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Pinga

Room for All
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i can't recollect what caused me to quit posting on Wondercafe one day.


I am sure that I was tired.
Tired of what?
Tired of the back & forth, the ongoing same voices, the posts that don't discuss the topic, but, instead get into old arguments. Tired of the amount of time it took to navigate postings, to figure out how to respond that didn't start someone bickering, or how to encourage good dialogue on threads that i was on.

I am sure that there was lots going on in my life. I am sure that my tolerance was low.

I also know that I no longer shared what was going on in my life on wondercafe.

Why?
I don't trust the community to engage in a supportive fashion or in a way that I could process. That is my lack of trust not the people on the site are not trustworthy.

I remember with fondness the learnings that I had during times when I was struggling with an item. I remember with fondness the support that I had when struggling with putting down a cat (a simple thing) and my mother's death.

I recognize that I have not shared that kind of openness in this space for a long time.

I also had other avenues
I started sharing more writing on facebook, and dialoguing on facebook groups.
(I found that these are lacking. They don't have the potential that wondercafe has had in the past, but...wondercafe hadn't reached its potential for me for a long time)

I also then realized, no one cared that I wasn't present

Although I had been one of the more active members on wondercafe, a member of council and a founding member, no one reached out to say "hey". Not one.
Oh, I did get a comment to say that someone was asking about me, and wondering where i was.
I also got a question about my role.
But there was no "You are missed". "how are you", "are you ok"
or "why don't you pop in for a short visit on this thread, it's a good one"

So, then, it became a study, I wondered when or if, anyone will reach out.
It reminded me of churches where people disappear and everyone is going to reach out, but no one does.
Where presumptions are held regarding why someone has left.

And, to be honest, if I remember correctly, the reason that I came back was Mendalla tagged me regarding an upgrade item (or possibly council, or maybe both)
I had responded to him on a few other admin items over the last year.

So, when I come back, what do i find.
a) conversations about Jae
b) the same old digs and back/forths
c) RedBaron adding his wonderful gift to Room for All. Thank-you @Redbaron
d) the same folks trying to write thoughtful posts and lifting their eyes up to conversation.

I'm trying to find that jewel that I remember.
I remember with fondness the learnings that I had during times when I was struggling with an item.
I remember with fondness the support that I had when my son's cat had to be put down, and when my Mom died.
I remember the learnings that I had in watching people talk through complex topics, with deep listening and response. Posts from lay and minister alike.
 

Northwind

Still knitting. Walking the path to health.
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I value your input and participation Pinga. I like when you're around. I'm guilty of not reaching out. Perhaps it is because I see you on FB. I also know you have a life outside WC2 that takes priority. I value our friendship and look forward to another in person visit with a low-voiced singing buddy. Stay well.
 

ChemGal

One with keen eye
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Sometimes the comments aren't so direct. I think many of the times people asked about you it's because you were missed I think someone even said so directly and I failed on passing that on.
 

ChemGal

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Sorry for not being more direct with messaging. I do like your posts here, I have missed your participation here.
 

Mrs.Anteater

Just keep going....
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I do think I have ask where you were and was told you are busy with RL and more active on facebook. You are right that WC is like a RL church- or any group really. Unless you are RL friends, people will not follow up on you and just take it as your choice to do something else. Similar I find happens when you retire or leave work. Most times, you get a good bye, but unless you have real friends at work, you will be forgotten quickly and replaced anyway.
So , I see WC as a chance for experiences on a low level key ( most times) with a closer/ higher level option.
At what level things happen is completely up to me.
Low level means communication as much as I want it to be. At anytime, one can decide not to respond. That’s particularly helpful when things go in circles or become personal. Higher level is your choice who you contact privately and up to them if they chose to respond. I had WC cat sitters in my home and private meetings that were pleasant.
The variety of participants with different degrees of knowledge helps me to widen my horizon all in one stop ( taken with a grain of salt, though). Political discussions, religious discussions, music or movie suggestions I can either check out or ignore. I think I would have to search the net a lot more and read a variety of newspapers to find some of the things that others post here. I don’t expect anybody to care in a very deep way. About at the level of being told in RL that the friend of a friend’s brother is very sick. You miss seeing him at the parties, but you are not close enough to engage in any way.
The basic question is what are you getting out of your time being here. And everybody might have a slightly different answer.
 

Pinga

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This is not meant to be taken personally by anyone. It isn't a matter of anyone failing to do anything. It is just a reflection.
Wondercafe is up to the individual. There is no one going to come looking.
Yet, at the same time, wondercafe as a group owns that people fall by the way side, and that will result in less people posting.
 

Lastpointe

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I think lots of us come and go. Depending on energy levels, conversations....... I had been away for months I think and then started up again. We come and go depending on what our needs are right now

i wonder if you saw the posts that Matthew died?
 

Lastpointe

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To Pinga. She wasn’t here around that time. Sorry guess that was a bit cryptic
 

Pinga

Room for All
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I think lots of us come and go. Depending on energy levels, conversations....... I had been away for months I think and then started up again. We come and go depending on what our needs are right now

i wonder if you saw the posts that Matthew died?
I had engaged with DaisyJane on Facebook, and read her blogs as he was unwell.
i had not participated in any threads here re his death.
Thanks for ensuring that I knew.

(figured it was to me, as you posted15 min after my post)


I also had engaged with Northwind through a facebook private group, so. there was a way to keep up with those locally, and even remote.
 

Northwind

Still knitting. Walking the path to health.
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To Pinga. She wasn’t here around that time. Sorry guess that was a bit cryptic
Sorry. I thought Pinga has written that post. Apparently I wasn't paying attention as much as I had thought. :unsure: :barefoot:
 

Lastpointe

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It’s funny. When we compare things to church and people leaving

i often wonder what is the role of the person who left to keep in touch

some background

my hubby retired three or so years ago. He doesn’t get hi how are you emails. But he keeps in touch with a few people who he worked closely with And he initiates those calls for the most part


so I can also think of my parents. My mom was really close to her three sisters but they all lived in Toronto and we moved when I was a child to London. Phone calls were expensive but it was my moms opinion that she was the one who left. So she should be the one who reached out by phone. These weekly calls were sort of supervised by my dad. I totally recall him sitting there saying “Jean, it’s been twenty minutes”

so my thought is , when people feel they haven’t been contacted by others , have they actually reached out themselves
 

Pinga

Room for All
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I totally get it is the person's choice, Lastpointe.
I do think that there is a significant difference between a move or retirement, and the act of stopping attending a church or stopping posting on wondercafe.
The first is a physical separation. The latter there is no physical block (well, unless the reason someone stopped going is accessability)
In fact, for retirement, I was invited to a facebook group for retirees. There are regular posts which keep us uptodate on the health and well-being of the people that we worked with, and gentle ribbing.

At wondercafe, we bemoan people not being present, and people leaving, yet, to my knowledge, there is NO action to re-engage folks.
 

Pinga

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True that. There was one bulk email. Bulk emails though a nice reminder do not equate to a personal item.

Again, don't take it personally.

Don't think I reached out to folks or engaged folks by saying, hey this is a cool thread
 

Seeler

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i can't recollect what caused me to quit posting on Wondercafe one day.


I am sure that I was tired.
Tired of what?
Tired of the back & forth, the ongoing same voices, the posts that don't discuss the topic, but, instead get into old arguments. Tired of the amount of time it took to navigate postings, to figure out how to respond that didn't start someone bickering, or how to encourage good dialogue on threads that i was on.

I am sure that there was lots going on in my life. I am sure that my tolerance was low.

I also know that I no longer shared what was going on in my life on wondercafe.

Why?
I don't trust the community to engage in a supportive fashion or in a way that I could process. That is my lack of trust not the people on the site are not trustworthy.

I remember with fondness the learnings that I had during times when I was struggling with an item. I remember with fondness the support that I had when struggling with putting down a cat (a simple thing) and my mother's death.

I recognize that I have not shared that kind of openness in this space for a long time.

I also had other avenues
I started sharing more writing on facebook, and dialoguing on facebook groups.
(I found that these are lacking. They don't have the potential that wondercafe has had in the past, but...wondercafe hadn't reached its potential for me for a long time)

I also then realized, no one cared that I wasn't present

Although I had been one of the more active members on wondercafe, a member of council and a founding member, no one reached out to say "hey". Not one.
Oh, I did get a comment to say that someone was asking about me, and wondering where i was.
I also got a question about my role.
But there was no "You are missed". "how are you", "are you ok"
the or "why don't you pop in for a short visit on this thread, it's a good one"

So, then, it became a study, I wondered when or if, anyone will reach out.
It reminded me of churches where people disappear and everyone is going to reach out, but no one does.
Where presumptions are held regarding why someone has left.

And, to be honest, if I remember correctly, the reason that I came back was Mendalla tagged me regarding an upgrade item (or possibly council, or maybe both)
I had responded to him on a few other admin items over the last year.

So, when I come back, what do i find.
a) conversations about Jae
b) the same old digs and back/forths
c) RedBaron adding his wonderful gift to Room for All. Thank-you @Redbaron
d) the same folks trying to write thoughtful posts and lifting their eyes up to conversation.

I'm trying to find that jewel that I remember.
I remember with fondness the learnings that I had during times when I was struggling with an item.
I remember with fondness the support that I had when my son's cat had to be put down, and when my Mom died.
I remember the learnings that I had in watching people talk through complex topics, with deep listening and response. Posts from lay and minister alike.

Pinga, sorry for being so late getting back to you. I've been having trouble with my Dragon.
I also have trouble dealing with long quotes – I don't know how to break them up.

I'm too tired of some the back and forth, back and forth , often between two people going over the same arguments. I've found it best just to skip over them. Sometimes I leave the thread, but it is something that I am really interested in. I will go back to the last person who posted on topic, or to the opening poster, and reply to them. Sometimes that will bring the thread back on topic. If not, I just leave the thread. And there are some, and some posters, but I tend to avoid mostly. I like the way Paradox has been able to keep her study thread on topic, but just moving on each day.

Trust \ support
I'm sorry that this site does not seem as supportive to you as it once was. To some extent, I've noticed that also.
But perhaps it is also because I have been posting less often (mainly due to my physical problems), and the fact that I feel I need more, not less, support. I don't trust Facebook. And I would like to see Wonder Café 2 back as vibrant as it once was.

I also then realized, no one cared that I wasn't present.e
That simply isn't true. On the other hand, I felt that you had abandoned me. I don't remember just when but it seemed that you just stopped posting. No notice; no farewell , no indication that I could pick up that this was happening. I do appologize if I was insensitive.
I tried asking others, where is Pinga? I sent a fairly long note to you and received no reply. To be fair I realized that you possibly (probably) didn't receive it. (I don't remember how I sent it- probly a private message through facebook -and I'm not good with Facebook)
since then I've frequently mentioned on Wonder Café that I miss you.
I was delighted to see you back again. I do hope you will stay. Your presence is certainly important to me. Although I don't always agree with you. I appreciate your posts and have learned a lot from you.
We need more people like you to help rebuild a vibrant community.
But besides that I still need to know that you are my friend.

Yes, Jae's name still comes up occasionally – but not often.
Yes,we still have some of the same old digs.
But we have RedBaron and Paradox, and Mendella, and others. (I miss Chansen, and Crazyheart left a heartshaped hole).

Pinga, my friend, try to remember the jewell this place has been, and continues to be, for so many of us. Please stay. Your work with us has been appreciated. Your friendship valued.
 

ninjafaery

I just am
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I was reflecting today as well, about how profoundly self-absorbed we humans appear to be (and I am absolutely culpable). It's a disheartening phenomenom I've seen everywhere. It isn't even lack of caring....it's just an asssumption there's a good reason you don't know about. As Seeler has put more eloquently than I could, you have been missed.
 

revjohn

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If I see you in the house I most likely won't ask you why you are avoiding a certain room.

My time in Wondercafe2 is markedly different from what it was two years ago.

Why?

Because life goes places all its own and not everyone who was part of a journey then is part of the journey now.

Have I found a better place for conversation then WC2 online? Nope.

Am I involved in different conversations elsewhere? Yup.

Life is a marathon not a sprint, sometimes discretion is the better part of valour and knowing one's own limits means something must give. In the last two years I had my grandson living with us full-time. I lost my grandfather when I was very young and it has definitely been the deepest scar upon my life. I'm giving Qball time. It will shape him. For good or for ill. I obviously hope it will be more the former than the latter. After a number of hours of letting him set activity agendas and still trying to get done what I am expected to get done I find myself craving solitude. WC2 doesn't offer that to me.
 

Seeler

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Rev. John, I'm sorry to see you leave, and I miss your thoughtful posts. And I think you gave notice that you would be dropping out.,
Perhaps you will drop in again Sometimes when things settle down for you.
By the way, congratulations on your new church. Way to go!

I'll miss seeing and hearing about your beautiful grandson, and those energetic dogs.
 
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