What Are The Building Blocks Of Our Faith ?

[Waterfall]

I did notice that Mandella. Just saying a balance sometimes is required. I wasnt particularly thinking of you when I offered my explanation.

 

[chansen]

Just saying

Be secure in your offense. Know that Christianity has a rich history of being offended when other people reject their attempts to legitimize the faith on the back of poor reasoning and bad science. As if being offended is a real defense or something.

 

[Waterfall]

Be secure in your offense. Know that Christianity has a rich history of being offended when other people reject their attempts to legitimize the faith on the back of poor reasoning and bad science. As if being offended is a real defense or something.

I wasnt defending my faith but my right to speak my opinion.

 

[chansen]

No one ever tried to silence you. Rejecting your posts and pointing out the basic local flaws in them is not preventing you from speaking here - it's only preventing you from creating your own facts.

 

[airclean33]

Myths and parables both use allegory and symbols, and almost always portray some kind of truism about life. Very often in myths we see some kind of hero, a fighter wrestling his way through the maya of life. Such a figure was Sampson, the Israeli sun-god* hero who was known for his legendary god-like strength. But like Hercules, Samson was not perfect and at times was very human in his learning. It's interesting that in the end he lost his strength to a woman (who always represents the mother of the world and form).

*in Hebrew Samson is "Shimshon", which means "man of the sun".

--Do you understand that GOD of Israel is also called SUN?

 

[Jaebius]

--Do you understand that GOD of Israel is also called SUN?

 

[Neo]

--Do you understand that GOD of Israel is also called SUN?

No, I don't believe that to be true at all. But I do believe the God of Israel was "worshipped" like the Sun. Which would be very similar to many cultures in our history. Sun worshipping is not new and continued right into the emergence of Christianity. The Christ Himself was referred to as the "Sun of Righteousness" in Malachi, the last book of the Old Testament. His birth is accepted by Christians all over the world at the time of the winter solstice, an auspicious time when the Sun is "born anew". His death is accepted by Christians all over at the time of the spring equinox, a time when the Sun's influence becomes markedly increased in the northern hemisphere.

But what has the above to do with with the fact that the Jewish hero Samson was actually named and viewed as a sun-god and endowed with supernatural powers? My point regarding Samson was that his myth sounds very similar to the myth of Hercules. Is this mere coincidence, or did one copy the other?

 

[Jaebius]

But what has the above to do with with the fact that the Jewish hero Samson was actually named and viewed as a sun-god and endowed with supernatural powers? My point regarding Samson was that his myth sounds very similar to the myth of Hercules. Is this mere coincidence, or did one copy the other?

Samson is the true story, Hercules the counterfeit.

 

[Neo]

Samson is the true story, Hercules the counterfeit.

And why is that, because it's in the Bible?

 

[Neo]

Samson is the true story, Hercules the counterfeit.

If the story of Hercules was written before the book of Judges then who is the counterfeit?

 

[blackbelt1961]

Samson is the true story, Hercules the counterfeit.

no way, Bruce Lee is the real story

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

 

[Jaebius]

If the story of Hercules was written before the book of Judges then who is the counterfeit?

 

[blackbelt1961]

I though this kid is the cutesiest ever , gotta watch it !

 

[Mendalla]

Samson is the true story, Hercules the counterfeit.

More likely, the Greeks didn't know of Samson until they came into contact with the Jews and vice versa and the stories evolved in parallel.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

Again, it is not the job of the person negating a fact to provide the evidence. They merely have to refute the evidence presented by those trying to establish the fact. In court, for instance, you don't have to prove that you are not guilty, only establish that there is reasonable doubt that you are guilty by refuting the prosecution's case.

And keep in mind you not only have to prove there is an afterlife, you also have to prove your version of it. After all, there are alternatives to heaven/hell even within Christianity (e.g. the view that all the faithful will be raised to a new kingdom of God on Earth after the Apocalypse). I personally find reincarnation a much more compelling belief than heaven/hell for a variety of reasons that are off-topic here.

And the fact is, you can't prove it. It's a matter of subjective belief, not something that you are going to prove scientifically. And you really should not feel you have to regardless of what the anti-theist crowd says. If you feel your faith is justified, then follow it and leave the rest of us to ours. It is this ongoing need on the part of some believers to convince non-believers (and vice versa) that causes friction as much as anything else. We non-believers are doing quite well in our non-belief and if we thought the afterlife mattered, we would probably believe in it. Worry about your own faith, not that of others.



Belief in a supernatural dimension to existence (deities, spirits, afterlife) is not a "con game" but something that has been part of human consciousness and culture since at least Neanderthal times and there is archaeological evidence to support that. Yes, con men and institutions seeking means of control have misused and abused those beliefs, but the beliefs themselves are not a "con" but something that evolved naturally as part of the evolution of human thinking. In fact, other human beliefs and behaviours that are natural have been misused, too, even altruism. Now, the fact that belief in a supernatural dimension to the world exists does not mean or prove that there really is a supernatural dimension to existence, only that our human imagination and curiousity are the basis of the belief, not some scam artist. If you want to call it a redundant, outmoded means of thought that is open to manipulation, sure. But belief in and of itself is not a "con" save you want to argue that we as individuals and as a species are conning ourselves.

To bring up your "off topic" point. I don't see a conflict between reincarnation and the Christian concept of afterlife, and now multiverse theory...if we are only conscious of being in one place at a time. If the 'Truth' is that wherever we exist, we thrive by getting along, with love (agape) and compassion, and we (humanity) perish by warring and pillaging. That is the eternal Truth, to me, that is the human story the Bible tells. But on a conscious level if we are only aware of our presence in one place at a time, we should try to do our best where we're at.

 

[BetteTheRed]

... But on a conscious level if we are only aware of our presence in one place at a time, we should try to do our best where we're at.

"If"? Do you know anyone who is conscious of being present in more than one place at a time?

 

[Neo]

"If"? Do you know anyone who is conscious of being present in more than one place at a time?

Personally?

 

[chansen]

That there are people who are conscious of being present in more than one place at a time is a multifaceted truth because I feel it in my gut, so therefore it is true.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

"If"? Do you know anyone who is conscious of being present in more than one place at a time?

My "if" would be clearer if I instead used "because". I meant "if this the case that we are only aware of being here now (which it is), therefore no matter how many other places we have conscious awareness in, we only have it one lifetime at a time."And yet, multiverse theory says that there are simultaneously billions of each of us, for every possibility. The building blocks of science lead there, and that's where it could cross over with faith understandings.

 

[Kimmio Laughterlove]

"If"? Do you know anyone who is conscious of being present in more than one place at a time?

There are half awake dream states - when you're neither here nor there yet. Dreaming - you are physically here but not aware of it - and your awareness is somewhere else, not accompanied by your physical presence. Why do we dream?