Sheer prejudice with no basis in fact!
The Persuasiveness of ADCs (After-Death Communication) and NDEs (Near Death Experiences)
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Given what humanity knows (due to religious oppression about knowledge, etc.) is there any basis in fact as so many depend on ethereal vaporous) emotion input without much thought?
Can a mire mortal cut through this nebulous system a belief without observation ... a blind suspect (by his own fates)? Alas he can't see thro' it ...
Can a mire mortal cut through this nebulous system a belief without observation ... a blind suspect (by his own fates)? Alas he can't see thro' it ...
paradox3
Peanuts Fan
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I was searching earlier today for info about religious conversion. It's not terribly easy to pin down. There are many predictions that Islam will be the largest world faith withn a few decades.
What could be more conducive to a lasting conversion than a Muslim's electrifying visionary encounter with Jesus, radiating wave after wave of ever intensifying liquid love. I had such an experience at age 16 and it is the reason why I am still a Christian. It is by far the high point in my life, a high point that continues to nourish me emotionally on a regular basis. If you had such an encounter, I'm confident it would also be the high point in your life as well.
When you look at the goings on in Asia and Asia Minor ... the world will end itself in a bad spin ... poorly wound myth? Thus we go down ...
Delightful Life
M&M, Cascadian Lovers
pretty cool schtuff :3
ya gotta remember that no matter how true these experiences are, you unfortunately are dealing with people's historical reactions to you (your Character and such) and also the metaphysics they have?
I think pretty much the dominant metaphysics here is "universe is dead, non conscious, all we are are atoms rubbing and chemicals spurting amd human beings are just emergent properties and rather unimportant outside of ourselves..."
its a hard sell
what helps i think, what really changes people is personal experience...
my bro has OBE...he can't explain it, he doesn't try to, he thinks it inneresting...
Does dominating metaphysics have a ghost of a change given our predisposal about essence? Blow by ...
Delightful Life
M&M, Cascadian Lovers
You know how sombunall of reality seems to be indeterminate and we descendants of Eve, particularly here, love cutting that to fit our spherical cows and binary software fields...
Model agnosticism for sombunall!
Mendalla
Happy headbanging ape!!
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Here? Seriously? The majority of members on WC2 are theists so I am not sure what you are talking about. Even I embrace a loose form of pantheism, which is hardly "universe is dead, non conscious". Or are you talking Western civilization as a whole, in which case I kind of agree.
Always the essentially opposed ... just on principal ... principle? There may be no collaboration because if they put some strings together ... consider what the common ph'que would learn!
Quest: What's a que, something to mess with? Then: Que for Treason as a lead ... especially into the busting's ... definition of busting can break up some good and bad things depending on the source of the defining factor!
Everything needs to be looked into ... because of so many controversial presentations of cracked personas ... sona Tus ...
Quest: What's a que, something to mess with? Then: Que for Treason as a lead ... especially into the busting's ... definition of busting can break up some good and bad things depending on the source of the defining factor!
Everything needs to be looked into ... because of so many controversial presentations of cracked personas ... sona Tus ...
Delightful Life
M&M, Cascadian Lovers
Even I find it hard to actually BE outside that metaphysics?
What would it be like to, unconsciously, be outside that metaphysics?
Where human beings are integral to universe?
Where universe is alive and even a person with agency?
Where the fundamental stuff ISN'T insensate matter and energy?
How many here, deep down, actually live in that worldview?
Delightful Life
M&M, Cascadian Lovers
In addendum to the above why I suggested that most of us here follow that certain metaphysics is that when talking aboot thingslike Politics and Health, most of us don't talk aboot things like Spirits or Helpers and such?
In essence they appear as nothing (one definition of incarnate; as appearing as not real). Imagined visions!!!
This alludes to something opposing existentialism ... and thus things not to be ... eschatology? Ten there is a whole field of abstract numbers ... beyond most of the established and pious! Often these are designated as "i" and in overwhelming numbers beyond the singular "meis"! Memes as plural ... just passing thoughts going by ...
The impression depends on where you are positioned ... for, against, within or alternately disposed (without) by forces of ignorance causing us to forget things put down in oubliette (a small hanging container deep in the mire! May parallel the pons of the lower brain parts, supporting the cellarium ... a place for things previously hoarded and forgotten ... like portions of PTSD and other denied disorder by those claiming to be orderly, with question regarding their claims, much like political forces towards unbalancing matters!
Nonetheless disorder is ad continuum ... it goes on!
(6c) 3RD NDE THAT CLIMAXED IN A MIRACULOUS HEALING [See posts 24 & 31 for the first 2 examples.]
I heard Bruce Van Natta testify in person about his NDE that he experienced in Wisconsin after a huge logger semi-truck fell on his abdominal region after the jack skipped while he was working underneath the truck. I was able to ask him questions afterwards. Watch his interview with Sid Roth, at least until his entire testimony is completed:
His abdominal area was crushed by a truck to within 1 inch on one side. While hovering over his body in his NDE, Bruce saw 2 giant angels restraining the weight of the truck to help him survive the loss of almost all his intestines. Doctors couldn’t believe he was still alive. No one had ever survived the severing of 5 arteries like Bruce and he should have bled to death. Then Bruce Carlson, a man Bruce Van Natta had met only once, felt called by God to fly from NY to Wisconsin to lay hands on Bruce for healing. The result? An astounding healing miracle in which 9-11 feet of new intestine were created so Bruce could avoid starvation, digest food, and become a healthy fit witness to the power of the Holy Spirit to heal and guide. Bruce testified that when Carlson laid hands on him, he felt what seemed like a huge snake uncoil within his abdomen as the creation miracle took place.
Van Natta lifted his sweater to show us the massive scars that covered his abdominal region as a result of multiple surgeries to try to save his life. The History Channel devoted a whole show on him intended, as they later admitted, to debunk his claims. With Bruce's permission, they were given access to all his medical records. After all their fact checking, these skeptics for the show conceded that this was without question a genuine healing miracle.
I heard Bruce Van Natta testify in person about his NDE that he experienced in Wisconsin after a huge logger semi-truck fell on his abdominal region after the jack skipped while he was working underneath the truck. I was able to ask him questions afterwards. Watch his interview with Sid Roth, at least until his entire testimony is completed:
His abdominal area was crushed by a truck to within 1 inch on one side. While hovering over his body in his NDE, Bruce saw 2 giant angels restraining the weight of the truck to help him survive the loss of almost all his intestines. Doctors couldn’t believe he was still alive. No one had ever survived the severing of 5 arteries like Bruce and he should have bled to death. Then Bruce Carlson, a man Bruce Van Natta had met only once, felt called by God to fly from NY to Wisconsin to lay hands on Bruce for healing. The result? An astounding healing miracle in which 9-11 feet of new intestine were created so Bruce could avoid starvation, digest food, and become a healthy fit witness to the power of the Holy Spirit to heal and guide. Bruce testified that when Carlson laid hands on him, he felt what seemed like a huge snake uncoil within his abdomen as the creation miracle took place.
Van Natta lifted his sweater to show us the massive scars that covered his abdominal region as a result of multiple surgeries to try to save his life. The History Channel devoted a whole show on him intended, as they later admitted, to debunk his claims. With Bruce's permission, they were given access to all his medical records. After all their fact checking, these skeptics for the show conceded that this was without question a genuine healing miracle.
(7) THE EXPERIENCE OF SPACE IN THE REALM OF THE SPIRIT (7a) THE GEOGRAPHY OF PARADISE:
At age 5 Margaret Sauro was misdiagnosed with scarlet fever and was on the verge of death as a result of a ruptured appendix. She suddenly found herself walking hand in hand down a path with a beautiful young woman in a Roman toga. The path was lined with massive beautiful flowers “way over our heads…close together the way a colonial bouquet would be.” Margaret felt an overwhelming peace and the floral fragrance “seemed to permeate my whole body.” Near the path’s end, she heard faint voices, saying, “But why is she bringing her here?” “I don’t know. She knows better.” Margaret was then enveloped in fog and returned to her hospital bed. The angelic young woman looked down, saying, “I’m sorry Margaret, but you have to go back now. It’s not you time.”
Decades later in her 50s, Margaret decided to paint the beautiful lady and the flowers along the path. The next day she went to see her internist about her broken rib. She told her internist about the painting and he asked if she could create a reproduction for him to frame and hang among 10 other pictures in his office. Several weeks later Maria Olivia, another patient, saw the painting among the 10 others and stood transfixed. When the internist asked her what was going on, she replied: “I walked along that path when I was 5 years old and almost died!” 2 independent descriptions of a section of Paradise devoted to 5-year-olds? If so, this is a mind-blowing confirmation of Paradise geography! (report condensed from Molly Cox-Chapman, “The Case for Heaven”)
At age 5 Margaret Sauro was misdiagnosed with scarlet fever and was on the verge of death as a result of a ruptured appendix. She suddenly found herself walking hand in hand down a path with a beautiful young woman in a Roman toga. The path was lined with massive beautiful flowers “way over our heads…close together the way a colonial bouquet would be.” Margaret felt an overwhelming peace and the floral fragrance “seemed to permeate my whole body.” Near the path’s end, she heard faint voices, saying, “But why is she bringing her here?” “I don’t know. She knows better.” Margaret was then enveloped in fog and returned to her hospital bed. The angelic young woman looked down, saying, “I’m sorry Margaret, but you have to go back now. It’s not you time.”
Decades later in her 50s, Margaret decided to paint the beautiful lady and the flowers along the path. The next day she went to see her internist about her broken rib. She told her internist about the painting and he asked if she could create a reproduction for him to frame and hang among 10 other pictures in his office. Several weeks later Maria Olivia, another patient, saw the painting among the 10 others and stood transfixed. When the internist asked her what was going on, she replied: “I walked along that path when I was 5 years old and almost died!” 2 independent descriptions of a section of Paradise devoted to 5-year-olds? If so, this is a mind-blowing confirmation of Paradise geography! (report condensed from Molly Cox-Chapman, “The Case for Heaven”)
(7b) THE EXPERIENCE OF SPACE IN THE SPIRIT REALM: A 2ND NDE EXAMPLE
Rev. Albert Baldeo was a UCCan minister, one of the most respected ministers in Kelowna, BC. He was respected enough to be given a weekly column in the city's major paper. One of his articles described his Dad's shared NDE and I confirmed the ensuing description of it by direct contact with Albert: Albert also wrote an article about this shared NDE in the Kelowna newspaper.
Albert was present at his Dad's death vigil in a nursing home. At 11:45 AM, his Dad sat up, looked ahead at an apparition, and exclaimed, "Hurry up, brother, hurry up!" Within a few seconds he passed away. Only later did Albert discover that his Dad's brother was simultaneously dying in another nursing home 10 miles away. That death vigil was also witnessed by family members. As death drew near, that brother suddenly sat up, gazed in the distance, and exclaimed, "Wait for me, brother, wait for me!" Seconds later, he died, and the family members present noted the time--11:45 AM! Two brothers were able to react to each other 10 physical miles apart and then their spirits were able to enter eternity simultaneously. Mind-blowing unique evidence for the reality of the soul!
Rev. Albert Baldeo was a UCCan minister, one of the most respected ministers in Kelowna, BC. He was respected enough to be given a weekly column in the city's major paper. One of his articles described his Dad's shared NDE and I confirmed the ensuing description of it by direct contact with Albert: Albert also wrote an article about this shared NDE in the Kelowna newspaper.
Albert was present at his Dad's death vigil in a nursing home. At 11:45 AM, his Dad sat up, looked ahead at an apparition, and exclaimed, "Hurry up, brother, hurry up!" Within a few seconds he passed away. Only later did Albert discover that his Dad's brother was simultaneously dying in another nursing home 10 miles away. That death vigil was also witnessed by family members. As death drew near, that brother suddenly sat up, gazed in the distance, and exclaimed, "Wait for me, brother, wait for me!" Seconds later, he died, and the family members present noted the time--11:45 AM! Two brothers were able to react to each other 10 physical miles apart and then their spirits were able to enter eternity simultaneously. Mind-blowing unique evidence for the reality of the soul!
Mendalla
Happy headbanging ape!!
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And we have confirming video and/or audio with timestamps for all this? Or medical staff recording it in the two charts, even (which usually has to have a date and time)? Or just family eyewitnesses in two locations 10 miles apart comparing memories later?
BetteTheRed
Resident Heretic
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I don't really understand the premise of this thread.
To what are we expected to be persuaded? That the universe is largely not visible and no-one can possibly know what it all means (except for 42, I guess).
That our brains are wyrd and wonderful, and that the experience of death reveals exactly how unique? I've had no NDEs, although I did have an asthma attack which moved into wyrd territory, but I've had two distinct personal ADCs via "dreams" which were not dreams. They were with my father and with my late beloved Hippie. Do these experiences "attest" to anything beyond the existence of a God-gene, a bent towards spiritually unequally shared or at least developed, in humanity, or just to a preternaturally deep human bond (my communications were with the two people I was most tightly bonded to in life). They have nought to do with specific religions.
My two messages: "'s okay beetle" and "it's all good babe"
To what are we expected to be persuaded? That the universe is largely not visible and no-one can possibly know what it all means (except for 42, I guess).
That our brains are wyrd and wonderful, and that the experience of death reveals exactly how unique? I've had no NDEs, although I did have an asthma attack which moved into wyrd territory, but I've had two distinct personal ADCs via "dreams" which were not dreams. They were with my father and with my late beloved Hippie. Do these experiences "attest" to anything beyond the existence of a God-gene, a bent towards spiritually unequally shared or at least developed, in humanity, or just to a preternaturally deep human bond (my communications were with the two people I was most tightly bonded to in life). They have nought to do with specific religions.
My two messages: "'s okay beetle" and "it's all good babe"