Graeme Decarie
Well-Known Member
I cannot think of a single power ever exerted by those of adequate wealth on anybody. They don't even exert power over the poor. For the most part, they just ignore them.
A bias against wealth?
- Thread starter Pinga
- Start date
Welcome to Wondercafe2!
A community where we discuss, share, and have some fun together. Join today and become a part of it!
Ritafee
Is Being Human
“We will do anything to maintain a system that has failed us.” Howard Zinn
"I came to understand, during those days following my operation and in discussions with Howard, that my most important lesson since the publication of Confessions of an Economic Hit Man was similar to the one I had learned as a Peace Corps volunteer working with Andean brick makers: the only reason the EHM system works is because the rest of us give it permission to work. At best,we look the other way; at worst, we actively support it. One of the things that most bothered me was having to admit to myself that I not only had looked the other way but also had convinced many people to actively support that system. I made a commitment to myself that I’d be more diligent; I’d watch more closely what was going on in my own community, my country, and the world." - John Perkins
Anyone else read this book?
"I came to understand, during those days following my operation and in discussions with Howard, that my most important lesson since the publication of Confessions of an Economic Hit Man was similar to the one I had learned as a Peace Corps volunteer working with Andean brick makers: the only reason the EHM system works is because the rest of us give it permission to work. At best,we look the other way; at worst, we actively support it. One of the things that most bothered me was having to admit to myself that I not only had looked the other way but also had convinced many people to actively support that system. I made a commitment to myself that I’d be more diligent; I’d watch more closely what was going on in my own community, my country, and the world." - John Perkins
Anyone else read this book?
Pinga
Room for All
Kimmio, I think I missed it. Can you repost it?
Pinga
Room for All
Kimmio, can you help me unpack this post?
What power do you think that those who are housed/fed put over those who are not housed/fed?
Is it the power of taxation & government / church / etc and programs that you are referring to?
Is it an individual walking past a person who is panhandling.
I'd like to understand your point more.
Yes and yes.
that is what I meant. People don't see it as a power but it is ... And "the poor" are not really allowed to be self directed in many areas while they're poor. "beggars can't be choosers" reflects that power. Welfare clients are what are called "captive clients" also, for example.I actually hate that phrase "the poor" - people who are poor or happen to be poor is more respectful, "people living in poverty" reflects the reality - "the poor" sounds pitiful - and too permanent - and like another subtle form of exerting oppressive social power - to me, but since it's a common phrase for churchgoers we've gotten used to it...so be it.
Last edited:
All the services and institutions where "the poor" are helped and rehabilitated are run by middle class people. That's a type of "power" and it's the type that "the poor" come face to face with daily. So they're not feeling oppressed by billionaires, but by regular people.
Pinga
Room for All
So, just to understand. Just by virtue of providing a service or offering money to a panhandler one is exerting power.
Would you prefer people (government, Church, individual) not provide such assistance.
I am trying to figure out , are you suggesting all Assistance stop?
I was watching a cc news item of a doctor providing palliative Assistance to those on the street by going to where they are. Should that stop? Is he exerting g power over the person or being a servant to them?
Would you prefer people (government, Church, individual) not provide such assistance.
I am trying to figure out , are you suggesting all Assistance stop?
I was watching a cc news item of a doctor providing palliative Assistance to those on the street by going to where they are. Should that stop? Is he exerting g power over the person or being a servant to them?
Reminds me of a hatchet man that runa paper products company ... he had a Nich Name as Chainsaw ... for eliminating wee epistemologies! I have this wrought image in the recesses of my mined ... a pitiful imagination according to some realists!
It would assist in eliminating the lesser powers and bury 'n talents we never recognized in their mythical form ... as those po' folk know nothing ... desire to rise is ... unseen as an incarnate abstract ... wee dark flash ... a smear on humanity as a whole being summed up or integral ... island mentalities apply best to the Peter Prin. ... a phenomenon generally ignored by those tried by the pathological testing ...
If logically learned by pain ... what does comfort eliminate?
It depends, Pinga. Obviously a paramedic in an emergency is not looking at how much income they have.
Welfare does not "offer money". They make it very difficult to get, and create a different legal class of people who accept it, though. It is draconian. I do not advocate it be abolished but that "the poor" not be shuffled around like naive children. Offer them choices and dignity.
Ritafee
Is Being Human
Excuse me, friends, I must catch my jet
I’m off to join the Development Set;
My bags are packed, and I’ve had all my shots
I have traveller’s checks and pills for the trots!
The Development Set is bright and noble
Our thoughts are deep and our vision global;
Although we move with the better classes
Our thoughts are always with the masses.
In Sheraton Hotels in scattered nations
We damn multi-national corporations;
injustice seems easy to protest
In such seething hotbeds of social rest.
We discuss malnutrition over steaks
And plan hunger talks during coffee breaks.
Whether Asian floods or African drought,
We face each issue with open mouth.
We bring in consultants whose circumlocution
Raises difficulties for every solution –
Thus guaranteeing continued good eating
By showing the need for another meeting.
The language of the Development Set
Stretches the English alphabet;
We use swell words like “epigenetic”
“Micro”, “macro”, and “logarithmetic”
It pleasures us to be esoteric –
It’s so intellectually atmospheric!
And although establishments may be unmoved,
Our vocabularies are much improved.
When the talk gets deep and you’re feeling numb,
You can keep your shame to a minimum:
To show that you, too, are intelligent
Smugly ask, “Is it really development?”
Or say, “That’s fine in practice, but don’t you see:
It doesn’t work out in theory!”
A few may find this incomprehensible,
But most will admire you as deep and sensible.
Development set homes are extremely chic,
Full of carvings, curios, and draped with batik.
Eye-level photographs subtly assure
That your host is at home with the great and the poor.
Enough of these verses – on with the mission!
Our task is as broad as the human condition!
Just pray god the biblical promise is true:
The poor ye shall always have with you.-Ross Coggins
I’m off to join the Development Set;
My bags are packed, and I’ve had all my shots
I have traveller’s checks and pills for the trots!
The Development Set is bright and noble
Our thoughts are deep and our vision global;
Although we move with the better classes
Our thoughts are always with the masses.
In Sheraton Hotels in scattered nations
We damn multi-national corporations;
injustice seems easy to protest
In such seething hotbeds of social rest.
We discuss malnutrition over steaks
And plan hunger talks during coffee breaks.
Whether Asian floods or African drought,
We face each issue with open mouth.
We bring in consultants whose circumlocution
Raises difficulties for every solution –
Thus guaranteeing continued good eating
By showing the need for another meeting.
The language of the Development Set
Stretches the English alphabet;
We use swell words like “epigenetic”
“Micro”, “macro”, and “logarithmetic”
It pleasures us to be esoteric –
It’s so intellectually atmospheric!
And although establishments may be unmoved,
Our vocabularies are much improved.
When the talk gets deep and you’re feeling numb,
You can keep your shame to a minimum:
To show that you, too, are intelligent
Smugly ask, “Is it really development?”
Or say, “That’s fine in practice, but don’t you see:
It doesn’t work out in theory!”
A few may find this incomprehensible,
But most will admire you as deep and sensible.
Development set homes are extremely chic,
Full of carvings, curios, and draped with batik.
Eye-level photographs subtly assure
That your host is at home with the great and the poor.
Enough of these verses – on with the mission!
Our task is as broad as the human condition!
Just pray god the biblical promise is true:
The poor ye shall always have with you.-Ross Coggins
Thus it goes .. denied by hard belief systems ... BS dried on a sunny Deis?
Carolla
wondering & wandering
- Pronouns
- She/Her/Her
I definitely share your disdain for the phrasing - "the poor"; "the wealthy"; "the disabled"; "the elderly" .... they are labels that clump many who have diverse stories and individual circumstances under a singular stereotypical umbrella. We are all people - all different.
I want to address the power imbalance thing. Yes, by virtue of providing a service to those who are more vulnerable, people are exerting power. That is why doctors cannot date their patients, why social workers cannot date their clients ... It's in their code of ethics because it is recognized that providing a service tips the balance of power to the provider of the service. @Pinga
Ritafee
Is Being Human
If that doctor is providing service where the people are in need without any 'financial transaction' that is service ... once money is involved it becomes business.
Actually, I want to clarify that the power imbalance between a doctor and a patient doesn't necessarily exist 'because' the doctor has more money than the patient. It's not like the doctor is lording their wealth over the patient. The patient may have more money than the doctor. It's that the doctor, social worker, etc. etc. have some decision making power over another's well being! ... And "the poor" happen to have more interaction with public service and social service providers generally...like social workers ... Who are generally middle class people. The view from the bottom is those people calling shots on their behalf while they have the advantage of a decent life. You can't fault them for that unless you've been there. People I've known in social service work understand that - recognizing their more priveleged position 'is' power - and are not offended by it. I think people who are wealthier would be better to acknowledge that power imbalance instead of saying it's an unfair bias.
Carolla
wondering & wandering
- Pronouns
- She/Her/Her
There are many I know who do acknowledge this. Overgeneralization is a curious thing.
Pinga
Room for All
Kimmio, Yes, there is positional power. Of course. There is power between manager/employee, etc. Of course they can't date. Shouldn't accept financial gifts, etc.
my question remained...does that mean the person who is the manager, doctor, service provider, etc, evil.
Should they quit providing the service?
There seems to be again a swing of negative to it, ie the person cannot fulfill the role and provide the service/function .
Is that your intent?
Note: the original topic of power came up in regards to this post. It seems to have shifted, which is fine, but, just want to attempt to bring the context of the power dialogue back into the conversation.
my question remained...does that mean the person who is the manager, doctor, service provider, etc, evil.
Should they quit providing the service?
There seems to be again a swing of negative to it, ie the person cannot fulfill the role and provide the service/function .
Is that your intent?
Note: the original topic of power came up in regards to this post. It seems to have shifted, which is fine, but, just want to attempt to bring the context of the power dialogue back into the conversation.