The Opposite of Toxic Masculinity

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ninjafaery

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I think I approached this topic backwards today, by viewing a movie review video by Russell Brand. I think he's the opposite of toxic masculinity. I've been a fan of his awhile. His story is very redemptive.
Anyway, just asking all the questions, but what isn't toxic masculinity? What does that look like? Are there examples from your life of men who embody the opposite?

 

unsafe

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Toxic Masculinity In Boys Is Fueling An Epidemic Of Loneliness | Think | NBC News


Article -----https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/toxic-masculinity-terrible-shorthand-real-problem-plaguing-men-ncna957941
 

ninjafaery

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That's an awesome video unsafe. I highly recommend it to everyone. Thank you so much for sharing it. It sounds like in addition to how a family raises boys, peers are really an influence.




tTh
 

unsafe

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ninjafaery[/----Your Welcome ----it is sad that society has put this burden on men -----as we see many are struggling just to have a great friend to connect to out of Fear of being labeled as weak and frail ------I believe it might stem back to Biblical Times as Males were portrayed to be the head of the household --church and combat etc -----but Godid d not intend this -----and many misunderstand what God really intended for His Human race ------no one is above the other and men are Humans and need friends of their own kind ---without the discrimination ---just my view -----
 
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unsafe

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Nice Thread Topic --- ninjafaery -----Hope some post their thoughts about this subject ----- It needs to be talked about --i THINK ----
 

Northwind

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Great topic ninja. When I saw the title I thought you were going to talk about a toxic phenomenon on the other end of the spectrum. It was a pleasant surprise to see this. I'm glad this topic is being raised in many places. It's an important discussion. I agree with @unsafe that The Church has been a big contributor to this when they've expected men to be heads of the households and all that is related to that.

I'll watch the video later.
 

Mrs.Anteater

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I had a conversation with my 90 year old neighbour about her husband. He has been making “ jokes” lately that were “ borderline” appropriate. He is presently an inpatient, and when I was visiting him when his wife called, he jokingly said to her” I am having Mrs. Anteater here in my bed”.
She said that he never shared his feeling, just the way he was raised, and she has talked to some other friend about how their husbands use these remarks to deal with their dwindling masculinity.
She said “ I will have a talking to!”, which is funny, because she is such a tiny 90 lbs lady with such a strong character.
 

BetteTheRed

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It appears to me to be a very hard thing (no pun intended) for men to feel denied intimacy because their bodies don't co-operate. There can be quite a bit of underlying anger here, and I think it affects men more than women, because "menopause" is a real 'thing' that happens relatively quickly. "Andropause", less definable, is a much longer process.
 
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I just lost a long post because I got logged out. I think I'm too far from the wifi (outside right now).

Was wondering about an ex of mine and how he's handling the changes in expectations. In the 90s sexist comments were so often among the 20 somethings I'd lose track - but I did internalize it. He called all women "chicks" and commented on "primo chicks" and nice "racks" and his automatic reaction to having an attractive female physiotherapist was feeling weird because he couldn't use that casual vernacular with a professional. He had a hard time seeing women in professional positions with clout. He was a bike courier/ sporty hipster and it was a youthful but male dominated culture. There were a few female couriers they were on polite terms with, but those "chicks" we're not let into the boys club.

I thought he was an otherwise charming and generous guy...but I hope he's changed his attitude toward women.
 
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It appears to me to be a very hard thing (no pun intended) for men to feel denied intimacy because their bodies don't co-operate. There can be quite a bit of underlying anger here, and I think it affects men more than women, because "menopause" is a real 'thing' that happens relatively quickly. "Andropause", less definable, is a much longer process.
If they have their own hands that's no excuse. They can keep their thoughts and their release to themselves. We all can. We have evolved brains.

A lot of people are going without sex, or in person sexual activity these days. And might for much longer. There are other options if one just uses some imagination. There shouldnt be shame in not "hooking up". Maybe now is a good time to deprioritize our oversexed culture.
 
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Remember A$AP Rocky? There was a scuffle he got into in Sweden and he spent some time in jail there for assault that he denied. He got Trump to try to act on his behalf unsuccessfully. Or one of the Kardasians did.

I saw a clip of him on Colbert's show and he's very attractive. Makes my heart skip a beat to look at...he's aware he has that effect. Like a peacock. He models. He's a rapper and musician. He dated Rhianna and they look like a perfect, beautiful, pair. He's supposedly a sweet guy by accounts of people who've met him. But every interview I've seen he has displayed toxic masculinity. He comments that he knows he's the best looking MF around and all the ladies love him. When asked how he treats women on dates he differentiates between how he treats the special ones and the "fat ass hoes". The headline on the interview I clicked on recently (yeah, I did, like a groupie) was "ASAP Rocky shows his romantic side". But they neglected to point out the toxic side. And he's only in his early 30s. He's notorious for getting into bar fights. I no longer think he's attractive after hearing him speak. But he's a celebrity and an icon young men and women look up to. It's disappointing.
 
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"Karen" is the opposite of toxic masculinity. I agree. But not just the overtly racist ones. The ones who send their food back three times and ask to speak to the manager when something isn't perfect, harangue low wage workers, and make nasty comments on other women's looks. The adult mean girls. There are a lot of Karens in my generation. It's not a point of pride. The Karen meme started with Karen from will and Grace as the stereotype. Snobby, arrogant, and spoiled...and she was an icon.
 
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BetteTheRed

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That's not toxic femininity. That is systemic racism, in the U.S. That is an attempt to do a "murder by cop" by a white woman on a black man. It is, second to the recent murder of George Floyd, easily the most evil thing I've been exposed to. Only by degree. The cops killed George, the cops arrived "too late on the scene" to kill Chris.
 
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That's not toxic femininity. That is systemic racism, in the U.S. That is an attempt to do a "murder by cop" by a white woman on a black man. It is, second to the recent murder of George Floyd, easily the most evil thing I've been exposed to. Only by degree. The cops killed George, the cops arrived "too late on the scene" to kill Chris.
He's talking about the Karen meme. Chris's sister called Amy a "Karen", which is mostly about acting entitled and bitchy...not not in an overtly racist context until it was pointed out through this incident that the overtly racist Karens exist too. A more toxic version, and more prevelant than we assume.
 

BetteTheRed

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I love soft masculinity.

Russel Brand, Stephen Fry, orientation be damned, men, and women, who understand their own feelings, and can express them. I'm in my 60s. s**tty at recognizing or defining my own feelings. What I have learned, from a lifetime of ignoring clues, is that if your solar plexus feels very really tight, maybe you should go "inside" and try and deal with it.
 
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Men who are not toxic are not jealous of competing with vibrators that have more advanced capabilities than they do and therefore won't allow them into the relationship. I have met guys like that. Non toxic guys generally know how to set their macho pride aside, and prefer to.
 
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I love soft masculinity.

Russel Brand, Stephen Fry, orientation be damned, men, and women, who understand their own feelings, and can express them. I'm in my 60s. s**tty at recognizing or defining my own feelings. What I have learned, from a lifetime of ignoring clues, is that if your solar plexus feels very really tight, maybe you should go "inside" and try and deal with it.
Russel used to be pretty toxic. He's grown as a person.
 
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