New Zealand attacks

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Pinga said:
Wow, @Mrs.Anteater - that seems highly disrespectful . I am surprised that you would say this item.

I feel that many are hurt & moved by this tragedy. Some will express their pain one way, others another.
Can we not learn to listen and respect, rather than resort to taking someone down?
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Deja vue reaction. This time at least, she didn’t make it a personal criticism. So she has learned out of her mistakes. She may express her pain anyway she wants. So did the Moderator. It comes down to “ its the thought that counts”. Considering that the victims are active muslims shot during prayers, I find her having to push her opinion on prayer into this self centered. Because as you said- listen and respecting is what a fellow human does in the time of tragedy for someone else, not pushing your own agenda.
 
Here is what I find really curious about the Vosper piece: She opened it by referring to her open letter to Moderator Gary Patterson in 2015. That particular letter was highly controversial and she has stated herself it contributed to the decision to review her ministry.

So what's going on here? It doesn't surprise me that some perceive self-serving behavior on Gretta's part.
 
Egg heads up easter coming ... thus the lighter yolks as they take flight ...

Nothing to it like love ... when in the dark embrace ... you can't see it coming ... thus quantum nature of criminal passions ... fore given?
 
paradox3 said:
Here is what I find really curious about the Vosper piece: She opened it by referring to her open letter to Moderator Gary Patterson in 2015. That particular letter was highly controversial and she has stated herself it contributed to the decision to review her ministry.

So what's going on here? It doesn't surprise me that some perceive self-serving behavior on Gretta's part.
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I don't sense that she is repentant about the 2015 letter, and I don't think she should be repentant. It needed to be said.
 
chansen said:
I don't sense that she is repentant about the 2015 letter, and I don't think she should be repentant. It needed to be said.
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I don't sense any repentance on her part either. On that we are agreed, my friend.

I am curious about her motivations in bringing up the 2015 letter at this time but we can only speculate. At the very least, it served as an attention-getting opening for her recent blog. She has it up on her own FB page as well as her personal website. Someone has posted it on the United Church FB page where it is receiving the usual range of reactions.

I have been sitting on my typing fingers over there but I couldn't resist one little Like this morning. :)

Not sure why Gretta's beliefs about prayer need to be so public again at this time. Some are finding her comments insensitive given that the victims of this tragedy were Muslims engaged in the act of praying.

Others are finding inspiration in her call to action (vs. retreating into prayer).

She certainly manages to stir up controversy, this one.
 
I'm just going to say that I'm not sure that Fran Ota, who is a long-time, well-known fan/friend of Gretta's, should be moderating this particular thread. It's wide open for charges of conflict of interest, I think.

OTOH, it's also clear to me that Gretta does not despise attention, and she's getting it, from within the ranks, largely, as usual.

I don't know what to DO about the Christchurch tragedy. I don't think prayers seem to be doing much good. I assume there will be a vigil at the in-town mosque Friday, but I'm working, so I can't do that, although I'm sure our congregation will be represented there.
 
BetteTheRed said:
I'm just going to say that I'm not sure that Fran Ota, who is a long-time, well-known fan/friend of Gretta's, should be moderating this particular thread. It's wide open for charges of conflict of interest, I think.

OTOH, it's also clear to me that Gretta does not despise attention, and she's getting it, from within the ranks, largely, as usual.

I don't know what to DO about the Christchurch tragedy. I don't think prayers seem to be doing much good. I assume there will be a vigil at the in-town mosque Friday, but I'm working, so I can't do that, although I'm sure our congregation will be represented there.
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Agreeing when it comes to Fran Ota moderating discussions about Gretta.

Agreeing that Gretta is not opposed to attention. But to be fair to her, all she did was post a blog on her own FB page and her personal website. There have been a few comments in both of these locations but the fur didn't start flying until someone copied the blog to the United Church page.

I am not a big fan of FB for indepth conversation.

Prayer & what we DO to live out our faith are big topics, for sure.
 
chansen said:
She made a blog post. Normally, if you want to hide some information where no one will ever find it, you make a blog post. No one reads them.
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Don;t tell our secrets about sacred scripts! We need a way to bury information and detested intelligence ...
 
We had a virgil in our little town of Wolfville on Sunday. Freezing cold wind might have also kept some people away, there were maybe about 40, many local ministers of different denominations, at least 7 quakers, as we had spontaneously decided to go there ( time and place was just announced the night before) and a few of our local muslims, which are refugees from Syria, who also spoke. Time was given for any person to come to the microphone and speak.
The local Baptist minister spoke and said that he was minister in Charlston, when the church shooting happened there in 2015- and he just wanted our little crowd to know that even though we only were few, the community of Charleton after the massaker lived on the reactions of encouragement after the shooting. Everything was important to them.
One of the muslims said, that we are not to loose the perspective. One person can do a lot of damage, but the majority of humans are good people.
 
I’m lost. Who is Fran Ota?

Can this thread not be a long conversation about Greta again? Everytime Greta is mentioned it just goes on and on. Who cares about Greta? Nobody cares anymore. The outside world doesn’t even know who she is except for a very few. The UCCan has other important issues. I know i’ve participated in the Greta threads but continuing to go on about her after years is stupid. I notice that in all this time that she’s been so controversial, the biggest problem she’s caused is that others like to get their knickers in a knot over her. Which is to say, she’s not really causing the problem. She hasn’t caused big damage by being or claiming the word atheist. She hasn’t caused problems for her own congregation, and she hasn’t turned the world upside down. Because she isn’t as influential as people think she is. I used to think she was a bigger deal when I was closer to the UCCan, but the reality is, her name is no more meaningful to most people than the inside UCCan jargon is. If she gets in the news for representing all of UCCan, then that needs to be addressed. Otherwise, who cares?
 
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I mean who cares about Greta’s role being a minister? Turns out, after years of controversy and fears about her, she's not bringing atheists to church in droves to take over the whole establishment. It’s been going on for about 5 years - or longer - which I realize is 5 weeks in UCCan time. But, it’s been a long time. And she hasn’t changed anything in the big picture, she’s just got the insiders chattering.

I think maybe the UCCan folks - her sisters and brothers - could start caring more for her as a human being.
 
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Kimmio said:
’m lost. Who is Fran Ota?
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A ministry colleague of Gretta's and well known supporter. They ministered to neighboring congregations in the former Scarborough Presbytery years ago. They were also co-chairs of a committee.

Fran is known to us from the original WC. She is a mod on the United Church facebook group and there have been concerns expressed re: conflict of interest when it comes to moderating discussions about Gretta.
 
Kimmio said:
I mean who cares about Greta’s role being a minister? Turns out, after years of controversy and fears about her, she's not bringing atheists to church in droves to take over the whole establishment. It’s been going on for about 5 years - or longer - which I realize is 5 weeks in UCCan time. But, it’s been a long time. And she hasn’t changed anything in the big picture, she’s just got the insiders chattering.

I think maybe the UCCan folks - her sisters and brothers - could start caring more for her as a human being.
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May I point out that disagreeing with Gretta does not necessarily equal lack of caring for her as a human being? I was once extremely fond of her myself but found myself disagreeing with her theology & congregational leadership style. Not an easy thing to experience as I have discussed here in the past.

You are correct in saying she is not bringing atheists in droves to our denomination. She has successfully kept one midsize congregation going in an era when congregations are closing and amalgamating in her geographic area. There are exceptions. The nearest congregation, which has a large contingent of former WHUC members, is doing very well.

This has been going on much longer than 5 years. According to Gretta, the theological shift at WHUC began in 2001.

Agreeing that insiders have been doing plenty of chattering. Outsiders (and the secular press) seem to be fascinated by the cachet of an atheist in a church pulpit.
 
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chansen said:
I agree with keeping Rev. Vosper out of this thread. Let's do that.
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Well, sure. But I wanted to respond to Kimmio.

The Vosper response to happenings in New Zealand is not without relevance to United Church folks.
 
Yeah, I had posted something longer in this thread earlier today. I edited it out and moved it to the Vosper thread.
 
chansen said:
Yeah, I had posted something longer in this thread earlier today. I edited it out and moved it to the Vosper thread.
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Thought so! It gets a bit confusing when similar things are being discussed on more than one thread. I was just thinking there is something else I want to respond to but it must be on the other thread . . .
 
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