say this person is not alone--- there are many who do not believe in being caught up with Jesus ----or the Rapture as many call it -----here is one person who does believe in it in the article I posted below -------
So for me personally -----God has the ability to do it and did Rapture 2 people who were faithful to God ----and Jesus assented into heaven from the earth -----so again it is all about personal belief -----I am one who believes in it --
==========================================================================
This is an interesting read -----this says it is consistent in scripture ---so again some believe some don't -----some say it is in scripture some say it isn't ------but the Scripture I posted in 1 Thessalonians definitely says it ------- I suggest you read all --only posting this part -----
May 2009
Why I Believe The Bible Teaches Rapture Before Tribulation
by Thomas Ice
Churches today often neglect the study and preaching of biblical prophecy because they consider it a controversial and impractical topic. At the same time, many bemoan the apathy of believers and struggle to encourage people toward holy living. Churches caught in this trap need to consider that the teaching of the Rapture, woven throughout the fabric of the New Testament, addresses these issues and can provide motivation for godliness. No single Bible verse says precisely when the Rapture will take place in relation to the Tribulation or the Second Coming in a way that would settle the issue to everyone’s satisfaction. However, this does not mean that the Scriptures do not teach a clear position on this matter, for it does. As we shall see later, the Bible does promise that the church will not enter the time of God’s wrath, which is another term for the tribulation. Many biblical passages teach the pretribulational rapture of the church
Foundational Issues Four affirmations provide a biblical framework for the Pretribulational Rapture: They are (1) consistent literal interpretation, (2) Premillennialism, (3) futurism, and (4) a distinction between Israel and the church. These are not mere suppositions, but rather are important biblical doctrines upon which the doctrine of the Rapture is built.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I say ---This is from your favourite sight LOL ---so they believe in it ----read all for yourselves
uestion: "What is the rapture of the church?"
Answer: The word rapture does not occur in the Bible. The term comes from a Latin word meaning “a carrying off, a transport, or a snatching away.” The concept of the “carrying off” or the rapture of the church is clearly taught in Scripture.
The rapture of the church is the event in which God “snatches away” all believers from the earth in order to make way for His righteous judgment to be poured out on the earth during the tribulation period. The rapture is described primarily in 1 Thessalonians 4:13–18 and 1 Corinthians 15:50–54. God will resurrect all believers who have died, give them glorified bodies, and take them from the earth, along with all living believers, who will also be given glorified bodies at that time. “For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever” (1 Thessalonians 4:16–17).
Well---- I say this person is not alone--- there are many who do not believe in being caught up with Jesus ----or the Rapture as many call it -----here is one person who does believe in it in the article I posted below -------
So for me personally -----God has the ability to do it and did Rapture 2 people who were faithful to God ----and Jesus assented into heaven from the earth -----so again it is all about personal belief -----I am one who believes in it --
==========================================================================
This is an interesting read -----this says it is consistent in scripture ---so again some believe some don't -----some say it is in scripture some say it isn't ------but the Scripture I posted in 1 Thessalonians definitely says it ------- I suggest you read all --only posting this part -----
May 2009
Why I Believe The Bible Teaches Rapture Before Tribulation
by Thomas Ice
Churches today often neglect the study and preaching of biblical prophecy because they consider it a controversial and impractical topic. At the same time, many bemoan the apathy of believers and struggle to encourage people toward holy living. Churches caught in this trap need to consider that the teaching of the Rapture, woven throughout the fabric of the New Testament, addresses these issues and can provide motivation for godliness. No single Bible verse says precisely when the Rapture will take place in relation to the Tribulation or the Second Coming in a way that would settle the issue to everyone’s satisfaction. However, this does not mean that the Scriptures do not teach a clear position on this matter, for it does. As we shall see later, the Bible does promise that the church will not enter the time of God’s wrath, which is another term for the tribulation. Many biblical passages teach the pretribulational rapture of the church
Foundational Issues Four affirmations provide a biblical framework for the Pretribulational Rapture: They are (1) consistent literal interpretation, (2) Premillennialism, (3) futurism, and (4) a distinction between Israel and the church. These are not mere suppositions, but rather are important biblical doctrines upon which the doctrine of the Rapture is built.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I say ---This is from your favourite sight LOL ---so they believe in it ----read all for yourselves
What is the rapture of the church? | GotQuestions.org
What is the rapture of the church? Is the rapture biblical? What occurs at the rapture? Does the Bible even teach the concept of the rapture?
www.gotquestions.org
uestion: "What is the rapture of the church?"
Answer: The word rapture does not occur in the Bible. The term comes from a Latin word meaning “a carrying off, a transport, or a snatching away.” The concept of the “carrying off” or the rapture of the church is clearly taught in Scripture.
The rapture of the church is the event in which God “snatches away” all believers from the earth in order to make way for His righteous judgment to be poured out on the earth during the tribulation period. The rapture is described primarily in 1 Thessalonians 4:13–18 and 1 Corinthians 15:50–54. God will resurrect all believers who have died, give them glorified bodies, and take them from the earth, along with all living believers, who will also be given glorified bodies at that time. “For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever” (1 Thessalonians 4:16–17).
Waterfall ---you said ----If the rapture were true it would mesh with all scripture about Christs coming....but it doesn't.
Well---- I say this person is not alone--- there are many who do not believe in being caught up with Jesus ----or the Rapture as many call it -----here is one person who does believe in it in the article I posted below -------
So for me personally -----God has the ability to do it and did Rapture 2 people who were faithful to God ----and Jesus assented into heaven from the earth -----so again it is all about personal belief -----I am one who believes in it --
==========================================================================
This is an interesting read -----this says it is consistent in scripture ---so again some believe some don't -----some say it is in scripture some say it isn't ------but the Scripture I posted in 1 Thessalonians definitely says it ------- I suggest you read all --only posting this part -----
May 2009
Why I Believe The Bible Teaches Rapture Before Tribulation
by Thomas Ice
Churches today often neglect the study and preaching of biblical prophecy because they consider it a controversial and impractical topic. At the same time, many bemoan the apathy of believers and struggle to encourage people toward holy living. Churches caught in this trap need to consider that the teaching of the Rapture, woven throughout the fabric of the New Testament, addresses these issues and can provide motivation for godliness. No single Bible verse says precisely when the Rapture will take place in relation to the Tribulation or the Second Coming in a way that would settle the issue to everyone’s satisfaction. However, this does not mean that the Scriptures do not teach a clear position on this matter, for it does. As we shall see later, the Bible does promise that the church will not enter the time of God’s wrath, which is another term for the tribulation. Many biblical passages teach the pretribulational rapture of the church
Foundational Issues Four affirmations provide a biblical framework for the Pretribulational Rapture: They are (1) consistent literal interpretation, (2) Premillennialism, (3) futurism, and (4) a distinction between Israel and the church. These are not mere suppositions, but rather are important biblical doctrines upon which the doctrine of the Rapture is built.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I say ---This is from your favourite sight LOL ---so they believe in it ----read all for yourselves
What is the rapture of the church? | GotQuestions.org
What is the rapture of the church? Is the rapture biblical? What occurs at the rapture? Does the Bible even teach the concept of the rapture?www.gotquestions.org
uestion: "What is the rapture of the church?"
Answer: The word rapture does not occur in the Bible. The term comes from a Latin word meaning “a carrying off, a transport, or a snatching away.” The concept of the “carrying off” or the rapture of the church is clearly taught in Scripture.
The rapture of the church is the event in which God “snatches away” all believers from the earth in order to make way for His righteous judgment to be poured out on the earth during the tribulation period. The rapture is described primarily in 1 Thessalonians 4:13–18 and 1 Corinthians 15:50–54. God will resurrect all believers who have died, give them glorified bodies, and take them from the earth, along with all living believers, who will also be given glorified bodies at that time. “For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever” (1 Thessalonians 4:16–17).
Thus absence and agape in the fabrication ... hole eh?
@unsafe Zachariah 14:1-4 speaks of the lord firmly putting his feet on the ground on the Mt. Of Olives not flying back to heaven.
Deceased believers will be raised to spirits at the last trumpet (Corinthians 15:51-53) and God will also change to spirit those living believers (the saints) at Christs return.(verse 51) and they will meet him in the air because they are now spirit not mortals. But he doesnt whisk them off to heaven for protection.....no mortal thing or person can hurt them being a spirit.
Revelation 11:15 says
At the last Trumpet it signifies that the kingdoms of the world have become the kingdoms of the lord. And he shall reign here forever.
Just saying....look into it more or not , up to you.
Deceased believers will be raised to spirits at the last trumpet (Corinthians 15:51-53) and God will also change to spirit those living believers (the saints) at Christs return.(verse 51) and they will meet him in the air because they are now spirit not mortals. But he doesnt whisk them off to heaven for protection.....no mortal thing or person can hurt them being a spirit.
Revelation 11:15 says
At the last Trumpet it signifies that the kingdoms of the world have become the kingdoms of the lord. And he shall reign here forever.
Just saying....look into it more or not , up to you.
unsafe
Well-Known Member
Waterfall your grasping at straws --and taking scripture and making it say what you want it to say ----it is your right to not believe in the rapture --I am sure you won't read anything I post on it ----because you are already against hearing about it ------
Here is John MacArthur --explaining it very well --now I know you won't listen to it but just maybe one might ----
Here is John MacArthur --explaining it very well --now I know you won't listen to it but just maybe one might ----
John MacArthur explains the Rapture
Ive read about what you believe.
BetteTheRed
Resident Heretic
- Pronouns
- She/Her/Her
I know people who believe approximately what she does. I have attended churches where a number of people believed these things.
That being said, contemporary theology doesn't really support it.
BUT, the idea that some sort of "love process" is continually enticing us towards greater goodness, and that this might, eventually, result in a "just" and "sustainable" planet could be a "second coming" of sorts.
Yet love is said to divide the house in radical forms ... imagine the house of government ... radicalized?
And off thye go again ...
BetteTheRed
Resident Heretic
- Pronouns
- She/Her/Her
I think that true conflict is impossible if one truly wishes only for the well-being of the opponent?
Ritafee
Is Being Human
"And we know that the Son of God has come, and given us an understanding, that we may know him who is true, and we are in him who is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life" (1John 5:20).
unsafe
Well-Known Member
Ritafee ----you said ---"And we know that the Son of God has come, and given us an understanding, that we may know him who is true, and we are in him who is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life" (1John 5:20).
And your point is ???????
And your point is ???????
Ritafee
Is Being Human
Truth be told we're all in ... whether we believe it or not.
I just had a zoom meeting with my small church group. I consider these people my friends. We got into discussion about homelessness in town. A large parking lot beside a big baseball field was turned into a homeless camp near where somebody lives. Another has had issues with homelessness and vandalism in their area on the other edge of downtown. They were saying perhaps these people all need to be taken off the street and forced into addiction treatment. It kind of gave me a chill the way they said it. It was a the sort of attitude that made me want to leave here 20 yrs ago - if you’re not white and able and upper middle class the most expedient solution is “out of sight out of mind” so comfortable people can pretend there’s no problem, and feel superior to marginalized people - not necessarily consciously, but as a matter of course. I tried to bring some nuance and human understanding to the discussion in defence of homeless people I have met over the years, and how I believe homelessness came before addiction and brain injury and so on, in many cases (rather than the victim blaming mentality of the drugs causing brain damage and homelessness by choice). And that, these days, it can happen to almost anyone. And even if they played a part in where they’re at, they’re still human beings, no less important than everyone. We all make choices and mistakes. Every single one of us. some are just fortunate to have never been in circumstances that put them at risk. I didn’t even say that, I just gave a couple of examples of people I met and how they became homeless. I don’t think my opinion was popular and I went away feeling bad. (@PilgrimsProgress). But this was something I felt was necessary to speak up about. Of course I don’t want to upset my friends or lose my friends...but agreeing to disagree isn’t always an honest option either. I feel like I’m always the downer raining on the comfortable picnic. I dont want to be that. But I don't want to be dishonest or ignore something that bothers me either.
I think Vancouver, in the city, accepts its homeless population as being part of the city, better than people do here.
I think Vancouver, in the city, accepts its homeless population as being part of the city, better than people do here.
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unsafe
Well-Known Member
Ritafee ---you said ----Truth be told we're all in ... whether we believe it or not.
--False Doctrine -----I say run forest run from anyone who affirms that Doctrine -----
So wrong ------that is definitely not what your verse 20 is saying -----without Christ in you Folks -----your SOL and not heaven bound according to God Himself ---
This is your scripture in context ----Faith ---- is the Context of ! John 5 The Chapter
6 This is the one who came by water and blood—Jesus Christ. He did not come by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit who testifies, because the Spirit is the truth. 7 For there are three that testify: 8 the[a] Spirit, the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement.
9 We accept human testimony, but God’s testimony is greater because it is the testimony of God, which he has given about his Son.
10 Whoever believes in the Son of God accepts this testimony. Whoever does not believe God has made him out to be a liar, because they have not believed the testimony God has given about his Son.
11 And this is the testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12 Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life.
16 If you see any brother or sister commit a sin that does not lead to death, you should pray and God will give them life. I refer to those whose sin does not lead to death. There is a sin that leads to death. I am not saying that you should pray about that. 17 All wrongdoing is sin, and there is sin that does not lead to death.
18 We know that anyone born of God does not continue to sin; the One who was born of God keeps them safe, and the evil one cannot harm them. 19 We know that we are children of God, and that the whole world is under the control of the evil one. 20 We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.
21 Dear children, keep yourselves from idols.
=========================================================================================
I say -----So in context ! John 5 is Spiritually talking about Faith in Jesus Christ ---who he is and what we gain by having Saving Faith in Him -------verses 13 -21 are continuing to affirm this Faith ------
Here is your one verse ----you posted out of Context to make your case that all are in ------which is a dangerous statement to make ------as it does not imply that all are in ---far from it ------
20 We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.
NOTICE ---these little words---IN and BY ---It says By being IN His Son Jesus Christ ---through Him we have eternal life
I say ---------- here in your verse 20 -----------the Son of God has given us understanding ------ (discernment )-----Luke 24:45 is given as a cross reference ----where it says Jesus opened the minds of the Disciples to understand the Scriptures -----
-which today only comes by way of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit --who guides us into the truth of the scripture
and---- it says here we have to be in His Son --to have eternal life -----So how do we be in His Son ---by having Christ dwell in us Folks ----then you are heaven bound according to God Himself --
Here is the Greek word for Discern -----
Strong's #995: biyn
a primitive root; to separate mentally (or distinguish), i.e:--to cause to understand, give understanding, teach
--False Doctrine -----I say run forest run from anyone who affirms that Doctrine -----
So wrong ------that is definitely not what your verse 20 is saying -----without Christ in you Folks -----your SOL and not heaven bound according to God Himself ---
This is your scripture in context ----Faith ---- is the Context of ! John 5 The Chapter
1 John 5 (NIV)
Faith in the Incarnate Son of God
5 Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves the father loves his child as well. 2 This is how we know that we love the children of God: by loving God and carrying out his commands. 3 In fact, this is love for God: to keep his commands. And his commands are not burdensome, 4 for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. 5 Who is it that overcomes the world? Only the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God.6 This is the one who came by water and blood—Jesus Christ. He did not come by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit who testifies, because the Spirit is the truth. 7 For there are three that testify: 8 the[a] Spirit, the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement.
9 We accept human testimony, but God’s testimony is greater because it is the testimony of God, which he has given about his Son.
10 Whoever believes in the Son of God accepts this testimony. Whoever does not believe God has made him out to be a liar, because they have not believed the testimony God has given about his Son.
11 And this is the testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12 Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life.
Concluding Affirmations
13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life. 14 This is the confidence we have in approaching God: that if we ask anything according to his will, he hears us. 15 And if we know that he hears us—whatever we ask—we know that we have what we asked of him.16 If you see any brother or sister commit a sin that does not lead to death, you should pray and God will give them life. I refer to those whose sin does not lead to death. There is a sin that leads to death. I am not saying that you should pray about that. 17 All wrongdoing is sin, and there is sin that does not lead to death.
18 We know that anyone born of God does not continue to sin; the One who was born of God keeps them safe, and the evil one cannot harm them. 19 We know that we are children of God, and that the whole world is under the control of the evil one. 20 We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.
21 Dear children, keep yourselves from idols.
=========================================================================================
I say -----So in context ! John 5 is Spiritually talking about Faith in Jesus Christ ---who he is and what we gain by having Saving Faith in Him -------verses 13 -21 are continuing to affirm this Faith ------
Here is your one verse ----you posted out of Context to make your case that all are in ------which is a dangerous statement to make ------as it does not imply that all are in ---far from it ------
20 We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.
NOTICE ---these little words---IN and BY ---It says By being IN His Son Jesus Christ ---through Him we have eternal life
I say ---------- here in your verse 20 -----------the Son of God has given us understanding ------ (discernment )-----Luke 24:45 is given as a cross reference ----where it says Jesus opened the minds of the Disciples to understand the Scriptures -----
-which today only comes by way of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit --who guides us into the truth of the scripture
and---- it says here we have to be in His Son --to have eternal life -----So how do we be in His Son ---by having Christ dwell in us Folks ----then you are heaven bound according to God Himself --
Here is the Greek word for Discern -----
Strong's #995: biyn
a primitive root; to separate mentally (or distinguish), i.e:--to cause to understand, give understanding, teach
GeoFee
I am who I am becoming...
“You study the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life.”
The words of scripture are inspired by the Living Word of God, and point to that Living Word. To take scripture as the Living Word of God is an error. To profess scripture as the Word of God is idolatry.
I have studied the scriptures for all of my adult life. They inspire and instruct me so that I may live a life of service to others met along my way. They are not my God.
The words of scripture are inspired by the Living Word of God, and point to that Living Word. To take scripture as the Living Word of God is an error. To profess scripture as the Word of God is idolatry.
I have studied the scriptures for all of my adult life. They inspire and instruct me so that I may live a life of service to others met along my way. They are not my God.
dreamerman
Well-Known Member
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
What do you mean by SOL unsafe? If it stands for sure of lunacy then that would make sense to me. Somehow I don't think you are using it in that context. I imagine it is something more crass than that. I can see Jesus saying that now. Hey dude you didn't believe in me I guess you are SOL.
unsafe
Well-Known Member
GeoFee ------To profess scripture as the Word of God is idolatry.
No ---that is a false statement Folks ---I say Run Forest Run from anyone who professes this statement -----
Greek word for Idolatry ----
Strong's Concordance
eidólolatria: image worship
the worship of false gods, idolatry: used of the formal sacrificial feasts held in honor of false gods,
-----This says nothing about Professing Scripture as the word of God is Idolatry ------you are twisting this to suit your own agenda--- to be right and deny that God inspired the Word to be written down --------and also your disregarding Jesus as being the Word itself ------
Now there is such a thing as an Idolatrous Heart -------Read the Chapter if you wish ----I am just posting this part -----
classic.biblegateway.com
==================================================================================
NOW GeoFee ---this is the scripture --the Word of God that your professing ---so your in idolatry here ------according to what you say -----so your telling others that that by professing the scripture as the the Word of God is idolatry but you this this yourself -------
“You study the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life.”
I say --------Now This scripture here above ---Jesus is alive here -----the Old Testament was the only Word of God that they had ----so He is saying here that the people think that by studying the Old Testament scriptures that this will save them -------which is not what God said ---at all -----the Old Testament Testifies that the Messiah will come ----but Jesus is not being accepted by the Jewish people as the Messiah --so he is saying that they are refusing to come to Him to have that saved life -------
So GeoFee -------Not only are you professing this scripture as the Word of God ---you are taking it out of context and using your on line proof text to try and show what you want it to say ----Twisting the Scripture and putting a stumbling block in your face as well as others --------which can be seen as an ----Idolatrous Heart ---as this is wicked in God's eyes -----
Here is the whole Scripture ---that i am professing as the Word of God in Context -------
this Scripture you quote says nothing about _____what you say here ------To profess scripture as the Word of God is idolatry.
31 “If only I tell people about myself, what I say is not true. 32 But there is another who tells about me, and I know that the things he says about me are true.
33 “You have sent people to John, and he has told you the truth. 34 It is not that I need what humans say; I tell you this so you can be saved. 35 John was like a burning and shining lamp, and you were happy to enjoy his light for a while.
36 “But I have a proof about myself that is greater than that of John. The things I do, which are the things my Father gave me to do, prove that the Father sent me.
37 And the Father himself who sent me has given proof about me. You have never heard his voice or seen what he looks like.
38 His teaching does not live in you, because you don’t believe in the One the Father sent.
39 You carefully study the Scriptures because you think they give you eternal life. They do in fact tell about me, 40 but you refuse to come to me to have that life.
==================================================================================
Your Quote ------I have studied the scriptures for all of my adult life. They inspire and instruct me so that I may live a life of service to others met along my way. They are not my God.
I say ---I totally agree with your last statement here GeoFee -----that the Word who is God ---The Word who became Flesh --who is Jesus who is God ---the Word who existed in the Beginning ----The Word of the Scriptures - is not your God ------
No ---that is a false statement Folks ---I say Run Forest Run from anyone who professes this statement -----
Greek word for Idolatry ----
Strong's Concordance
eidólolatria: image worship
the worship of false gods, idolatry: used of the formal sacrificial feasts held in honor of false gods,
-----This says nothing about Professing Scripture as the word of God is Idolatry ------you are twisting this to suit your own agenda--- to be right and deny that God inspired the Word to be written down --------and also your disregarding Jesus as being the Word itself ------
Now there is such a thing as an Idolatrous Heart -------Read the Chapter if you wish ----I am just posting this part -----
Bible Gateway passage: Ezekiel 14 - Christian Standard Bible
Idolatrous Elders Punished - Some of the elders of Israel came to me and sat down in front of me. Then the word of the LORD came to me: “Son of man, these men have set up idols in their hearts and have put their sinful stumbling blocks in front of themselves. Should I actually let them inquire...
Ezekiel 14 (NIV)
Idolaters Condemned
14 Some of the elders of Israel came to me and sat down in front of me. 2 Then the word of the Lord came to me: 3 “Son of man, these men have set up idols in their hearts and put wicked stumbling blocks before their faces.==================================================================================
NOW GeoFee ---this is the scripture --the Word of God that your professing ---so your in idolatry here ------according to what you say -----so your telling others that that by professing the scripture as the the Word of God is idolatry but you this this yourself -------
“You study the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life.”
I say --------Now This scripture here above ---Jesus is alive here -----the Old Testament was the only Word of God that they had ----so He is saying here that the people think that by studying the Old Testament scriptures that this will save them -------which is not what God said ---at all -----the Old Testament Testifies that the Messiah will come ----but Jesus is not being accepted by the Jewish people as the Messiah --so he is saying that they are refusing to come to Him to have that saved life -------
So GeoFee -------Not only are you professing this scripture as the Word of God ---you are taking it out of context and using your on line proof text to try and show what you want it to say ----Twisting the Scripture and putting a stumbling block in your face as well as others --------which can be seen as an ----Idolatrous Heart ---as this is wicked in God's eyes -----
Here is the whole Scripture ---that i am professing as the Word of God in Context -------
this Scripture you quote says nothing about _____what you say here ------To profess scripture as the Word of God is idolatry.
John 5:30-40 (NCV)
Jesus Is God’s Son
30 “I can do nothing alone. I judge only the way I am told, so my judgment is fair. I don’t try to please myself, but I try to please the One who sent me.31 “If only I tell people about myself, what I say is not true. 32 But there is another who tells about me, and I know that the things he says about me are true.
33 “You have sent people to John, and he has told you the truth. 34 It is not that I need what humans say; I tell you this so you can be saved. 35 John was like a burning and shining lamp, and you were happy to enjoy his light for a while.
36 “But I have a proof about myself that is greater than that of John. The things I do, which are the things my Father gave me to do, prove that the Father sent me.
37 And the Father himself who sent me has given proof about me. You have never heard his voice or seen what he looks like.
38 His teaching does not live in you, because you don’t believe in the One the Father sent.
39 You carefully study the Scriptures because you think they give you eternal life. They do in fact tell about me, 40 but you refuse to come to me to have that life.
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Your Quote ------I have studied the scriptures for all of my adult life. They inspire and instruct me so that I may live a life of service to others met along my way. They are not my God.
I say ---I totally agree with your last statement here GeoFee -----that the Word who is God ---The Word who became Flesh --who is Jesus who is God ---the Word who existed in the Beginning ----The Word of the Scriptures - is not your God ------