What are jinn?

GeoFee

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There is a world of fact and a world of fiction. Stories have inspired and encouraged persons in all times and places. These have invested such inspiration and encouragement in the hope of restoring the well being of our presence in nature.

Just now I am thinking of stories by Tolkien. A diversity of characters keeping company with a person destined to cast down the reign of dark power. The story of Frodo’s quest in the company of an intimate friend. Now I am thinking of Robin Hood and his band of merry folk. Taking from the rich and sharing with the poor.

The forming character of a young child is well served by stories. The story of three little pigs living in danger by the presence of a wolf. Each building a home, only one if secure against the wolf’s threatening presence.

Fiction and fact harmonized produce creative energy adequate to the challenge of our planet and its peoples.

George
 
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Mendalla

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Just now I am thinking of stories by Tolkien. A diversity of characters keeping company with a person destined to cast down the reign of dark power. The story of Frodo’s quest in the company of an intimate friend.
It's the One Ring that fascinates me most in Tolkien, because it is (IMHO) the same ring as Wagner's Ring of the Nibelungs; a token of power that must somehow be destroyed and love plays a key role in that destruction. We can seize the Ring and be corrupted by it, or cast it away and embrace it's opposite.
 

GeoFee

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Interesting evening in Winnipeg. Blizzard conditions and no power since ten last evening. Just been trounced by Barbara in a game Scrabble by candlelight.
 

Mendalla

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Interesting evening in Winnipeg. Blizzard conditions and no power since ten last evening. Just been trounced by Barbara in a game Scrabble by candlelight.
Sends me back to the family cottage days. The grid in Haliburton County, especially the cottage areas, wasn't great (probably still isn't) and we lost power at least once every time we went up, usually due to thunderstorms. We would often end up playing cards using the old kerosene lamps Grandad had stashed away in the attic for light. One of our favorite games was, ironically, called Blackout.
 

chansen

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The question really is, to move this away from discussing George specifically, who chooses our labels, us or others? Ideally, we do. If George chooses not to use the label "Christian" himself, then that's his right. We may not agree, but we can't force him to use it.
I agree that we choose our labels. I don't think George is lying - I think George is giving up and letting the idiots take the mantle.
 

Pavlos Maros

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Ritafee said:
Pavlos Maros said:
No. not in the least nor would I want authority over a insincere person.
Well whether you want it or not ... you have authority only over your own person.
Lol. What? Lol.
Ritafee said:
Pavlos Maros said:
No, I don't make claims.
What do you call these?
I run a business that requires critical rational thought.
I employ no people with religious/spiritual back grounds or affiliation.
I am interested in what makes them tick.
I know why they believe in magic.

Location: Bedfordshire, England.
Religious Identification: None
Religious Group: None
Gender Identification: Male
Occupation: Scientific research business owner
Lol. Facts. A claim if you didn't know is to assert that something is the case, typically without providing evidence or proof. These all have evidence. You do need to re-school yourself. I could say the same of you, however that would bring me down to your childish level.

"Do you even exist, you claim you do". That is essentially what you are saying. That's how childish you come across. Please try intelligent discourse Rita. You don't appear stupid that way.
Hi,
To make a claim is to “state or assert that something is the case, typically without providing evidence or proof.”
See George gets it Rita.
You have claimed that I am a liar and that I am insincere, with no substantial evidence or proof.
You did that all yourself George, by making foolish claims. the onus is yours not mine I've just called you out on yours.
You seem to prefer dismissing perspectives not congruent with your belief, rather than engaging in rational dialogue seeking truth.
George
Did that over the last couple of years. This last claim of yours just tipped it over the edge.

As Mandalla says lets get this back to discussions on Djinn
 

Luce NDs

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Aren't you baffled by all the facts about intangible things like thoughts ... for all we know we don't know anything about which ones are which ... due t the emotional sways!

Yet there are those that declare they know about everything ... and some of us slide along to observe!

One might learn in the light ... observing can be so humbling and you can have fun with what isn't known! Thus unknown god-play!

There's even literature that tells us to respect these unknowns because they could be other than what we thought to be facts ... they alter with time!
 

GeoFee

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Not sure if there is a direct connection between the words jinn and jingoism. It seems our present world situation is pretty much infected with attitudes prone to division and conflict.

“Jinni, plural jinn, also called genie, Arabic jinnī, in Arabic mythology, a supernatural spirit below the level of angels and devils. Ghūl (treacherous spirits of changing shape), ʿifrīt (diabolic, evil spirits), and siʿlā (treacherous spirits of invariable form) constitute classes of jinn.”

“jingoism. ... Jingoism comes from the word jingo, the nickname for a group of British people who always wanted to go to war to prove the superiority of Britain. Now we use jingoism for that kind of aggressive, chauvinistic behavior in any country, or for things intended to stir up war-thirst and blind patriotism.
 

Luce NDs

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Not sure if there is a direct connection between the words jinn and jingoism. It seems our present world situation is pretty much infected with attitudes prone to division and conflict.

“Jinni, plural jinn, also called genie, Arabic jinnī, in Arabic mythology, a supernatural spirit below the level of angels and devils. Ghūl (treacherous spirits of changing shape), ʿifrīt (diabolic, evil spirits), and siʿlā (treacherous spirits of invariable form) constitute classes of jinn.”

“jingoism. ... Jingoism comes from the word jingo, the nickname for a group of British people who always wanted to go to war to prove the superiority of Britain. Now we use jingoism for that kind of aggressive, chauvinistic behavior in any country, or for things intended to stir up war-thirst and blind patriotism.
Some cowboy hero had a sidekick called Jingles! Might ring someone's bells!
 

Seeler

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I dunno. I've been chivvied on here for suggesting that chansen appears more Christian to me, based on his behaviour, than many a "Christian" I've known here and elsewhere. I self-identify as Christian, as much as anything to avoid confusing people who observe that I spend much of my spare time, energy and money in a building with a very large cross on its roof....
.
I'm sorry that I am late getting to this thread. this is my response to the above quote, and to the question of whether someone is lying when they self identify as Christian or not. It depends on what your definition of Christian is.

For many the definition is very narrow. A Christian is someone who has been born again – depending on their definition of what born-again means.
For many others the definition depends upon believe and/or baptism. It involves confessing that Jesus is the only son of God, for God in the flesh, the third part of the Trinity. It often involves atonement theology – believe in our original sin and in Jesus saving us from sin by his sacrificial death on the cross.
And still others, myself included, have a low Christology. We go back to original terms used in the Bible, such as "the Jesus follower" or "followers of the Way 'of Jesus'" they are more interested in what Jesus taught and the example he set than in what people believed about him.

For me, I generally let people self identify whether or not they consider themselves to be Christian. Since I don't believe in some far-off coming again, or in the traditional heaven and hell that you go to after you die, but rather in the realm of God that i is near at hand, growing among us on earth in the here and now. I believe that we follow Christ best when we love one another and recognize our kinship with all the world and those who dwell there on. I think that makes me panentheistic.
 
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Ritafee

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As Mandalla says lets get this back to discussions on Djinn
Lol. Facts. A claim if you didn't know is to assert that something is the case, typically without providing evidence or proof. These all have evidence.
(I employ no people with religious/spiritual back grounds or affiliation.
I am interested in what makes them tick.
I know why they believe in magic. )
Claiming that you know why 'they' believe in magic seems to me like a bit of magical thinking on your own part. Perhaps that is the jinn in you.
 

Pavlos Maros

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Pavlos Maros said:
Pavlos Maros said:
Lol. Facts. A claim if you didn't know is to assert that something is the case, typically without providing evidence or proof. These all have evidence.
(I employ no people with religious/spiritual back grounds or affiliation.
I am interested in what makes them tick.
I know why they believe in magic but cant understand how some can come to their senses and some cant. It is a quandary. We all appear to see and hear the same things yet!)
Claiming that you know why 'they' believe in magic seems to me like a bit of magical thinking on your own part. Perhaps that is the jinn in you.
Lol. You still don't seem to understand the difference between knowledge and a claim. Lol. Why do you insist in making yourself appear a fool. And why do you continuing to quote mine, there I've fixed it for you. As you like to get the last word, this won't end here, you will continue to put up inane posts trying to win. Have at it. Rotflmho. Sorry Mendalla she could not leave it and she still wont.
 

Luce NDs

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How would people that lean towards total freedom of expression of desire ... ever learn anything beyond desire?

Imagine the thoughts about such strange things that go on in obscure dimensions ...
 

Luce NDs

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If the mind is an abstract thing ... could the imagination be oppressed subversively by gods?

Thus the ancient label attributed due to Sous La ... the ephraim side of the conjuration. Some ladies have been led to believe it is not mainly desirable for the ephraim 'd portion to process anything ... thus nothing!

Tis an old standard that I was led to direct some cognizance toward ... nothing ... as something to be fulfilled. This may differ as divine in the absolute vs the abstract world!

Consider it a psychic event that may pass in many communities without note!

Is there anything as effective in war and conflict than gods? The devil may back off and pick up the pieces ... use the logs to build dams as a curse to what used to flow there ... eager beavers as a icon of coolish LANs ...
 

Luce NDs

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I've been told the great psyche is something beyond humanity ... and that may be true.

I don't know as I've never been given a larger view of life as powers restrict my powers of reasoning!

Power dost confine ... corrupt and all that! Gets us into tight spots ... like running out of environment and surroundings ... no matter what shape they are ... even formless! These may be sandblasted!
 

revjohn

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As a colleague of GeoFee and long-time debate partner.

I find him more difficult to understand than dishonest.

George may not describe himself as a Christian. Others might and others (speaking more for myself at the moment) do.

I empathize with George's rationale. I agree with Chansen, abducating the term gives the win to those who abuse it. It isn't my place to dictate which qualifiers George uses for himself nor is it George's place to forbid me from describing what I see when I engage him.

George loves metaphor. I prefer to be more concrete. In the past I have compared him to a shotgun. It hits the target and a lot more than the target. I have also likened him to poetry while I prefer prose.

We sometimes disagree mostly by degree and not by kind.

And the disagreement is typically honest even if it is circuitous. I find myself examining areas I would never have travelled.

I have had other longtime conversation partners that dragged me thither and yon who never appreciated the journey or noticed that it was disconnected.

George tries to keep a definite path even if it is not the quickest route.

I find no guile in him.
 

Luce NDs

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The Road Less Travelled is written by a psychic neurologist type of science! Stoics don't believe is such essence ... they resemble djinn ... Areii'n ghosts? So much cloud and fuzz to examine ... its hairy!

Areii is an obscure word too!
 

chansen

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John, once again, shares my position in a better and more friendly way. George is difficult to understand. Whether this is on purpose or not, reading George's posts can be a bit of a slog, but having a unique and awkward style of communication is almost a prerequisite here. That doesn't make him a liar.

George's abandonment the term "Christian" is worrying, because the people who would seize on that are not the people I think of as good Christians. Christianity is overflowing with evil and stupid, and that's the main reason I mock it, because it's fun with a purpose. But I do try to give Christians their due when they deserve it, and we can't have the well-meaning Christians just handing the word to the a**holes and walking away. Nothing positive will remain.
 

GeoFee

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Hi,
We sometimes disagree mostly by degree and not by kind.
I have always appreciated our conversations. You have the ability to respond to my thinking with your thinking in a respectful manner. Dialogue opens the way to a more comprehensive, if not absolute, insight regarding elusive truth. This in contrast with those, both theist and atheist, who prefer dismissing others rather than engaging them.

I have always struggled to use language in a way that questions fixed assumptions and opens to new possibility. This presents a challenge to those who prefer conventional arrangements of grammar and syntax. This Sunday I will share my insights specific to Jacob wrestling with an angel in the expectation of obtaining a blessing (benefit). My basic assumption has it that persisting in the struggle for truth is not easy work. It requires a fair degree of patience and determination. I am only 69 but am beginning to realize the hopes of my earlier years. That which hinders me in my daily living is falling away. That which helps is coming into clear focus.

I understand that there is one life present in us all. That one life is divided by many inherited and appropriated commitments. Our human challenge is to overcome the habits of division and accusation in the hope of obtaining unity essential to our common well being. This not by compromising our convictions but by refining them. Something which you have always helped me with by your insightful challenge to my thinking in this place.

To become a strong wrestler it is helpful to have a strong adversary.

George
 
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