Mary. Mother of Jesus. Badass!

Jae

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Interesting to contemplate. So I guess Mary's elderly cousin Elizabeth - also pregnant with a first child concurrrent with Mary - would also have been considered a virgin.
The Bible doesn't state that Elizabeth was a virgin when she became pregnant with her first. She and her husband Zacharias were each good before God. Their lifestyle stood God's test. They were made civic goodness' models. They walked in God's laws. In spite of their goodness, they were sad. No child had been given them. Childlessness was a disaster. Elizabeth was barren. God had denied her motherhood. At this time they were both old, beyond the days when they might expect children. They felt this childlessness as a rebuke. The barren were thought cursed. In Genesis 1, God said, "Multiply!" This the Jews urged. They that had no children weren't blessed. So a married couple without children must be cursed.
 

DaisyJane

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If Mary hadn't been a virgin (a person who'd never had sex), Jesus would have been conceived and born in original sin. If that had been the case, he would have been unable to die for the world's sins, because he himself would have been a sinner. It would mean that rescue isn't possible for us and we are all to be condemned. Praise God that this isn't the case. Mary had never had sex, Jesus was born untainted by sin and in time he died for the sins of us all. Amen, glory and hallelujah.
I find it so interesting that sex=sin, and that the mere idea of Mary having sex to conceive Jesus taints forever. Why must the miracle be immaculate conception, other than a society's hangup on female virginity and sex in general? I see so many other possibilities for miracles in the story. I liked Mrs. A miracle of a young girl not being stoned. How about God celebrating a child born in lowly conditions and transforming them into a prophet.

I personally don't buy into the immaculate conception thing. But then I also don't embrace things like original sin, or the need for atonement.
 

DaisyJane

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Bearing and birthing and being the primary caregiver of 10 children is.
Of course it is, Rita. And I would agree that in your mother's case it sounds like she was the epitome of the selfless caregiver. My response is meant to be take more broadly. My point is that we cannot endorse romantic notions of mothering and caring that universally expect women to fall into a role of the unconditional and voluntary caregiver. I resist this notion that people need to align with traditional notions of how a man or a woman is to behave, or live their life.
 
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Jae

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I find it so interesting that sex=sin, and that the mere idea of Mary having sex to conceive Jesus taints forever. Why must the miracle be immaculate conception, other than a society's hangup on female virginity and sex in general? I see so many other possibilities for miracles in the story. I liked Mrs. A miracle of a young girl not being stoned. How about God celebrating a child born in lowly conditions and transforming them into a prophet.

I personally don't buy into the immaculate conception thing. But then I also don't embrace things like original sin, or the need for atonement.
Sex doesn't necessarily equate with sin. Sex at its best is a glorious gift God gave the human race. Through sex, married couples can get closer together and through sex the human race continues. That said, if Jesus had been a product of Mary (who was a sinner) and Joseph (who was a sinner), the result would have been a sinner named Jesus. This is because of original sin, which has been passed down to people since our first ancestors fell from grace in Eden.
 

DaisyJane

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Okay. I follow your logic now. I don't agree with the notion of original sin, but I see where you're coming from.
 
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Mrs.Anteater

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I really liked the idea about virginity that was presented in the article. From what I understood, the word "virgin" did not have the same meaning it has now. All it meant was that the woman had not had children.

How would we view Mary if we made that slight change to her image?
I learned that interpretation/ explanation of the meaning as “ young woman” rather that “ virgin” in bible study of my Catholic church in Berlin some 30 years ago.
 

Jae

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"Through sex, married couples can get closer together....."

Well, let's be honest here, through sex even unmarried couples can "get closer".
I guess that's true. However, I trust that the people God wanted to get closer thru sex were married couples. I see sex between unmarried people as not in God's design for humanity.
 

Luce NDs

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Without secular intercourse could people blow their minds and come up with crazy ideas?

God gave this as a gift of love to allow blackouts to what pain childbirth can can bring when passing the gates and causing longer disruptions ...

That's life extension as a stretch!
 

Luce NDs

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I guess that's true. However, I trust that the people God wanted to get closer thru sex were married couples. I see sex between unmarried people as not in God's design for humanity.
And the royals of Europe did the business of sex to strengthen monarchal wealth systems WS for short as omega odds ... thus daughters were traded off ...
 

Luce NDs

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I see marriage as a human social construct with no basis in nature.
Thus an unnatural bondage and discipline in odd traditions? Poor dreams without graphics ... pornographics as edited down ... best in the dark as some don't like to be watched ... too much like a test! Guina syndrome ...
 

BetteTheRed

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nowhere in the bible does it say sex is a sin, the abuse of sex is sin, aka porn
I find no mention in the Bible of pornography? The only clear sexual sin I can see is adultery, and that's really more a "property" violation than a sexual sin. There seems to be universal disapproval of prostitution in both the Hebrew and Christian scriptures, particularly of the pagan "temple prostitute", although Jesus doesn't seem to have anything particular to say about the rental of body parts.
 

DaisyJane

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I find no mention in the Bible of pornography? The only clear sexual sin I can see is adultery, and that's really more a "property" violation than a sexual sin. There seems to be universal disapproval of prostitution in both the Hebrew and Christian scriptures, particularly of the pagan "temple prostitute", although Jesus doesn't seem to have anything particular to say about the rental of body parts.

Agreed.
 

unsafe

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from got questions ---What does the Bible say about pornography?
https://www.gotquestions.org/pornography-Bible.html

The three main categories of sin are the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life (1 John 2:16). Pornography definitely causes us to lust after flesh, and it is undeniably a lust of the eyes. Pornography definitely does not qualify as one of the things we are to think about, according to Philippians 4:8. Pornography is addictive (1 Corinthians 6:12; 2 Peter 2:19) and destructive (Proverbs 6:25-28; Ezekiel 20:30; Ephesians 4:19). Lusting after other people in our minds, which is the essence of pornography, is offensive to God (Matthew 5:28). When habitual devotion to pornography characterizes a person’s life and he/she continues in sin without seeking help, making no attempt to stop or feeling no desire to change his/her behavior, it demonstrates the person may not be saved (1 Corinthians 6:9-12).
 

blackbelt1961

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I find no mention in the Bible of pornography? The only clear sexual sin I can see is adultery, and that's really more a "property" violation than a sexual sin. There seems to be universal disapproval of prostitution in both the Hebrew and Christian scriptures, particularly of the pagan "temple prostitute", although Jesus doesn't seem to have anything particular to say about the rental of body parts.
what @unsafe said, she beat me too it
 

Luce NDs

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Peddling of body parts from the human psyche can be an adult activity that should be entered after great learning ... however this too is diminished in temples of not knowing ...

In patriarchal systems the dotters were often sold off to strengthen family resources! Thus the command to dot your ayes and cross the tees when in a gothic stance as some see the great darkness ... often posey as denied prose by those addicted to the prescribed waves and ringers!
 

DaisyJane

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from got questions ---What does the Bible say about pornography?
https://www.gotquestions.org/pornography-Bible.html

The three main categories of sin are the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life (1 John 2:16). Pornography definitely causes us to lust after flesh, and it is undeniably a lust of the eyes. Pornography definitely does not qualify as one of the things we are to think about, according to Philippians 4:8. Pornography is addictive (1 Corinthians 6:12; 2 Peter 2:19) and destructive (Proverbs 6:25-28; Ezekiel 20:30; Ephesians 4:19). Lusting after other people in our minds, which is the essence of pornography, is offensive to God (Matthew 5:28). When habitual devotion to pornography characterizes a person’s life and he/she continues in sin without seeking help, making no attempt to stop or feeling no desire to change his/her behavior, it demonstrates the person may not be saved (1 Corinthians 6:9-12).
There's a heck of a lot of eisegesis going on there. Those passages extol Christians to avoid sinful thoughts, but don't say that pornography is the sinful thought per se. You are saying pornography is the sinful thought. Matthew 5:28 brings us back to adultery and coveting that which is not yours - not pornography.

I would ask you to take any porn conversations to a new thread. This one is about badass Mary.
 
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