Normative Christian Experience of the Divine

[Mystic]

This thread is posted here because of this stated purpose for this topic section: "The meaning of, and philosophy/theology behind, worship..."
Let me introduce it with a question posed by my friend Mike, a Boeing engineer and a devout Christian: "Does the New Testament teach that the heart of Gospel faith is an intimate personal relationship with Jesus Christ that motivates our worship?" Mike has always believed in salvation by grace through faith in Christ's atoning death. As a result, he believes he is a "son of God," his heavenly "Father." He believes that he has the Holy Spirit within. But he admits he has never had the expected "intimate personal relationship with Christ." and he wanted to know if that expectation is even biblically sound. I contend that many Christian youth lose their faith once they go to college largely because Christ was never more than a theological construct around which that their life gained meaning. When college altered that construct for meaning, they lose their faith.

I intend to pursue this topic under the theme "normative Christian experience of the divine," i. e. normative for NT writers like Paul and Peter. What do Paul and Peter consider the experience of the indwelling Christ and the Holy Spirit to be like? How far removed is their expectation from your life and church experience? What, if anything, should be done about this chasm between their teaching and modern church teaching? What also makes this question urgent is the main objection I hear educated skeptics level against Christianity: not that the Bible is full of myths and legends, but that Christianity just doesn't deliver what it promises.

btw, Mike's pastor brought him to see that an intimate personal relationship with Christ is indeed normative biblical teaching. I will be playing cards with him and others this morning.

 

[Luce NDs]

In the light could one see life with some sense of responsibility if blinders were lifted from the eyes (lifting of lids)?

Imagine being blinded by emotions without an icon of wisdom or other --- may be related to Dan Goleman and his treatise on Emotional Intelligence! Really messes up the emotions only path ... given the gift of everything to be observed and the sacredness of soul (hidden aspect)!

Some digging prerequisite ...

In the absolute struggle for power as in love and war ... is all conscience and powers of observation delegated to the shade? The mercenary creed ...

 

[jimkenney12]

What is or is not Christianity? How does an abstract concept promise anything? From Paul's letters we see participating in the community and identifying with the community as the normative Christian experience. Some of the members have special spiritual gifts (1 Corinthians 12), but there is no clear rejection of members of the community who lack any of the gifts described.

Paul's letters promise nothing more than Salvation.

 

[Mystic]

No m

What is or is not Christianity? How does an abstract concept promise anything? From Paul's letters we see participating in the community and identifying with the community as the normative Christian experience. Some of the members have special spiritual gifts (1 Corinthians 12), but there is no clear rejection of members of the community who lack any of the gifts described.

Paul's letters promise nothing more than Salvation.

No modern NT scholar would agree with you. I assume you have never read a single academic book solely devoted to Paul's response to his opponents in his churches. Text critic B. F. Wescott famously noted, "The simple Gospel is not so simple as the simple would have you suppose." Stay tuned for the documented evidence.

 

[jimkenney12]

That is okay. I prefer Paul's writing to modern scholars.

 

[Luce NDs]

The pall of wring assures than much is covered without depth of understanding of the origins of writ ... and how human avarice would misdirect the field of dreams ... as appalling!

It is helpfully to understand the source of Anglo-Saxon language is diverse! That's the word as I see it ... multi depth as ascribed to create chaos and confusion as the powers desire ... weaker power will rest and reconceive ... thus other worlds ... fresher Jerusalem's ... Salem nighties as dark an thinly laced together? Portals of ethereal nature ... Eire?

Nothing more enigmatic that humanity ... take it from one said to be insane and out of it! Significantly ignored or naivete anthropomorphised!

Personality erection ... physically constructed as terminal for rationality! Such is irrationally hated ... within the cover story!

What is contained is the devil if released ... bad news for portions of civilization built on unbalance ... vast winnings?