Guaranteed Liveable Income - what's happening in your area?

[Carolla]

Hey friends - newly released video from our Moderator. GLI is an important issue - United Church has a network working to promote its adoption. They have been encouraging people to organize vigils at politician's offices to draw attention to the issue. Do you hear anything about it in your church or Region?

The United Church of Canada invites churches and faith communities across the country to hold a vigil or event on March 24, 25, or 26 to call for a Guaranteed Livable Income. More information including a new email template for letters to government, can be found on the Guaranteed Livable Income webpage. Send details of the event you are planning to justice@united-church.ca ​

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Share your events and vigils with us on social media, and be sure to use our hashtag: #UCCanLivableIncome #UCCan.​

 

[Mendalla]

Provincially, we're all NDP here so probably no need to lobby them on this. Likely already on their radar.

Federally, OTOH, London is a mix of Liberal and NDP so definitely some value in going after the Libs.

I would argue, though, that the devil is going to be in the details with GLI and no GLI may be better than a poorly done one (e.g. that costs billions or trillions and still doesn't help everyone that it is intended to help). After Phoenix and similar fiascos, I honestly doubt the ability of our federal government to deliver anything without bungling it or turning it into a cash cow for their friends.

 

[Mrs.Anteater]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/covid-relief-record-drop-child-poverty-nova-scotia-1.6772046

clearly an increase in funds for the people who need it has positive outcomes.

 

[Mendalla]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/covid-relief-record-drop-child-poverty-nova-scotia-1.6772046

clearly an increase in funds for the people who need it has positive outcomes.

Oh yeah, when a program like this is done well, the benefits are clear. I support GLI in principle, just not sure it is going to succeed given the current state of our civil service.

 

[Carolla]

There is a private member's bill on the table federally - but we know what (doesn't) happen with those - first reading has occured on this one then into oblivion. Bit of a sham really. There is also apparently the same version before the senate with nothing happening - hasn't even had a first reading there. The liberal party endorsed the concept at a convention in 2017 (I think that's the date) - not much mention since then.

Municipalities are footing the biggest bills for people NOT receiving adequate liveable income and therefore living in poverty - so I think for that reason the UCCan Network is focusing now on local municipal politicians as well. Ontario president of association of Municipalities had a good article in the Star this week. And I believe the Cdn Federation of Municipalities endorsed the need for GLI in a 2017 report to the Fed gov ... but still no action. Don't know if they have done any follow-up.

Provincial governments are also impacted - I suppose mainly in the realm of health care costs related to poverty.

 

[KayTheCurler]

Politicians in general don't seem to care much about improving the living situations of the least affluent. I think they should all have to live for three or so months on next to nothing so they will have an idea about the importance of the topic. This thread arrived on my screen immediately following a visit from a low income neighbour. We really don't mind helping him out - and he insists on paying us back later with cash or labour.

 

[Carolla]

That's very kind of you KayTheCurler.

 

[KayTheCurler]

We think it is the best thing to do for this particular neighbour. Systems and childhood trauma leave him in a precarious place.

 

[Luce NDs]

The great powers will resist as this would cost them something as increased taxes ... something intolerable to peak conditions ... thus come downs! Expect it ...

If you do not support society ... does the entire thing fall into a dark hole of allegorical nature? There is an article in a recent NY'r publication about this up/down wave function ... all in the mind; sentient as suggested ...

The entire comprehension is beyond a great mass ...

 

[Mendalla]

The liberal party endorsed the concept at a convention in 2017 (I think that's the date)

A party endorsing something and a government from that party actually doing it are two very different things. The so-cons in the CPC have been finding that out repeatedly over the years, with party policy assemblies endorsing pro-life and anti-same sex marriage positions while CPC leaders and governments have pushed that (or tried to) aside to focus on fiscal conservative priorities and things like opposing gun control.

 

[Carolla]

A party endorsing something and a government from that party actually doing it are two very different things

For sure.

 

[JayneWonders]

I wonder if there is anyone else who is less than convinced that this can be successful in our society. I am always hesitant to enter this one. A bit gun-shy after the last time I dared to attempt to articulate some of my concerns.

 

[Mrs.Anteater]

I am all for simplifying the social system and giving people depending on it a livable income. There should be no need for food banks. I do think, that people need to have meaningful “work” to contribute to society and that the lack of it is unhealthy. As such, I think that social services need to be given to individuals with that in mind and not unconditionally.
Our society is not used to value things that are free. They usually get wasted. Free housing would not necessary mean people will take good care of their housing. More money doesn’t necessarily mean people will spend it wisely or efficiently. There is a whole other level to this that goes beyond throwing money at people.
But if middle class kids have the opportunity to play hockey and not needing to work until they are in high school, so should working class or social assistance kids.

 

[BetteTheRed]

An interesting question. Under GMI, there will still be people who will gamble/drink/drug away all of their money for a month, and will then still need assistance, or starve.

GMI doesn't fix broken situations.

 

[Luce NDs]

I am all for simplifying the social system and giving people depending on it a livable income. There should be no need for food banks. I do think, that people need to have meaningful “work” to contribute to society and that the lack of it is unhealthy. As such, I think that social services need to be given to individuals with that in mind and not unconditionally.
Our society is not used to value things that are free. They usually get wasted. Free housing would not necessary mean people will take good care of their housing. More money doesn’t necessarily mean people will spend it wisely or efficiently. There is a whole other level to this that goes beyond throwing money at people.
But if middle class kids have the opportunity to play hockey and not needing to work until they are in high school, so should working class or social assistance kids.

Yes! Look what the powers do with basic freedom ... twist it all to crap and all that without onus of knowing what it means ...

 

[Mendalla]

An interesting question. Under GMI, there will still be people who will gamble/drink/drug away all of their money for a month, and will then still need assistance, or starve.

GMI doesn't fix broken situations.

OTOH, done well, it might help the victims of those situations. The single parents who lost their partner to one or all of those. The abused spouses left alone because they decided to make a stand. And so on. And improving community services for people with addiction/mental health issues alongside the GMI would be a necessary part of implementation, IMHO.

 

[Luce NDs]

There will always be flaws in the impeccable plans of gods ... it is just diabolical, or demos alien sentient!

 

[Carolla]

Our society is not used to value things that are free.

I do agree that all of us do not know the cost of things we receive that are subsidized by government or sometimes paid by private insurance. We are rarely told of the cost - I've often thought it would be helpful to publicize the general costs. For example in health care - how much does blood work cost? What about an x-ray, MRI, a day of hospital stay? A visit to the Emerg dept vs visit to the doctor's office (if we have one). Most of us have no idea of the numbers. . I recall being stunned by what I had to pay for veterinary services - blood work etc. A day of public school? The actual cost of a ride on city transit? These are not 'free' as we may be accustomed to thinking about them.

 

[Waterfall]

Minimum wage will now be going up to $16.55/hr. federally as of April 1/23.

 

[Mendalla]

Minimum wage will now be going up to $16.55/hr. federally as of April 1/23.

Are they going to index it, though? That's what really needs to be happening with minimum wage. Raise it annually by the average rate of pay increases or inflation rate or something like that. No more ad hoc, when the government feels like it increases but actually having it keep up with the economy. I think the Liberals were going to index it in Ontario and that died when Ford came in and killed the big increase they had planned (I think, I haven't checked).