The road to 2020

Luce NDs

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Oh, How many Canadians go hungry? It's over half the population. In most of the world, we're seeing a plundering of the poor (and often the killing of millions of the poor) by the very rich.
Some will call it rich fiction and not beneficial to the tyrants ... and those trending in that tensor ... its Tory land!
 

Mrs.Anteater

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Oh, How many Canadians go hungry? It's over half the population. In most of the world, we're seeing a plundering of the poor (and often the killing of millions of the poor) by the very rich.
Could it be that you meant “ half the population “ in Northern Provinces/ Territories?“?
Because it seems to be around 16% of the overall population. Not that is not a shameful number, but it doesn’t help the argument to exaggerate.
 

Graeme Decarie

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There's no exaggeration. There are lots of sources for this, many created by the federal government. Check the web. A very high proportion of those are killed by malnutrition which, itself, is also often caused by poverty. It's quite true that things are much worse for those in the far North and for native peoples.

I grew up in a highly populated district in which poverty was the rule. We knew, roughly, where the rich and well fed lived. Between them and where we lived was miles of poverty. And every family living in crammed and unheathy housing. I went to a school where having lunch was unusual. And where getting a half pint of milk at school was only for the 'rich' kids. (With one, free pint at the discretion of the teacher, for us
peasantry.)

Our fridge, as in most flats around us, was a windowsill. After supper, the stove went out no matter how cold the night. My parents were so accustomed to that - that when I visited them many years later - and slept in their much improved quarters - I woke up quite frozen in the dark.
It was well below zero out. But it was still his custom to open the windows at night.

And Canada stands second only to Russia in healthy living.
 

Graeme Decarie

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Go to Canada malnutrition. That's where I got my stats Canada figures. And just a few sites below that there are really horrifying figures for the rest of the world that our billionaires are starving to death.

Is that because so many people eat junk food more than anything else? Yes. And the poor commonly eat junk food because it's cheaper and more filling. It's also because our spending on food to help the poor is way below what is required. In fact, most of them never see it.
 

Mrs.Anteater

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Go to Canada malnutrition. That's where I got my stats Canada figures. And just a few sites below that there are really horrifying figures for the rest of the world that our billionaires are starving to death.

Is that because so many people eat junk food more than anything else? Yes. And the poor commonly eat junk food because it's cheaper and more filling. It's also because our spending on food to help the poor is way below what is required. In fact, most of them never see it.
Ok, that’s two different shoes. You were talking about hunger and starving first. Obesity is malnutrition, but not starving.
 

revsdd

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Go to Canada malnutrition. That's where I got my stats Canada figures. And just a few sites below that there are really horrifying figures for the rest of the world that our billionaires are starving to death.

Is that because so many people eat junk food more than anything else? Yes. And the poor commonly eat junk food because it's cheaper and more filling. It's also because our spending on food to help the poor is way below what is required. In fact, most of them never see it.
I googled as you suggested. What I came up with in several studies was that a significant number (the highest I found was 45%) of hospitalized medical and surgical patients are identified as malnourished - not 45% of the entire population. And according to those studies, a good number of those became malnourished because of their hospitalization and various factors that impact patients receiving proper nutrition in hospital settings.
 

Graeme Decarie

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Nor am I talking about obesity. ( Though that's one hell of a problem in Boston. ) What I'm talking about, and what Stats Canada talks about, is death caused by poverty. Starvation does not cause obesity. Check out photos of Ontario Premier Doug Ford to get a line on that. In our Canada, millions die of poverty.

And check that site I wrote to you about - the one that looks at starvation and death all around the world caused by Canadian, American and some European countries look for oil and other natural resources. The starvation and murder inflicted by all of them is beyond our imagination. And that goes back to a Winston Churchill who deliberated starved millions to death in India. And back centuries before that by other of the British upper classes - not to mention all those they allowed to starve to death all over the world.

In the U.S., the Americans both before and after the revolution starved and murdered native peoples to death in one of the great slaughters of world history. And they did it with the blessing of George Washington and the Christian churches. Canada did the same on a smaller scale.

They also starved their own people -and still do. So do we. We give uncountable tax breaks to our wealthy - billions and billions for billionaires. But we pay workers in less than they need to live and eat. Britain at barely a century employed the children of the poor from the age of at 5 at 15 hours a day and next to no money. In Ontario, in the late 1800s, a teen age boy lost his arm in a factory accident. (And he was in no way to blame.) He was immediately sent home (walking on his own) and was fired.

The American poor live in some of the vilest slums I have seen. As in Chicago. Great holes in the roofs, filth everywhere, dangerous drinking water.... almost no hope of any jobs. And, oh, they are dangerous places to live. And the children walk through dangerous streets to their dangerous schools which are desperately underfunded.

The very rich, Canadian and American, children go to expensive private schools - most of which are subsidized by the taxes of the poor and middle class.

Like all the civilizations of at least the last 2000 years, we are ruled by immensely wealthy elites who send the rest of us to get killed so they can get even wealthier.
 

GeoFee

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Those who will not learn from history are fated to repeat it. We are now in the end stage of western civilization. Some prepare for the catastrophe in the wings. The majority are submerged in the rising tide of greed and avarice.
 
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BetteTheRed

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I'm going to disagree here, George. What we are witnessing is the end of the U.S. Empire. I think the Chinese Empire is next and we may as well sit back and see what that looks like.

How this big empire collapse is going to play out amongst the climate crisis and exponential numbers of refugees, it's hard to predict, I think.
 

GeoFee

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I'm going to disagree here, George. What we are witnessing is the end of the U.S. Empire. I think the Chinese Empire is next and we may as well sit back and see what that looks like.

How this big empire collapse is going to play out amongst the climate crisis and exponential numbers of refugees, it's hard to predict, I think.
I hope you are right and I am wrong!
 

Waterfall

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Watched a show on Nova (PBS) recently called "The Violence Paradox" where psychologist Steven Pinker believes human violence is actually declining, and that we are living in one of the most peaceful times in human existence.
Found it interesting and can be downloaded on the Nova site, if curious.
 

Mrs.Anteater

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Oh, How many Canadians go hungry? It's over half the population.
So you are saying more than 18 million Canadians go hungry. Really? Statistics say otherwise.

Then you are talking about malnutrition. Obesity as result of eating unhealthy food is part of the malnutrition stats. That doesn't equal the group of malnourished Canadians with poor people.
And of course, unhealthy eating/ malnourished people end up in hospitals, that’s why a high percentage of people in hospital are malnourished- diabetes, cardiac diseases all results of wrong diets. Still doesn’t mean 100% of malnourished people are poor. Actually, the wealth of society has lead to overeating.
 

Ritafee

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I'm going to disagree here, George. What we are witnessing is the end of the U.S. Empire. I think the Chinese Empire is next and we may as well sit back and see what that looks like.

How this big empire collapse is going to play out amongst the climate crisis and exponential numbers of refugees, it's hard to predict, I think.
I foresee that we are going to need a whole lot of empirical liberation army peace keeping pro-action ...
Liberation Army.jpg
Democracy is coming ...
 

Graeme Decarie

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Mrs. Anteater - Didn't you read the Canadian government statistics that I sent you?
And didn't you understand that obesity is quite common among the poor because of the cheap food they have to live on?

We have senior executives in large corporations who make a million and more a year (and who pay no income tax.) They have employees who get a little over 3,000 a year - and who have to pay income tax to make up for million dollar executives who make more in a coffee break than their employees make in a whole day. And the billionaires make even more while taking a trip to the toilet.

The savagery of our billionaires in Latin America and Africa goes far, far beyond even that - where employees can still be five years old, with long, long hours, often in a dangerous setting, and payment made in pennies. Too bad our news media (most owned by the very wealthy) never
report that.
 

Mrs.Anteater

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Mrs. Anteater - Didn't you read the Canadian government statistics that I sent you?
And didn't you understand that obesity is quite common among the poor because of the cheap food they have to live on?

We have senior executives in large corporations who make a million and more a year (and who pay no income tax.) They have employees who get a little over 3,000 a year - and who have to pay income tax to make up for million dollar executives who make more in a coffee break than their employees make in a whole day. And the billionaires make even more while taking a trip to the toilet.

The savagery of our billionaires in Latin America and Africa goes far, far beyond even that - where employees can still be five years old, with long, long hours, often in a dangerous setting, and payment made in pennies. Too bad our news media (most owned by the very wealthy) never
report that.
Graeme, I see that you are upset about injustice. That’s not new. I agree with you. However, discussion only works on facts. You are coming up with wrong arguments. Not half of all Canadians are starving. However, obesity rate is close to 50%. Not all obese people are poor. Would you agree, that starving and being malnourished, which includes obesity as well as diabetes, are two different things? There is no question that poor people are unhealthier statistically than rich people. But, eating the wrong food doesn’t man you are starving.
I am not sure, what other countries have to do with you arguing that half of Canadas population is starving.
 

Luce NDs

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While we shovel more billions of our money into the pockets of billionaires, Canadians and Americans in the millions are dying of hunger.
What is the best country in the world for making sure it's people are well fed? Surprise! It's Russia.

By world standards for early death by starvation, the U.S. is on a par with ----China. But this is still way, way better than Latin America where death in enforced by U.S. starvation policies. Ditto with Africa which has really appalling death rates - many imposed by the U.S - as in Yemen and Iran and Syria and Palestine.

And how many Canadians can expect a shorter life even by Canadian standards? About 20 million. Of course, it's much, much worse for native peoples in the far north. Almost all of them suffer from starvation and die early.

very few Canadian billionaires die of starvation.
Nos hite Jae Sun ...
 

Luce NDs

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Graeme, I see that you are upset about injustice. That’s not new. I agree with you. However, discussion only works on facts. You are coming up with wrong arguments. Not half of all Canadians are starving. However, obesity rate is close to 50%. Not all obese people are poor. Would you agree, that starving and being malnourished, which includes obesity as well as diabetes, are two different things? There is no question that poor people are unhealthier statistically than rich people. But, eating the wrong food doesn’t man you are starving.
I am not sure, what other countries have to do with you arguing that half of Canadas population is starving.
Tis a maze in given ... that corn sugar has some chiral properties unrecognized in folk that are not aware of the chimera there ... chiral bondage?

Proper process can turn this into gran'ma's remedy ... all Kohl! The dark lady cometh the veil is getting thinner ... hidden missals!
 
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