The Resurrection of the Body

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Thomas Didymos (Hebrew for twin) was supposed to be Jesus' twin, so another theory is that was who died on the cross.
All this according to the Gospel of Thomas and in the Gospel of John who mentions that Thomas is "the twin" 3 times.
Thus the substitution theory.
 
Waterfall said:
Thomas Didymos (Hebrew for twin) was supposed to be his twin, so another theory is that was who died on the cross.
According to the Gospel of Thomas and in the Gospel of John who mentions that Thomas is "the twin" 3 times.
Thus the substitution theory.
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That sounds ... totally s**tty. I mean, "Hey, let's kill my twin brother so I can pretend to be resurrected" just sounds so horrible. Like a bad conspiracy theory at best. At worst, it confirms that Jesus was actually an evil mastermind.
 
Mendalla said:
That sounds ... totally s**tty. I mean, "Hey, let's kill my twin brother so I can pretend to be resurrected" just sounds so horrible. Like a bad conspiracy theory at best. At worst, it confirms that Jesus was actually an evil mastermind.
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He could have volunteered and seen it as an honour....but yes strange and cult like.
 
Was one twin in the abstract form ... a reflective piece of mind ... wildly projected as a thought of a future image?

The incarnate in some definitions is a image that is not as it appeared thus altered in your mind! Leads to reincarnation when the projection comes back at yah in a psyche form ...

Makes for a grand story ... in which virtue could be hidden! Fertile story telling ...
 
Waterfall said:
I thought Arianism believed God, Jesus and the Holy spirit were separate not the same as God?
Did they also believe Jesus was substituted on the cross?
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Britannica says nothing about the Arians believing in a substitution on the Cross. The article talks more about their proto-Unitarianism.

www.britannica.com

Arianism | Definition, History, & Controversy

Arianism, in Christianity, the Christological (concerning the doctrine of Christ) position that Jesus, as the Son of God, was created by God. It was proposed early in the 4th century by the Alexandrian presbyter Arius and was popular throughout much of the Eastern and Western Roman empires...
www.britannica.com
 
I was guessing. Another heresy was Manacheism. There were at least one or two other major heresies about the same time. One of them, using John, held that Jesus only pretended to die. My Six Prisoners was a novel written like a biography. One of the prisoners had strong control of his body. He slowed down his metabolism to the point he appeared to be dead and maintained this state for three days. Then he activated himself again. Another speculation is the group experimented with the poison of the puffer fish. Lazarus was the last test wirh the poison. When he wasboffered the sponge with vinegar, it contained the right dose of poison, putting Jesus in a catatonic state long enough to be put in the tomb.

A more interesting discussion is, if the resurrection was real, what was it and will we experience the same kind of resurrec6ion?
 
I do love the rabbit holes WC2 leads me down. Looking for a description of this substitution theory/heresy, I discovered this:

The substitution hypothesis or twin hypothesis states that the sightings of a risen Jesus are explained not by physical resurrection, but by the existence of a different person, a twin or lookalike who could have impersonated Jesus after his death, or died in the place of Jesus on the cross. It is a position held by some Gnostics in the first to third century, as well as some modern Mandaeans and Muslims and a few skeptics.[1] (from Wiki)

For a religion, still in existence, that seems to span Christianity and Islam, and seems to have components of this substitutionary (Gnostic) thought, I offer you:

en.wikipedia.org

Mandaeism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
I think one of the religion channels I follow on Youtube did a piece on the Mandaeans now that you mention it. Forget if it was Let's Talk Religion or Religion for Breakfast but if I find it, I will post it.
 
BetteTheRed said:
I do love the rabbit holes WC2 leads me down. Looking for a description of this substitution theory/heresy, I discovered this:

The substitution hypothesis or twin hypothesis states that the sightings of a risen Jesus are explained not by physical resurrection, but by the existence of a different person, a twin or lookalike who could have impersonated Jesus after his death, or died in the place of Jesus on the cross. It is a position held by some Gnostics in the first to third century, as well as some modern Mandaeans and Muslims and a few skeptics.[1] (from Wiki)

For a religion, still in existence, that seems to span Christianity and Islam, and seems to have components of this substitutionary (Gnostic) thought, I offer you:

en.wikipedia.org

Mandaeism - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
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Very interesting!
 
Explains the din about Jesus and his shadow ... without doubt! It was a dark casting ...

Often raises great paranoia ... those dark mysterious things! Some may get right into such topics for resolution ... others, well they just don't go there! No question!

Often demands vast apologetics when encountered ...
 
GordW said:
The part of the Easter story that I always wrestle with the most is what happens to Jesus' body. It is, for me, easier to concieve as resurrection as something beyond the body. And yet there is also a part of me that thinks it is so much more healthy to see body and soul as an integrated whole rather than fall into the trap that soul=good/real self and body=bad/lesser self. The real challenge though, may lie beyond the Easter story...

This Easter season I have chosen to work through 1Corinthians 15, a whole chapter of Paul discussing the meaning and importance of resurrection. IT has been an interesting process (heading into part 3 of 4 parts, part 4 will wait until later in May as I am off the first 2 Sundays in May) thus far and there have been days I wondered about the wisdom of this plan. Part 1 talked about witnesses. Part 2 yesterday talked about resurrection as a real thing. Part 3 for next Sunday leads us to talk about bodies.

Within Christian thought and history there has been a belief in the resurrection of the body. This is not just talking about Jesus but about all of the faithful. Resurrection is not only a Jesus thing after all, but a promise and hope for all of us. Maybe at the moment of death or maybe at the end of time we are promised that we will be raised, But in what body??????

Is the body of the resurrection a reanimated corpse (which sounds more like a zombie apocalypse than the coming of the REign of God) or something different? How much continuity is there between the two bodies?

My early thoughts for the week are here: Looking Ahead to April 30, 2023 -- 4th Sunday of Easter

What is your take on the resurrection/life beyond death/the life that awaits us? OR is dead simply dead?
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Well, since the best match for how reality is is Animism, the fundamental stuff of reality is Stories, the interpenetrating non-extractive communications between the vast Community of People, only a portion of whom are Human

Still grappling with this

So Jesus had Jesus energy and is hooked into that Vast Web of Communication, where indeed some of what we call thoughts are People

So Jesus is still alive and active. In fact it looks like most Humans around the world are still ok with communicating with their ancestors...

I always wonder how far this Decolonization project can go? How far people are willing to take it?

We will see


I am an optimist still

ps in a very real sense i think Materialist-Naturalism's frame of Energy is that energy is immaterial, Action, at its fundamental level. And Matter is an aspect of energy and vice versa
 
Unionized colonies connected by railroading and Shanghai 'n ... the hine follows as Osler ... mule driver! Sometimes as Heidi as dais are arranged ... Hei Nun?

Word play is resemblance of god's played out and needs a medium to rest upon with relaxed myths ... sometimes grim tales of inhuman it Arian history!

Expect corruption due to power ... that's rendering down! But ... what if the populace is convinced not to read it? Would that be a business of the slacker side of alert? Watch Towers fall ... just note ...
 
Mystic said:
Nope! Docetism
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Depends a lot on opinions of what was what and what was overruled by those controlling the book! Avarice is central to subjective projections.

Thus we loose track or the rejected fringe ... all in the concept of the roman circa (a searing spirit as Ca)! Often calcified like a hard heart part! Just words ... more to be ignored by those that will not get beyond themselves ... out of it in a divine way! Vicious and hostile parallels no responsibility beyond self ... self being unknown contrary to some old philosophy that suggests sophisticated etude ... a wobbly science?

Thus we loose the edge ... become dense and dull ... light has mysterious ways! Thus some glow o opposing sides ... alternates? Divine ... the black and white shifting to red and yellow ... indigenous option! Rough initiation ... maybe ruah ...
 
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